It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
a reply to: DeathSlayer
People have been doing this for years. Most have been proven frauds. Google "Todd White Fraud". One video shows how the leg trick is done. It's well-known that this is a parlor trick.
Did someone say he is selling books? How could you trust a person who is using his "gift" to make money?
See the first video on this site: Source
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: DeathSlayer
That just sounds like you didn't try hard enough. If this man could figure out how to do it (RIP), then I'm sure you could as well. Then again all you were offering them was prayer; I wonder if hospitals are more willing to make exceptions if you offered them something more tangible. Like actual healing or in the case of my source, happiness. Anyone can pray for someone.
originally posted by: thekaboose
The issue is:
He COULD stage all these video's or just rely on gullible people. The placebo effect is an amazing thing!
Then he COULD like so many others do the following:
He then says "you can do it too! only $9.99 to read how"
100,00 people buy the book... they practice themselves and fail, but dont worry "Failed? Dont worry, join my workshop only $1000 for the weekend" OR they tell their friends / people on the internet, another 100,000 books are sold making him more money.
Then people DEFEND him by saying things like:
"Even if it isnt real, its the message and hope that he spreads and we are spreading too by reading his book"
Unless a healer is donating 90% of the profits to charity and 10% for food shelter and clothing then I dont trust them
BUT
People saying when it comes to these "types" of people:
"If they can heal the sick why would they charge".
I would. I need to eat, clothe myself and have shelter. Buy a PS4 and upgrade my PC.... Buy more baby stuff, treat the other half to a holiday, buy a new car...
Im a simple creature.
So, who would you trust? Someone who could heal and charges (pretend there 100% proof and it did work) who is honest with you but is a small amount of money (say $20) OR Someone who could heal and say "you too can do it, book + weekend lessons for $1,599.99" making you believe you can do it and make money.
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
originally posted by: Woodcarver
It's free advertising. It worked on you. I bet you even bought the book.
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: SlapMonkey
But the individual did not gain anything by healing this girl, did he?
What did he gain?
I did not see him charging for this service.
I didn't buy any book from this guy. I did buy a book written by Praying Medic (a different person). And after reading it I understand now how to love everyone. Something I could never say openly but now understand! It opened my eyes.
I will never give up on anyone.......anymore. This is love.
And yet. You still buy the books.
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
originally posted by: thekaboose
The issue is:
He COULD stage all these video's or just rely on gullible people. The placebo effect is an amazing thing!
Then he COULD like so many others do the following:
He then says "you can do it too! only $9.99 to read how"
100,00 people buy the book... they practice themselves and fail, but dont worry "Failed? Dont worry, join my workshop only $1000 for the weekend" OR they tell their friends / people on the internet, another 100,000 books are sold making him more money.
Then people DEFEND him by saying things like:
"Even if it isnt real, its the message and hope that he spreads and we are spreading too by reading his book"
Unless a healer is donating 90% of the profits to charity and 10% for food shelter and clothing then I dont trust them
BUT
People saying when it comes to these "types" of people:
"If they can heal the sick why would they charge".
I would. I need to eat, clothe myself and have shelter. Buy a PS4 and upgrade my PC.... Buy more baby stuff, treat the other half to a holiday, buy a new car...
Im a simple creature.
So, who would you trust? Someone who could heal and charges (pretend there 100% proof and it did work) who is honest with you but is a small amount of money (say $20) OR Someone who could heal and say "you too can do it, book + weekend lessons for $1,599.99" making you believe you can do it and make money.
Sounds like a great business but in the bible it says:
Matthew 10:7-9 - 7"And as you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at hand.' 8"Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out demons. Freely you received, freely give. 9"Do not acquire gold, or silver, or copper for your money belts,…
Those who charge will loose their gift of healing.....
originally posted by: Woodcarver
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
originally posted by: Woodcarver
It's free advertising. It worked on you. I bet you even bought the book.
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: SlapMonkey
But the individual did not gain anything by healing this girl, did he?
What did he gain?
I did not see him charging for this service.
I didn't buy any book from this guy. I did buy a book written by Praying Medic (a different person). And after reading it I understand now how to love everyone. Something I could never say openly but now understand! It opened my eyes.
I will never give up on anyone.......anymore. This is love.
This is not love, it is annoying. Doctors don't want people in hospitals praying for people because it doesn't work. Plus, i bet you are super annoying in person.
originally posted by: Woodcarver
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
originally posted by: Woodcarver
It's free advertising. It worked on you. I bet you even bought the book.
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: SlapMonkey
But the individual did not gain anything by healing this girl, did he?
What did he gain?
I did not see him charging for this service.
I didn't buy any book from this guy. I did buy a book written by Praying Medic (a different person). And after reading it I understand now how to love everyone. Something I could never say openly but now understand! It opened my eyes.
I will never give up on anyone.......anymore. This is love.
This is not love, it is annoying. Doctors don't want people in hospitals praying for people because it doesn't work. Plus, i bet you are super annoying in person.
It's true, I do not believe in deities, but I do believe humans have extraordinary latent capabilities to heal themselves and others, which occasionally rise to the surface of our experience.
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: Klassified
WOW Klassified..... you caught me off guard. Wasn't sure if I was going to make a post to your post.
Man, I had you figured out all wrong. After this last post of yours I see you in a different light (compliment)
Another reason for not judging....... I am learning ..... slowly .....but learning.
I see you walking with your creator.......
Most would say that is just letting correlation equal causation based on a sole anecdote though.
So you think healers are charlatains but that they also accidentally heal people sometimes? Come on. I have seen you say some pretty smart things, but this is enough to revoke your atheist card. Place it in the window and step away.
originally posted by: Klassified
a reply to: DeathSlayer
I may be an atheist and anti-religionist, and my fellow atheists no doubt will take issue with my stance, but I do believe in transcendent healing.
Transcendent: beyond or above the range of normal or merely physical human experience.
It's true, I do not believe in deities, but I do believe humans have extraordinary latent capabilities to heal themselves and others, which occasionally rise to the surface of our experience. I believe it, because I have seen it. This experience is not unique to Christianity, though evangelical Christians are much more open to the idea. They just attribute it to god, rather than our own latent abilities.
As to faith healers, I am of the same opinion as others. I've seen Benny Hinn and a few others in person. They're charlatans at best. However, it does not surprise me in the least that occasionally, someone gets healed in their services. Intention and faith can be powerful in the right mixture.
S&F, because this subject fascinates me. I just see it from a different perspective than religion does.
originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Klassified
It's true, I do not believe in deities, but I do believe humans have extraordinary latent capabilities to heal themselves and others, which occasionally rise to the surface of our experience.
I agree. I remember, a long time ago, watching an Oprah episode, in which a little boy, around 10 (?), had "healed" himself from a brain tumor. He told Oprah that he was MAD at his tumor and he wanted to destroy it! He loved playing "Asteroids" the old video game, so he envisioned the game inside his brain, and continually imagined that he was blasting his tumor away as if it was a video game asteroid. It worked!
So you think healers are charlatains but that they also accidentally heal people sometimes? Come on. I have seen you say some pretty smart things, but this is enough to revoke your atheist card. Place it in the window and step away.