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Beaten Alabama cop says he was afraid to use force

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posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 08:50 AM
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My dh and I have been in law enforcement for almost 20 years. We are currently working on an exit strategy and will be out by dec of next year. You just can't win anymore. Defend yourself and you are brutal. Don't and you are a wimp. Chase the crminal and you are needlessly endangering the public. Don't and you are negligent. Law enforcement as a whole has become a chump's game and this is very evident in what's showing up amongst new recruits. You think it's bad now? Wait 5 years.

a reply to: Bloodydagger




posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 08:55 AM
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a reply to: kellyjay

I get this feeling that body cams nation wide seems like a good idea but two things will happen 1) individual perceptions will be a thing and people will still see an issue over justified or not, and people will still see the problem as not solved . 2) a ton of malfunctions with body cams. I think these would be a stop gap measure but the end result still is a nationalized police force.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 08:56 AM
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I think gun cams on police service weapons would also be very helpful in discovering the truth about violent police confrontations. Federalizing the police is not the answer, the more local they are the more likely they are to be accountable for their actions - the same as any government agency.

The uptick in police shootings I believe is attributable to a couple of things:
More media attention.
Lowered standards for police entry exams.
Too many PTSD vets becoming cops for the sake of having a job.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:01 AM
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a reply to: Asktheanimals

Cameras are fine, in and of themselves. However, the only ones that will really matter are ones that are totally cop proof and the data from them can't be erased, deleted, or modified by the cops, and for which draconian penalties are levied for their being "forgotten", tampered with, covered up etc.


It's sort of nuts to say "we want you to wear this to prove you are honest" and then give them an off button and access to the recording. It's a self defeating criterion. If the cop's honest, he doesn't need a camera. If not, then giving them a way to defeat it is going to result in you having no data when something hinky happens. If you don't penalize them in a big, terminal way for screwing with it, then it's only useful for convicting civilians, since no recording will survive that's otherwise.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:03 AM
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originally posted by: Momof7
You just can't win anymore. Defend yourself and you are brutal.


"Defend yourself" by killing a fleeing, unarmed man? No. That's not defense and that's what the cops are doing, and that's why so many are against cops today.


Law enforcement as a whole has become a chump's game and this is very evident in what's showing up amongst new recruits.


I don't know what a "chump's game" is, but law enforcement is in trouble because of how they're acting! They cannot blame this on the media or anything else. It's their own actions of illegal and immoral action AND the fact that they protect their own, and have NO interest in getting rid of the "bad apples" to protect the integrity of the force. They PROTECT those who are killing people for no reason instead of prosecuting them.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:12 AM
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originally posted by: Reallyfolks
a reply to: kellyjay

I get this feeling that body cams nation wide seems like a good idea but two things will happen 1) individual perceptions will be a thing and people will still see an issue over justified or not, and people will still see the problem as not solved . 2) a ton of malfunctions with body cams. I think these would be a stop gap measure but the end result still is a nationalized police force.


People will always jump on the bandwaggon and blame cops for being heavy handed even if it is justified, the likes of the BLM etc..at least when they cry foul and the media pick up the story police can release video to show it was justified if indeed it was and that SHOULD put an end to it.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:12 AM
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If he was "scared" to use force then he might want to revisit his agency's use of force policy.

Fairly certain that "getting your ass handed to you" justifies use of force in response to it.

But I may be mistaken.




posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:23 AM
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originally posted by: kellyjay

originally posted by: Reallyfolks
a reply to: kellyjay

I get this feeling that body cams nation wide seems like a good idea but two things will happen 1) individual perceptions will be a thing and people will still see an issue over justified or not, and people will still see the problem as not solved . 2) a ton of malfunctions with body cams. I think these would be a stop gap measure but the end result still is a nationalized police force.


People will always jump on the bandwaggon and blame cops for being heavy handed even if it is justified, the likes of the BLM etc..at least when they cry foul and the media pick up the story police can release video to show it was justified if indeed it was and that SHOULD put an end to it.





