Is There Evidence for Creationism? Show it to us.

a reply to: TzarChasm

do you have any sources in english?

Try Myths from Mesopotamia by Stephanie Dalley, 1989, Oxford University Press. Available in paperback.

a reply to: Astyanax

There is also this:
etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk...
Contrary to the claims, Sumerian texts are not really subject to interpretation. There are many who can sight read cuneiform. Sitchin was not one of those.

I enjoy the tales of Ninkasi.
All hail the goddess of beer!

If you would just have the motivation to know yourself with meditation or some other tool like various substances, like some other member mentioned, then you would be certain of a fact that there is deeper reality and our material world is not all, it is only a drop in the ocean if infinity and evolution is a part of it.

The problem is that people wont recognize the stuff that apparently don't exists for our senses. For instance, everybody dreams but rarely there are people interested in them, even though each dream is unique and there is always some meaning behind it. If you contemplate about it. And when you start to lucid dream you are one step away from astral travel...this is real and can be experienced and this would and is your own proof that rabbit whole goes deep!

To be ignorant of this side of your being is your own ignorance because you didn't not even bother to try earnestly for yourself and are just trying to relay on other opinions, evolution or creationism alike. And that is the major problem I have with people who defend any thing, everything else than your own experience is just blind belief!

Then there are very old books and other text that are explaining energy systems in human body which are present and can be experienced if you would only try! Again another proof that there are things outside of our understanding and outside of what machines can detect AND that ancient people know something which we mostly deny today.

Please, be mindful, just breathe and drop all thoughts and beliefs and try to meditate and everyone will get proof, it is "waiting" for you to discover it!

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: TheChrome

a CIRCLE is a one-dimensional shape. like this: o

an ORB or GLOBE is like a bubble.

The Bible saying the "circle of the earth" does not indicate they knew it was a globe.

That's just a flimsy argument. What is your interpretation? The earth is a flat circular disk? Whatever...

a reply to: UniFinity

That's all great information and I've experienced a couple of those things personally myself. I've witnessed what I perceived as deeper meaning to reality too. However, those were my own personal experiences for one thing and I don't expect anyone else to share them like I did. But more important than that, they still didn't have anything to do with Creationism being valid.

Are we all on the same page here even??? This is about Creationism and evidence for it. Not deeper meanings to reality or your own head trips or whatever.

My guess is that since this topic is just wandering around now and nobody has anything to provide as evidence then Creationism can now be classified as it's been already which is false or at best unsupported opinion.

originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: UniFinity

That's all great information and I've experienced a couple of those things personally myself. I've witnessed what I perceived as deeper meaning to reality too. However, those were my own personal experiences for one thing and I don't expect anyone else to share them like I did. But more important than that, they still didn't have anything to do with Creationism being valid.

Are we all on the same page here even??? This is about Creationism and evidence for it. Not deeper meanings to reality or your own head trips or whatever.

My guess is that since this topic is just wandering around now and nobody has anything to provide as evidence then Creationism can now be classified as it's been already which is false or at best unsupported opinion.

I disagree. I will borrow from another thread and mention the research of J. Craig Venter. He suggests that not all life here on earth share the same DNA. There are multiple forms of life on the planet, and they did not evolve from a single source. All evidence point to life being created. There are no links within the fossil record to prove otherwise, and plenty of evidence within DNA research to debunk the false notion of evolution.

originally posted by: TheChrome

I disagree. I will borrow from another thread and mention the research of J. Craig Venter. He suggests that not all life here on earth share the same DNA. There are multiple forms of life on the planet, and they did not evolve from a single source. All evidence point to life being created. There are no links within the fossil record to prove otherwise, and plenty of evidence within DNA research to debunk the false notion of evolution.

Great. Got a link or something??

Now, let's say that the DNA is different. Why does that mean it was created??? Maybe it just developed different than our own DNA. Maybe it's from a different planet or something and got here through panspermia or something. Multiple forms of life on this planet, even with different DNA doesn't just automatically mean Creationism. You can't just make that jump to something because something is different.

