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Tsunami: We only care because it wasn't all just poor people that died...rich people died too!

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posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 09:07 AM
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THREAD EXPIRY DATE: About 2 posts ago.




posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by 00PS
Do you remember all the other natural disasters of 2004 that killed tens and thousands of poor innocent victims? Probably not. Will you rember the Tsunami for a while? Yes probably, but why? Because the Tsunami of 2004 killed many vacationing westerners.


If rich people hadn't died, if westerners hadn't died then nobody would care. Of course you will object to my reasoning and say you are a humane person and grieve for every lost soul. But will you think differently about the 9 year old poor black indian girl with no teeth and tattered clothing and that 32 year old just married couple from UK? etc etc


___________________________________________


I'm guessing you posted this to get a reaction, and mine is simple. You have externalized your own feelings and projected then onto the entire US public. Myself, my co-workers and family members have done everything from donate cash to weep hysterically because most of the dead are children, regardless of class or race.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by 00PS
Do you remember all the other natural disasters of 2004 that killed tens and thousands of poor innocent victims? Probably not. Will you rember the Tsunami for a while? Yes probably, but why? Because the Tsunami of 2004 killed many vacationing westerners.


If rich people hadn't died, if westerners hadn't died then nobody would care. Of course you will object to my reasoning and say you are a humane person and grieve for every lost soul. But will you think differently about the 9 year old poor black indian girl with no teeth and tattered clothing and that 32 year old just married couple from UK?


In our world lives are worth more than others and it is a fact true and unrefutable. Look at people in your community - see how they look at you and maybe even you - how do you look at others?


If it was only poor people, everyone would think WOW a big Tsunami? Any photos? But because rich people died we are like OH a big Tsunami, is everyone ok?


Oh cram it. God, you are about as clueless and arrogant as they come.

As a poor person, i could care less about a bunch of rich people dying. the fact that over 100,000 people died in a horrifying natural disaster is why people cry about this. People did cry about the earth quake in Iran. But the devestation in Iran was nothing compared to this Tsunami. Already, over a hundred thousand have died, and hundreds of thousands more may die in the after math from disease and other problems. This has to be the worst natural disaster in modern history.

Unlike the quake in Iran, several different countries are affected and have lost alot of people.

People arent sending money to help a bunch of rich people who died, as rich people can buy their own private aid and rescue. Its not like rich people are going to drink cheap water and eat cheap food that relief agencies send.

We are sending aid and relief fpr a bunch of people who cant afford private helicopters, airlifts ect, people who for the most part, are so poor they probably dont even have a standard vehicle to get around in, people who live in areas that probably dont have much in terms of roads.

Your ignorance is enough to make me very ill.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 09:36 AM
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OK gang, overt ignorance is no reason to put aside the T&C. Let's not get too personal.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 09:47 AM
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The aid being sent to affected areas is not for the tourists, most of whom have either left or are about to leave.

I doubt that a rich person who has lost their family is feeling rich right now.

We give aid and relief to the poor all the time, in Africa for example.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:01 AM
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Oops, you're getting your arse kicked on this one so i've decided to help you out a little.

26,000 Iranians died from the Bam Earthquake and the world barely lifted a finger to help, actually Washington donated $100,000!. Perhaps it was Terhans refusal to accept international donation/aid, or perhaps it was Western leaders who were turning a cold shoulder on the Evil doers mess?

I don't know exactly nor do i care much to debate it since both incidents are very tragic. But i am willing to argue the recent Tsunami disaster has received more international "recognition" than the 26,000 deaths who were citizens of the axis of evil.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:15 AM
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Originally posted by syntaxer

26,000 Iranians died from the Bam Earthquake and the world barely lifted a finger to help, actually Washington donated $100,000!. Perhaps it was Terhans refusal to accept international donation/aid, or perhaps it was Western leaders who were turning a cold shoulder on the Evil doers mess?



It was exactly that. They refused offered aide from Israel - they were obstinate while the world tried to help. There are threads on here that chronicle this. I remember a father stating he would allow his child to die before saving them with Jewish money.

Also, the world didn't have a clear picture (and still doesn't) of the devastation in Iran because Iran wouldn't allow the world in. We grieved and donated as much as we could with the limited data from Tehran.

In addition, in case 00PS would like to give to those "who are not rich"...there are still 60,000 Iranian citizens reported to be homeless from that earthquake.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:29 AM
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The Iranian Red Cresent are here:
www.rcs.ir...

But, I see no way of making a donation.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:33 AM
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Originally posted by intrepid
OK gang, overt ignorance is no reason to put aside the T&C. Let's not get too personal.


