It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
The femme fatale is one of the great archetypes in American cinema history. Translated from French, the term quite literally means “deadly woman.” These sexy temptresses bewitch men and lure them into dangerous, often lethal, situations. They manipulate us through our lust and desire. They use us to murder their husbands, hide their misdeeds and ultimately take the wrap for any crimes committed.
Despite the fact that these women are out to destroy all men, we can’t help ourselves -- they have us under their spell.
Link to article
One of the key double agents was a woman - one who more resembled Fleming's concept of the Bond girl.
Codenamed the Queen of Hearts, David Scherr describes their first encounter:
"This was a woman in her 30S whose dress, mannerisms speech and general appearance made her a rather seedy but not unattractive imitation of the seductive female spy of the thrillerette type," he recalls.
"She sat down, crossed her legs (adjusting her skirt to reveal them to the best advantage), slowly lit a cigarette, inhaled, breathed out the smoke in a furtive fashion, looking down her long aquiline nose at the same time, and then smiled across at her interrogator: 'I am the Queen of Hearts. Who are you?'"
She was an important member of the Medellin Cartel but developed a bad rapport with the Cartel when she had the niece of the Ochoa family of the Medellin Cartel, Marta Saldarriaga Ochoa, murdered in order to not pay for a shipment of coc aine delivered by Marta. Her plan was to say she never received the shipment and that the young lady disappeared with it. After the young woman's body was found on a rural south Florida road, it became open season on Griselda and she was subsequently "on the run".
"femme fatale" Hollywood archetype
originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: Profusion
"femme fatale" Hollywood archetype
Cultural myopia much?
The words femme fatale are French, not American. That should provide a clue that Hollywood is not the origin of the type.
Etymological dictionary
Perhaps you've heard of such famous historical femmes fatales as Cleopatra, Zenobia of Palmyra and Mata Hari?
I wanted to limit the discussion in this thread to the "femme fatale" Hollywood archetype only
originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: Profusion
I wanted to limit the discussion in this thread to the "femme fatale" Hollywood archetype only
If something is limited by place and time, it is not an archetype.
The femme fatale is one aspect of the archetypal feminine as described by Jung. More here
Hollywood invented nothing. It is a profoundly unoriginal place, one where innovations go to die.
archetype
Psychoanalysis (In Jungian psychology) a primitive mental image inherited from the earliest human ancestors, and supposed to be present in the collective unconscious.
www.oxforddictionaries.com...
Universal vs. Cultural Archetypes
What I am calling cultural archetypes, also referred to as ‘stock characters,’ are the types of characters that commonly inhabit our stories/movies. The Pirate, The Heroine, The Punk, The Dog-Catcher and a few hundred thousand more, are all examples of these characters.
germansgaffes.wordpress.com...
keep in mind tho archtypes and tropes existed before Hollywood and were around in ancient greek plays for example.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
I'm pretty sure there isn't a single Hollywood trope that exists in reality. Pretty much all of them are one-dimensional caricatures of how Hollywood thinks people act.
yeah there are different archtypes because there are different types of people but I think the ycome down to good or evil. there are many evil women hence the femme fatale arhtype. there good females hence the hooker with a heart of gold archtype. hooker part is cuz no one is really purely good. same with men. Not many fictional stories with a purely good protagonist in it, bible is one I can think of but most are flawed or antiheroes.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: HorusChrist
Ok, fair enough, but even then the archetypes are still too one dimensional to be true. Sure we can all find examples of people acting like an archetype, but then again on other days we can find where they may act like another archetype.
In reality, archetypes are just molds that a story's writer can use to quickly flesh out the behavior of his character without worrying about too much depth. This isn't necessarily a bad thing though. Real humans have WAY more depth and trying to include even close to that amount of depth for even ONE character in your story would result in the story being way to long and likely disjointed.
originally posted by: HorusChrist
yeah there are different archtypes because there are different types of people but I think the ycome down to good or evil. there are many evil women hence the femme fatale arhtype. there good females hence the hooker with a heart of gold archtype. hooker part is cuz no one is really purely good. same with men. Not many fictional stories with a purely good protagonist in it, bible is one I can think of but most are flawed or antiheroes.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: HorusChrist
Ok, fair enough, but even then the archetypes are still too one dimensional to be true. Sure we can all find examples of people acting like an archetype, but then again on other days we can find where they may act like another archetype.
In reality, archetypes are just molds that a story's writer can use to quickly flesh out the behavior of his character without worrying about too much depth. This isn't necessarily a bad thing though. Real humans have WAY more depth and trying to include even close to that amount of depth for even ONE character in your story would result in the story being way to long and likely disjointed.
True altho Jesus wasn't the first and like that says he hijacked it not created it.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: HorusChrist
Actually Jesus created an archetype all by himself. The idea of an outsider with super powers coming and sacrificing himself to save everyone else is actually a VERY common trope. Off the top of my head for characters that fit that trope are: Neo, Superman, and Goku.
Here's a whole page on TV Tropes about it:
Messianic Archetype