That's what's wrong with Creationists. You just find any reason to say, "See, Creationism." But that doesn't make sense. You're just shoving it in there before you even know what you're talking about. Why does it have to mean it was Created that way??? If there was something just creating new life forms already completed why even have DNA in the first place or evolutionary processes happening??? Things would just pop into existence already complete and ready to go like magic.

Please elaborate on all the data in DNA research that debunks Evolution if you would??? Just because you make a claim doesn't make it true. All you people ever do is just make a claim that's unsupported, then right to the conclusion that Evolution is all false and expect everyone to just go "Ok." Doesn't work like that.

**Update: Ok, I looked him up myself. Turns out he discovered a new Domain in our tree of life. Pretty cool, but nothing to suggest it was just Created magically by some creator.

He is however on the verge of creating life himself using synthetic DNA or something. That should make things interesting. I suppose you could call that Creation. But it's a scientist doing it. That's still a long way from being some kind of Universal Creator though.

Maybe you should define what you mean by a "Creator" so we know exactly what it is your talking about. Creationism as far as I know is talking about a Universal Creator Being, basically a God. So that's what I'm assuming you're also talking about.

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: TheChrome

I disagree. I will borrow from another thread and mention the research of J. Craig Venter. He suggests that not all life here on earth share the same DNA. There are multiple forms of life on the planet, and they did not evolve from a single source. All evidence point to life being created. There are no links within the fossil record to prove otherwise, and plenty of evidence within DNA research to debunk the false notion of evolution.

Great. Got a link or something??

Now, let's say that the DNA is different. Why does that mean it was created??? Maybe it just developed different than our own DNA. Maybe it's from a different planet or something and got here through panspermia or something. Multiple forms of life on this planet, even with different DNA doesn't just automatically mean Creationism. You can't just make that jump to something because something is different.

That's what's wrong with Creationists. You just find any reason to say, "See, Creationism." But that doesn't make sense. You're just shoving it in there before you even know what you're talking about. Why does it have to mean it was Created that way??? If there was something just creating new life forms already completed why even have DNA in the first place or evolutionary processes happening??? Things would just pop into existence already complete and ready to go like magic.

Please elaborate on all the data in DNA research that debunks Evolution if you would??? Just because you make a claim doesn't make it true. All you people ever do is just make a claim that's unsupported, then right to the conclusion that Evolution is all false and expect everyone to just go "Ok." Doesn't work like that.

No it's a matter of science. The statistical chance of a single protein needed for life forming randomly, is 10 to the 113th power. 10 to the 113th power is more than the estimated atoms in the universe!

10 to the 50th power is considered a mathematical impossibility.

About 2000 proteins are needed for life, therefore not only would one protein have to form (10 to the 113th power chance) but around 2000. The statistics are astronomical!

Next, if there is more than one form of life on earth, this process would have to take place more than once.

Does this seem very logical to you?

a reply to: TheChrome

The statistical chance of a single protein needed for life forming randomly, is 10 to the 113th power.

Please show your work.

10 to the 50th power is considered a mathematical impossibility.

You know what? Besides demonstrating that something can happen, probabilities don't mean crap after the fact.
www.dailymail.co.uk...

a reply to: TheChrome

**Update: Ok, I looked him up myself. Turns out he discovered a new Domain in our tree of life. Pretty cool, but nothing to suggest it was just Created magically by some creator.

He is however on the verge of creating life himself using synthetic DNA or something. That should make things interesting. I suppose you could call that Creation. But it's a scientist doing it. That's still a long way from being some kind of Universal Creator though.

Maybe you should define what you mean by a "Creator" so we know exactly what it is your talking about. Creationism as far as I know is talking about a Universal Creator Being, basically a God. So that's what I'm assuming you're also talking about.