I would rephrase thi sand say, "OK gang, people with different opinions outside the majorities' reasoning is no excuse to put asie the T&C" Now why didn't this get posted by any of the other 3 or 4 mod's before I was the one abused, then countred, and then warned...whatever

Looking a little deeper I think we are finally waking up to the point...too bad I was there on page 1. Bam didn't get the recognition this did. Ok now bam was a earthquake and an ancient city was devastated and ruinied. And this was a tsunami, so what...California has tsunamis, so does Japan. poor people die all the time. What's the point? The media has been effected by the death of so many rich people from this tragedy, it cannot got unoticed...

And about Israel, don't even bring it up. Sri Lanka Rejected Israel Rescuers and that does not equal it to Iran's refusal...why even bring it up.

Point is most westeners don't want to realize the fact. The only reason it's just such a big deal now is because so many rich western vacationers died. I reiterate my point.

In China no one cares so many poor people died. There are millions of poor people and hundreds of thousands of them dying every year from this or that. Why care about the indians or indonesians. Now ask those chinese why is it in ther CCTV news and newspapers???? BECAUSE SO MANY RICH WESTERNERS DIED TOO........................Case Closed Cut and Dry

I am not insensitive, I am not disrespectful, I am not ignorant, I am not dilusianal, I am not stupid or arrogant..I am not all the things all you called me and none of you got warned for it, I am the one who stated the point and no one but 3 of you can offer your own logical opinions on the point...good grief



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:38 AM
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But i am willing to argue the recent Tsunami disaster has received more international "recognition" than the 26,000 deaths who were citizens of the axis of evil.


International Tsunami recognition through our US televised media etc. has massivly dwarfed the Iranian Earthquakes crisis (media coverage) from exactly one year ago. I believe this offers some substance to which 00ps is trying to make here.

I can recall plenty of ignorant ATS members who had very negative views towards the Iran Earthquake because the citizens were members of the "axis of evil".

Search for it and you shall see


[edit on 30-12-2004 by syntaxer]



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:41 AM
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An interesting side point.

When the Bam earthquake occured, one of the first high profile visitors was Prince Charles. He was shown on UK TV imploring people to donate aid.
Where are the royal family in Asia? You'd think that they and the "rich people" who died would have something in common wouldn't you?
Why isn't Charlie on the news every night saying "give to Asia". Oh. It's because those pesky rich people have enough money to buy new family members to replace the ones they've lost, right?

Oops. You state that you live in China. I guess you country is still as insular and inward looking as ever. Just because your country happens to be on the doorstep of this disaster and is turning a blind eye, don't believe for one moment that the rest of the world shares your sentiments.

Personally, I was in the area of Sri Lanka last year where the Tsuami hit the hardest. Whilst there, I made lots of friends amongst the locals - some of whom I still keep in touch with. At the moment I don't know if they're alive or dead. But I can guarantee, that when I donated to the fund, my thoughts were on the money going to the people of Sri Lanka and not to the tourists who were there (they will be taken care of when they get home, but the Sri Lankans are home).

I feel sorry for you Oops. A cynical attitude such as yours must make it very hard for you to look in the mirror each day.


[edit on 30-12-2004 by Leveller]



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:42 AM
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Sorry if this has been stated already but...

Didnt Iran refuse help from alot of western countries? They refused the US's for sure.

Although I do understand the point you are trying to make Oops, I dont think you are correct here. We are talking about 116,000 people as I type this, and maybe ALOT more as things pan out. The world is compassionate enough to look past social status in situations like this. I feel worse for locals of this disaster than I do any western turrists that were there. You know why?

Not only did thier families and loved ones die, but thier whole world in some cases has ceased to exist. A western "rich" tourist can simply go home and only have to deal with thier personal losses, but the islanders and local have to deal with that AND the fact thier entire world needs to be reconstructed.

Those poor poor people. Man I hope things improve fast...



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:48 AM
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Well you are missing the point...

Most important, we are not grieving for the rich people, we are grieving for the dead poor people. Why are we greieving, becasue we know about their plight and care about them, how can we do this, we are inspired and educated to, half by social morals and values and the rest through programming and conditioning.

Withought the media attention, half the world wouldn't even know about this, not because they have no outlet to media, but because they don't want to hear or care. Just like bam. But now Rich people have died across the board. So now they have too look and listen and sound concerned. Don't be so narrowminded to assume I am an idiot. Be higher than that and see my point. No one is donating money to help the dead rich people and I never said that. I said most people wouldn't be aware of the scope and nature of the tradgedy if they weren't awoken to it by the media that wouldn't have represneted it without the loss of so many wich westerners.

And I am an American Citizen of eurpoean descent so if you want to calculate that into your next response you can before you insult me and another country again...I would like to do what you did to me, but it looks as though the majority can abuse the minority in this thread while the majority walks away unscathed and the minority gets warned...so be it - I ask for no hand-outs




Originally posted by Leveller
An interesting side point.

