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Fascism Is Far Left, Not Far Right on Political Spectrum

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posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 06:49 PM
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a reply to: Semicollegiate

What if he has no money?

Sure you could call it a workhouse but it's still functions as a debtor's prison.




posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 06:55 PM
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originally posted by: Semicollegiate

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: xuenchen
But don't debtor's prisons require government authority?

No.

I'm sure a private system would be used in an AC society.


No, in AC a criminal has to work off his crime, like paying a mortgage. No prisons. Although some boarding houses might specialize in criminals that no one else will rent to.


Yes, the only option in the absence of institutionalized "penitentiaries" (a quaker invention which introduced the idea of serving time, before which jails were simply where you waited for your court appearance) is a victim oriented justice system where recompense for damages would be the goal.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 06:57 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: Semicollegiate

What if he has no money?

Sure you could call it a workhouse but it's still functions as a debtor's prison.


Ideally, it would be up to the victim.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 06:58 PM
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a reply to: Gryphon66


Why must these selected political systems be graphed in some way?


Why not?

Everybody is different. Graphs work for some, farce works for Lefties.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:16 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Gryphon66


However, what cannot be denied, and what has been pointed out time after time in post after post, both systems required unquestioning obedience to the State which is and has been more of a traditional "Right Wing" idea than a Left one.


I would have to agree. But then again the social darwinism, the eugenics, and the romanticism are undeniably left wing notions.


The rhetoric might be right, I'm not sure it matters what is said to the citizens, but the enforcement is all Left.

When the original right went left, about 1896, the voting turn out started to drop off. It has dropped off steadily since then, when the right got forced left by banking and monetary policy. All choices favored inflationary money.

Voter Turnout 1828 - 1984



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:36 PM
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originally posted by: greencmp
Ideally, it would be up to the victim.

Maybe I lost track of the thread of the discussion, and it's my fault for bringing up AC, but we are talking about the government in a minarchist society.

The bill collector in that case might be able to throw you in jail.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:40 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: Gryphon66

Ah yes but Marx emphasized it 100%.

And all the Marxist governments endorse it wholeheartedly don't they.

Yeah but he stole the idea from Adam Smith:

The subjects of every state ought to contribute towards the support of the government, as nearly as possible, in proportion to their respective abilities; that is, in proportion to the revenue which they respectively enjoy under the protection of the state.


An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations


Thanks for the info.
I haven't done all of the reading.

The Austrian school places the first work on economics in Salamanca 16th century. It ties in with Christian Theology, they were Scholastics. The Conquistadors brought so much gold and silver back to Spain that there was gold inflation. The price of gold dropped for years. The Salamanca School figured out how inflation is related to increased money without increased production.

Anyway, Adam Smith has an OK rating. He was a Mercantilist, which means government granted monoplies on all major industries.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:41 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: greencmp
Ideally, it would be up to the victim.

Maybe I lost track of the thread of the discussion, and it's my fault for bringing up AC, but we are talking about the government in a minarchist society.

The bill collector in that case might be able to throw you in jail.


Yeah, we are beginning to mix conversations if not metaphors. If the bill is big enough, maybe?

There might be a temporary "jail" in an AC too to house suspects until such time as they can be arraigned. It could be the basketball court over the weekend or someone's house if they were nice.

My overall point is that, in most communities, people adequately police themselves already. AC or minarchist, I suspect the process would not be dissimilar.
edit on 28-8-2015 by greencmp because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:49 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: Semicollegiate

What if he has no money?

Sure you could call it a workhouse but it's still functions as a debtor's prison.


Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

Repaying a crime is not really a debt.

Normal debt defaults are worked into the interest rate, and record keeping about borrowers.

And NO fractional reserve banking. All investment is from savings and profits earned from created wealth.
edit on 28-8-2015 by Semicollegiate because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:54 PM
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originally posted by: greencmp
My overall point is that, in most communities, people adequately police themselves already. AC or minarchist, I suspect the process would not be dissimilar.