You're wasting your time with this thread. We all know there is no evidence for Creationism or there would be at least one strong argument in it's favour but there are none.

The problem with asking for evidence is that you are indirectly asking Creationists to question their faith. They don't want to have to think, they just want to stick to their blind faith.

It's hard for a person to break from a lifetime of indoctrination which has programmed their brain to reject common sense, logic and evidence.

I've found it's best just to leave them to their delusion as long as they don't try force it on others.

I think, and this is my plain opinion from what I've read about illuminati or elitist conspiracies, I'm pretty sure they put evolution in a distort way in a world they made of belief to make conflict between us, just like the religions.

You know, to divide is to rule and unity is strengh. And let's connect the elitists with the theory of Annunaki, then they would be here to assure that we get the gold (just want to point that since some time, we see a lot of elitists changing their money for gold). Nibiru make an appearance every 3600 years, and we are at the end of the cycle. To control as much slaves as human on the planet, you need really strong belief, and then make this belief confront another one.

If the belief is a religion, then you get holy wars. If it's ideologies, then you can get civil wars. What wars taught us, is that it's surely one of the best distraction you can do. Since everyone is looking and hating at others for futile reasons, they can sit on their long chair and watch us kill each others just like a TV show!

I'll finish by saying that we should stop fighting each others and face what I feel as the real enemy, our "masters". But then again, you have the right to believe anything you want, I won't put sources about elitists or illuminati first because it's so easy to get sources on google or else and second because I'm not here to convince anyone, I just want to open the path to those who was still unknown (shouldn't be a lot though, since these conspiracies aren't new).

On this, have a nice day!!

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: MrConspiracy

I can't categorically prove we came from another species entirely.

You don't have to. But you can prove that living things change over time and that those changes add up.
We have observed species change from one to another. From one that can breed with its own to one which no longer can breed with that species. To one which can only breed with others like itself. Through mutation.

Ok, now it's time for you to do this:

"You don't have to" ..... but to answer whether or not WE are the product of evolution, we kinda do.

originally posted by: Pouilleux
I think, and this is my plain opinion from what I've read about illuminati or elitist conspiracies, I'm pretty sure they put evolution in a distort way in a world they made of belief to make conflict between us, just like the religions.

The only conflict is between the creationist anti-science cults and the rest of the civilised world. Not only that, but they're a marginalised minority. It's only in a forum like this one that you get a prominent vocal majority of creationist cultists. In reality, they're not even given so much as a second thought. Well, outside of America, at least.

America, you can put a man on the moon but around half of your population are scientifically illiterate religious fundamentalists. You got some 'splaining to do!

a reply to: mOjOm

How do you know they don't have anything to do with it? Did you explore them fully and understand completely the astral plane and physical plane and their correspondence to creator? I see you have a merkaba for avatar so you probably know something...but to conclude like you just did it seems very naive, where is your exploring spirit which is thirsty for truth?

Well some ancient people supposedly did explore our reality. There exists very old text like book of the dead and a lot of old texts from Indian, Tibetan, Japan, China, native american... - text from many masters who devoted whole life to this and from their point of view reality is far different than it is to us - normal ignorant people.

I am just saying that in spirituality there is a thing which many people of science don't want to understand. Spirituality is subjective and you must get your own experiences, because each person varies and is on different path because of past experiences (in this or previous life).

How?
the easiest way is to study ALL religions and learn from it. Take what suits you and drop the rest and then after a while come back and read it again and take more ... for they are just different paths to the same thing, the creator! And it reveals to you only so much as you are open to understand between the lines, so many text are to be read more than once.