When the Bam earthquake occured, one of the first high profile visitors was Prince Charles. He was shown on UK TV imploring people to donate aid.
Where are the royal family in Asia? You'd think that they and the "rich people" who died would have something in common wouldn't you?
Why isn't Charlie on the news every night saying "give to Asia". Oh. It's because those pesky rich people have enough money to buy new family members to replace the ones they've lost, right?

Oops. You state that you live in China. I guess you country is still as insular and inward looking as ever. Just because your country happens to be on the doorstep of this disaster and is turning a blind eye, don't believe for one moment that the rest of the world shares your sentiments.

[edit on 30-12-2004 by Leveller]



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 10:57 AM
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how are we supposed to know what happened without the media ?

how does a single, but tragic earthqauke compare to a tsunami that effected many different countries ?

wouldn't you agree seeing pictures and video of the tsunami evokes a more compassionate response than an earthquake that is written about with very little pictures, video and its perfectly normal ? if Iran let more cameras in and accepted aid, it would have been different.

condemn the iranian gov't not the media or us, and please speak for yourself when you put out ideas like this.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 11:06 AM
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When Bam hit I had much more feeling than this...Now I am told to have feeling..something is wrong with this picture. The media is telling me to care about this more than bam...Same time, but different circumstances. It's not about Iran Denying Aid! It's about bam being a slum full of poor people and the people of the world forgetting about it.

If you cared about Bam you will care about this, but there are so many people caring about this that didn't care about Bam...because in Bam it was poor people and this is only one example that hits close to home because it was the day after Xmas just like this Tsunami business.

Some people want to say it's becasue it's so Exotic..and hit so many different countries..hmm Indonesia, India, Thailand, Somalia, Bangladesh...When did most the people in the world care about these countries?? They don't! For some people this is the first time they heard of Bangladesh. I heard about it in 1988 when flooding was a mess but that's because I cared. Not everyone did.

The World, not ATS has problems, and one of them is that we do not sincerely care about the plight of indigenous and poor peoples of the developing world.

Don't accuse me of things you know not of. I live in interior China. 70 percent of the people are peasants, how many people of your community are peasants...I see poor people every day and death is a part of life, EVERY DAy!!! you know nothing of me or where I live or what I see, so Don't presume you can sum me up by a post...What I think is not a sin and it's not wrong. It's true, if so many rich people did not die, we would not as a world be awoken to the tragedy as it is!!!



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 11:12 AM
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sooooooooo if you live in China, how are you in a position to describe what all americans are thinking now, and what we thougth of the bam quake ?


it was described on some tv news program that babies and children were being ripped out of their mothers arms and swept away. my wife sobbed on my shoulder for 5 minutes. trust me, it had nothing to do with bam, race, politics, whatever.

please speak for yourself.

thanks



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 11:16 AM
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well I am not speaking for myself, I am commenting on the world as it is...So if you are not one of the people I am speaking with that's all you have to say 'nothing' don't even comment. If you can agree or not is the question at hand.

How many zombies do we know living in our communities that go to the mall and walk around and shop and buy things and never know what countries they come from and from what conditions they are made from. Then the news hit's the TV...Earthquake 20K poor people died, they say..oh 'that sucks'...

then the media says the next year TSUNAMI SO MANY FOREIGNERS DIED and they say OH MY GOD TRAGEDY...

that's the point... don't be stupid - it's the truth



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 11:21 AM
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please refrain from insults when someone disagrees with you. it just makes you look bad, not me.

please comment on how you know how we all think about the tsunami and how we thought about bam. not each of us by name, just a summary.


thanks



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 11:36 AM
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I bet some people somewhere only care because westerners were hurt. It's horrible that's the only reason some people care. Hopefully the majority of the people showing how much they care by either volunteering or donating money and other things. Hopefully most people care about it just because people were hurt not because westerners were hurt.



posted on Dec, 30 2004 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by radagast
please refrain from insults when someone disagrees with you. it just makes you look bad, not me.

please comment on how you know how we all think about the tsunami and how we thought about bam. not each of us by name, just a summary.


thanks



I mentioned Bam.. That would be I adding some fuel to his fire, it's my nature by the way
So dont hate me because i'm some what beautiful with the assistance of adobe photoshop


I can do this sorta thing all day,

For instance, perhaps another bit of selective recognition by US media comes down to how much coverage their giving Sri Lanka over Indonnesia when the death tolls are almost equal. Watching CNN, FoxNews etc and you will see Sri Lanka this, Sri Lanka that, and oh yea Indonnesia right after these commercial breaks..

Sri Lanka are US allies? i don't know, since they're in the middle of a civil war?..



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