Our Lady of Perpetual Exemption Church: Televangelists

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

It all depends on what you're preaching. The content of the message is what's important, not the method of delivery.

Thought so.

So who'd get to clear what could or could not be preached?

Should we get a government department to approve all religious speech before it can be said to the public?

originally posted by: beezzer
Thought so.

So who'd get to clear what could or could not be preached?

Should we get a government department to approve all religious speech before it can be said to the public?

I already covered that. If you're making physical claims you need to be able to prove them. It's the same standard that exists for every other product out there (and it's a very loose standard).

a reply to: Aazadan

So religion should be under the umbrella of all laws that dictate to businesses?

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

Religious expression should be legal.

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: Aazadan

So religion should be under the umbrella of all laws that dictate to businesses?

Why should religion get to make claims that can be proven false?

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: Aazadan

So religion should be under the umbrella of all laws that dictate to businesses?

Why should religion get to make claims that can be proven false?

Well, people believe that there is a God, and that cannot be proven. It can only be accepted by faith.

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

This thread is not an attack on religion! How on earth is that what you're reading out of this? And again, why the straw man arguments? It's as though you want your religion to be persecuted so badly that you're imagining it into reality.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: HighFive
Motivational speakers and people that sell get rich quick books do the same thing.
But they pay tax if you buy their books.
If you donate to their pyramid scheme, you don't get a tax credit.

The issue is less : "Should televangelism be legal?"
And more: "Should these crooks be tax exempt?"

The book or speech is the physical product, there is no guarantee the information within will work for any given individual. What they are selling is their opinion that you are paying to hear, politicians do the same thing with their books.

.

That's the thing about religion. It's hard to prove you won't actually get a penthouse in the sky when you die.

And as far as trying to regulate which religious messages should be legal, not a great idea..
Who defines which messages should be legal. Atheists? The Christian Right? ISIS?
No thanks. I'll keep my personal definition of Christianity

Edit: I'd like to add I think these televangelists and the prosperity gospel are anti Christian in my opinion.
I support their legality. Not their tax exempt status.

originally posted by: mulder85

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

This thread is not an attack on religion! How on earth is that what you're reading out of this? And again, why the straw man arguments? It's as though you want your religion to be persecuted so badly that you're imagining it into reality.

You don't see it as an attack on religion, but I do.

Teleevangelists are scum, but just because they are scum, they deserve all the freedoms as the more socially acceptable religions get.

originally posted by: beezzer
Well, people believe that there is a God, and that cannot be proven. It can only be accepted by faith.

Yes, and nothing I've said challenges that. That's a spiritual belief. A physical belief would be in saying that if you give our church a million dollars God will descend from heaven, take the form of a man, and spend an hour conversing with you about the nature of life.

originally posted by: HighFive
That's the thing about religion. It's hard to prove you won't actually get a penthouse in the sky when you die.

So churches can stick to preaching beliefs which require faith due to their inability to be proven. Preaching that giving them your life savings will cure your cancer is a lot different from preaching that giving them your life savings will get you into heaven. One of those claims can be tested and as such should only be allowed if it can be proven true. The other claim is purely a matter of faith.

Some churches don't believe in evolution. Which can be proven. Are they now illegal too under your scenario?

originally posted by: HighFive


Some churches don't believe in evolution. Which can be proven. Are they now illegal too under your scenario?

They're choosing to not accept facts in that scenario. Not believing in evolution isn't selling a product. They're not making a claim like "God will prove to the world that evolution is not a fact if you give us $5 million dollars".

Edit:
This standard would apply to the spiritual realm too if we could prove it. If we knew there was a God, and an afterlife, and what God preferred there would be standards on preachers who give sermons on what God wants you to do. However that can't be proven so it's an area where anything goes. Where anything does not go however is in the realm of the physical. We can test claims and find them false, when a claim is found to be false it becomes illegal to sell it as if it's true.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: mulder85

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

This thread is not an attack on religion! How on earth is that what you're reading out of this? And again, why the straw man arguments? It's as though you want your religion to be persecuted so badly that you're imagining it into reality.

You don't see it as an attack on religion, but I do.

Teleevangelists are scum, but just because they are scum, they deserve all the freedoms as the more socially acceptable religions get.

And which religions would those be?

I'm not attacking your religion. I don't see any posts in this thread attacking Christianity or any religion for that matter. We're attacking the people who are misrepresenting your religion. Do you agree that they're misrepresenting Christianity? Could you be more specific about how this thread, Oliver's video, or any of my posts are attacking religion? Too many soundbites and not enough supporting explanation so far.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

It all depends on what you're preaching. The content of the message is what's important, not the method of delivery.

Thought so.

So who'd get to clear what could or could not be preached?

Should we get a government department to approve all religious speech before it can be said to the public?

see, the problem isnt that religious nuts are soliciting the american public.

its that the american public is stupid enough to give them money.

and ron white said it best: you cant fix stupid.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: HighFive

Should evangelism become illegal?

(loaded question, with so many that hate religion, but I had to ask)

It all depends on what you're preaching. The content of the message is what's important, not the method of delivery.

Thought so.

So who'd get to clear what could or could not be preached?

Should we get a government department to approve all religious speech before it can be said to the public?

see, the problem isnt that religious nuts are soliciting the american public.

its that the american public is stupid enough to give them money.

and ron white said it best: you cant fix stupid.

"There's a sucker born every minute."
Obama P.T. Barnum

originally posted by: Serdgiam
Even the zealous Christians I know dislike the televangelists (putting it nicely). That's saying something..

I consider them full blown heretics.

Has there ever been a good study of the demographics of those who give to them? It boggles my mind that most of them are on TV in the first place, much less raking in gobs of money.

It seems to me though, non profit status tends to be exploited heavily across the board.. I feel that attaining non profit status should be based on contributions to the community that would have otherwise cost taxpayer money.

Of course, this would be exploited as well because "humans." But it seems like a more solid determining factor in whether or not an organization should be exempt from taxation, instead of being based in claimed beliefs. Plenty of churches would still easily qualify, as well as opening the door a bit more for secular organizations.

These people are PAID FOR by groups you would not expect.

Believers often claim everyone is out to stop them, to take them off the air.

Well guess what, ISRAEL, and other interests LOVE IT, and have made sure this stuff will ALWAYS fill the air...whether people give to them or not, serious money and Power wants this to be all around, just like everything else.