I just think it would. You release a video of a cop getting charged by a criminal in an aggressive manner. Some people will say adrenaline, being charged, didn't want to lose weapon, etc = justified. Other people will look at same video the man was coming towards him unarmed, cop should have been able to stand his own without deadly force = unjustified. Others will have variations of what should have been done, taser, baton , whatever. Basically show a video to 100 people you might get 10 prevailing different opinions from the same video due to perceptions. I get what you're saying. Just don't believe it happens like video released game over except in rare cases. The majority of these videos will end in the same arguments, protests, unhappiness that we see now. The only difference is now people will have the "proof" to support their perception.
edit on 15-8-2015 by Reallyfolks because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:26 AM
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originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

I don't know what a "chump's game" is, but law enforcement is in trouble because of how they're acting! They cannot blame this on the media or anything else. It's their own actions of illegal and immoral action AND the fact that they protect their own, and have NO interest in getting rid of the "bad apples" to protect the integrity of the force. They PROTECT those who are killing people for no reason instead of prosecuting them.


This is a huge part of the problem.

Unless there is video evidence provided by a citizen, in almost 100% of cases (prove me wrong) there are no repercussions for police officers (or corrections officers) who use excessive force.

1) Charges are laid against the victim to reverse-blame (resisting arrest...assaulting a police officer...obstruction, etc.)
2) Fellow officers will doctor their reports to match their colleague's version of events
3) If two officers are required to subdue an individual, eight officers will pile on (and then there are eight supporting reports from "officers of the court" against the victim, a lone "criminal")
4) Internal investigations magically turn up nothing untoward
5) Prosecutors do not file charges...special rules for use of force for Police...or "the officer feared for his safety", so end of story

The analogy of other professions not putting up with bad actors in their ranks is apt. Can you imagine if it was common practice for Doctors to cover up gross malpractice (or, say, sexual misconduct)...or if Accountants by and large looked the other way when one of their number embezzled funds?

The Police need to be held to very high standards by society - and by themselves!
edit on 15-8-2015 by mobiusmale because: typo



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:32 AM
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Don't get me wrong, there are some serious problems with some of the things I have seen recently that make me wonder wtf those people were thinking. Cleveland shooting of the 12 year old, flash bang thrown into baby crib, raids on the wrong damn address. I mean come on, the list goes on and on. However, Darren Wilson was defending himself. Witnesses who corroborated his story ended up murdered and burned by thugs. Plus, most of the really disturbing things I have seen are the result of pure stupidity on the part of the police. Expect more of the same as the people with half a brain move on and are replaced by people dumb enough to sign on for this crap.

Eta-
Chump - Informal. a stupid person; dolt:
Don't be a chump—she's kidding you along.

Game - a competitive activity played according to rules and decided by skill, strength, or luck.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

edit on 15-8-2015 by Momof7 because: Add definitions for the vocabulary challenged



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:34 AM
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originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: Reallyfolks
a reply to: Bloodydagger

The end result here will eventually be a nationalized police force. See the suggestion coming from various fronts. When that happens, you ain't seen nothing yet. People will eventually get what they "want". They just won't want what they get.


That must not happen.


I guarantee you, that will happen. Perhaps not in quite the way you would expect it. But it will happen and there will be absolute hell to pay. I'm already starting to see it happen and believe me, its an ugly scene. Federalizing policing serves so many Progressive agendas it can't be resisted. So get ready for it. In 10 years you'll find yourself a virtual prisoner in your own home and depending on who you are, you won't be free of the intrusions even in your own home. Its coming down the track. The light at the end of the tunnel is Federalized cops.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 09:38 AM
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a reply to: TonyS

It would have been a distasteful joke mere decades ago but, you are correct that the impetus toward totalitarianism and the police state is strong in both parties.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 10:31 AM
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a reply to: Bloodydagger

I have several family members in law enforcement and I can't believe they haven't quit or retired. The whole damned if you do laughed at if you don't should be enough to change any officers mind. When cops are murdered why doesn't the media run that into the ground.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 10:38 AM
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originally posted by: Bloodydagger
Are we about to live in a world where a lot of cops are afraid to do their job? Also, i'd pay close attention to the job overall for the next year or so. I bet we are about to see an exodus where lots of cops quit over what is going on. A cop that is afraid to lay his/her hands on someone in any manner is here.