And the best thing is that everything can be proven/experienced by yourself, spirituality is the only area where the student can become IT and is not something which can be only learned and because of that is the hardest path to thread wholly, you must be confident, kind, moral, pure...beliefs are useful for individual to grow but after a while they to must be dropped, as they are only limiting the truth, which just IS, and no words can do that IS justice, there is no description only silence and bliss. And this can be experienced and many are living like that even today, but are hidden and they don't seek attention, for the one who wants the truth will get it on your own, as nobody can do it for you!

a reply to: UniFinity

So, on your exploratory voyages across the astral plane, have you come across any evidence for creationism? Answer truthfully.

a reply to: spygeek

There is no physical evidence for creationism, anywhere.
There is no physical evidence for god, not even one out of the 3000+ gods that are worshiped in thousands of religions around the world.
There are no miracles like the ones Jesus apparently performed 2000 years ago.
No holy book is proof of any god and the one I have read extensively (the Bible) is very inaccurate.
There's also no evidence for intelligent design by alien civilizations.

Do we know how life started? Not yet, but the more science advances the more we learn and we are able to fill gaps in our knowledge. We may not know how life started on Earth, but there is certainly no evidence whatsoever of any divine being or aliens creating us.

S&F OP!

Okay , here is a wall of text ,
from a scientist,
that proves intelligent design,
from the very beginning ;
and also puts the brakes on evolution .
Please read it , for your own sake.

www.cosmicfingerprints.com...

New Scientific Evidence for the Existence of God

"The Discovery of the Century" - Stephen Hawking

I want to take you back to April 23, 1992.
On that day, a discovery was announced that, in the words of the
British physicist Steven Hawking, “…is the discovery of the century,
if not of all time.” This is remarkable because Steven Hawking has
a reputation for understatement. “What we have found is evidence
of the birth of the Universe. It's like looking at God.” I thought that
you might be curious of the equation that convinced
Albert Einstein that God exists, that God created the universe.
This equation falls under the theory of general relativity.
For those of you who have a background in calculus, you'll recognize
this term here as an expression for acceleration.

What Einstein had done was to drive the equation for the acceleration
of the entire universe. On the other side of the equation, you see
four physical constants. I don't really have to explain them to you,
except to point out that they all have positive values.

Four well-known physical constants with positive values, yet there's
a minus sign in front. That immediately tells us that the entire
universe experiences negative acceleration. The universe is decelerating.
That was a tremendous challenge to the theology of his day because
in the 200 years previous to Albert Einstein's theory of general
relativity, academic scientific society was operating on the premise
that the universe was static.

Belief in a Static Universe Led to Darwinian Evolution

Frederick Burnham, a science historian, said in response to this discovery,
“The idea that God created the Universe is a more respectable hypothesis
today than at any time in the last 100 years.”

As Einstein pointed out, the significance is that the universe has this moment
of pin pulling. It has a beginning. Through the principle of positive fact,
if the universe has a beginning, it must have a beginner, hence the existence
...of God.

To his dying day, Einstein held to his belief that as the result of the
verification of his theory of General Relativity, God exists.
(Good book on Einstein's extensive discussions of religion and theology:
Einstein and Religion: Physics and Theology by Max Jammer -Ed )
God created the universe and God is intelligent.

evolution debunked-www.discovery.org...
Just saying .... look (it) up ~!!!!

a reply to: spygeek
How broad a brush are you throwing when you say "creationist?"

I don't think Creationists/ID'rs deny that you can cause evolution to happen through breeding dogs, or that it happen in the wild through natural selection. I haven't met any who do, nor have I met any who want to throw away modern science, modern biology, or immunizations. In short, I haven't met any creationists who blanket-deny evolution as you suggest. In fact, Michael Behe, who wrote Darwin's Black Box, believes in evolution from the first life to the human being, IIRC.

If you're actually so unfamiliar with the creationist arguments (and the ID arguments) then you probably haven't *actually* been looking for proof. I haven't read Darwin's Black Box, but if by all accounts that's where to begin if you're interested in the holes in evolutionary theory. But then again, it might not be Creationist enough for you

a reply to: TheChrome

Actually the Bible pretty consistently describes the Earth's cosmology as consistent with how the audience conceived of the world at the time. It's nothing like a globe.