Sure but we were not talking about private citizens. We were talking about government taxing or charging fees. My point was what difference does it make to call him a bill collector or a tax collector.

That's is where you said that a bill collector can't send you to prison and my point was that if it was "the government's bill collector" then there is a possibility that he could.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:54 PM
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a reply to: Semicollegiate

That's not the answer to his question. I am curious too.

I find AC to be interesting and in theory it seems wonderful but in practice I doubt it will work, especially today.

How will people in AC deal with violent criminals? Serial killers?



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 07:59 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: greencmp
My overall point is that, in most communities, people adequately police themselves already. AC or minarchist, I suspect the process would not be dissimilar.

Sure but we were not talking about private citizens. We were talking about government taxing or charging fees. My point was what difference does it make to call him a bill collector or a tax collector.

That's is where you said that a bill collector can't send you to prison and my point was that if it was "the government's bill collector" then there is a possibility that he could.



Got it, thanks for the clarification.

Interesting question, there would be no direct taxes to the federal government (presuming a constitutional republican federation). It would be the states that fund the national assembly so, each state would presumably have different laws regarding what consequence avoiding "taxes" might bring.

In that case, it would simply be another factor in deciding where to live within the federation.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:06 PM
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originally posted by: greencmp
In that case, it would simply be another factor in deciding where to live within the federation.

You paint to pretty a picture.

Obviously you are thinking of the US. You have no idea how the states would choose to organize. You might end up in a state that leaves the federation and then you might not have a choice of tax friendly states. Or they might leave taxation at the federal level.

Lot's of variables.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:13 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: greencmp
In that case, it would simply be another factor in deciding where to live within the federation.

You paint to pretty a picture.

Obviously you are thinking of the US. You have no idea how the states would choose to organize. You might end up in a state that leaves the federation and then you might not have a choice of tax friendly states. Or they might leave taxation at the federal level.

Lot's of variables.

Yes, presuming we re-enacted the Constitution and Bill of Rights tomorrow and we were all here in the US.
edit on 28-8-2015 by greencmp because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:14 PM
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originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Semicollegiate

That's not the answer to his question. I am curious too.

I find AC to be interesting and in theory it seems wonderful but in practice I doubt it will work, especially today.

How will people in AC deal with violent criminals? Serial killers?


Local solutions ultimately. There could be special solutions for special problems. Like Greencamp said, the redemption depends on the victim's satisfaction.

Robert P. Murphy says that there would be places for any criminal to go to. Managing criminals would be a business. A serial killer would have a very hard time finding a place to live and work. What ever place he found would cost about as much as he could pay. Some industries might cater to criminals.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:22 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: greencmp
In that case, it would simply be another factor in deciding where to live within the federation.

You paint to pretty a picture.

Obviously you are thinking of the US. You have no idea how the states would choose to organize. You might end up in a state that leaves the federation and then you might not have a choice of tax friendly states. Or they might leave taxation at the federal level.

Lot's of variables.


And I should admit that the answer could be construed as a bit of a dodge too but, that is what makes the simplicity of small government so attractive, most central problems disappear from the official concerns of "the state", that is, the national government.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:28 PM
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a reply to: greencmp

Even if that was the case you still can't predict what your state would do in the near future.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:31 PM
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a reply to: Semicollegiate

C'mon AC and a serial killer. The most likely local solution would be a hanging.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:37 PM
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originally posted by: greencmp
And I should admit that the answer could be construed as a bit of a dodge too but, that is what makes the simplicity of small government so attractive, most central problems disappear from the official concerns of "the state", that is, the national government.

Didn't take it that way at all. I do think the notion is a tad romanticized.

The problems don't disappear, they just shift.

Pretty soon your complaining about those yahoos at the state capitol.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:45 PM
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originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: Semicollegiate

C'mon AC and a serial killer. The most likely local solution would be a hanging.


That does seem obvious.

But you could think that is letting him off easy. Maybe some one needs his kidneys. or will next year.

Most importantly, in AC there would be a good paying, stable economy and not much crime.



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