The problem is actually not with the police. The police are a natural reaction to the actual problem. The problems are reckless lawmakers that force the job of police officers to oppress people and ignore their civil liberties. If we want to see police to their jobs of keeping the peace, we need to:


  1. Eliminate the War on Drugs (decrminalise all of it)
  2. Change Criminal Justice system that requires high prison polulation (private prisons)
  3. End petty code enforcement (endless tickets for anything to make money)
  4. End all fofeiture laws.


It is the lawmakers that use the police to keep their money flowing. Stop that and the police can concentrate on preventing crime or at least protecting against crimes that actually have a victim.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 10:40 AM
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originally posted by: Golga13
The whole damned if you do laughed at if you don't should be enough to change any officers mind.


Damned if you shoot a fleeing, unarmed man 8 times? Yeah, they SHOULD be damned. And if a cop can't handle being laughed at, they should get a job as a children's art teacher, not an officer of the law. (No offense to art teachers.)



When cops are murdered why doesn't the media run that into the ground.


Are you serious? Those stories ARE very much reported.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 10:44 AM
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a reply to: notmyrealname

You have a great point, but I disagree that the problem isn't with the police. As I said before, SOME overstep their bounds and then the entire dept. protects their own, like freaking pedophile priests! They take advantage of those they're sworn to "protect and serve" and then their buddies cover for them and they don't get punished. (Until recently, when whole towns rise up and protest.) If that's what it takes to police the police, then I support it.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 10:56 AM
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a reply to: Benevolent Heretic
I am a big fan of not just treating the symptoms but eliminating the problem that causes the symptoms. In this case the Symptoms a clear (too many out of control police and the blue line that protects them) . This is however, the symptom of reckless law-makers which are not properly regulated by "We The People".

I agree with you regarding the actions of some (more lately) police that should lose their job! I would also rather see a police officer injured in the line of duty that the injury of an innocent civilian! This is the line of work the police have freely chosen; crying about their safety is akin to a boxer complaining he got punched in the ring.

edit on 15-8-2015 by notmyrealname because: Didn't have my first cup of coffee yet.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 11:08 AM
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This just sounds rediculous and just shows that this officer is inept at dealing with a situation. I'm sure the very last thing on his mind was what the media would think of him if he had defended himself. It sounds like a great excuse, and i'm sure he was coached to give this response, but it seems to me if he were properly trained, and has the mindset required to be an officer, and capable of dealing with a dangerous situation that he would not have hesitated.

He did hesitate and he got his ass handed to him. Not because he was worried about public opinion, but because he is not cut out to discern a situation that called for him to defend himself. Police work is not for everyone. Some are too heavy handed and don't know when to hold back, and some are to anxious and nervous to act when it is called for. To play like you were too worried about public opinion to defend yourself, shows that he was not cut out to be in his position. Nothing more, nothing less.


a reply to: Bloodydagger



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 12:45 PM
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originally posted by: Asktheanimals
When this happened I questioned whether he hesitated due to media pressure.
It's not too hard to get beaten down when it's a lone cop facing 2 men.
One distracts while the other attacks and there you go - he was fortunate to not have been more gravely injured.
The comments on twitter were sickening though - no sympathy at all for a man on the ground bleeding from his head.
These clowns were cheering with delight.
Something is very sick in our society for those types of comments to predominate.


If the police policed like they did back in the 50s and 60s this wouldn't be the case, the police have brought this on themselves by being jackbooted thugs.

How many police get killed on the job every year?

How many get killed by the police?

Factors more die at the polices hands than cops at the hands of citizens.

How many restrained citizens get beat without mercy by multiple officers?

How many officers get beat up?

Once again not even including all police beatings, just ones where the person is restrained, is factors more than cops getting beat.

I feel no sympathy, in fact I hope it happens much more, daily, all over the entire country.

Let's those pos feel the misery they deal out daily because they are roid raging from taking illegal steroids.

Maybe then they will buy a clue.



posted on Aug, 15 2015 @ 12:48 PM
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originally posted by: greydaze
a reply to: Bloodydagger
Whatever..If it had been 2 Pigs on a armed civilian,the civilian would have been beaten to a bloody pulp,or killed.



And charged with resisting arrest, even though all he was doing was trying to protect his head from there another kick to the face.

I'm glad these savages are getting what they deserve.

They have been dishing it out for decades.



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