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F-35 to get AETD?

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posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 11:06 PM
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Both Pratt & Whitney and GE quietly dropped a couple of bombshells at the Paris Airshow in June. First GE announced that their ADVENT engine achieved the highest combined compressor and turbine temperature operation in the history of jet propulsion. Included in the announcement was the line, "It is now being applied to the next step – an engine that could fit an F-35-like aircraft."

Pratt & Whitney, which has refused to disclose the cost of their F135 for a long time now, also announced that they are testing their AETD engine dimensions to determine if it fits into an F-35 airframe. This would be a huge boost to the program, as the AETD would be more efficient, giving more range, and time on station, or can be used to give more thrust as needed.


PARIS AIR SHOW: Pratt & Whitney has refused to disclose the price of its F135 engines for the F-35 for quite a while, even while Lockheed Martin boasted it would bring down the price of the Joint Strike Fighter to $80 million a copy — including engine.

Now we know why. At a Monday briefing here, the head of Pratt’s F135 program, Mark Buongiorno, told reporters the company didn’t want to release the information because the Adaptive Engine Technology Development (AETD) program’s engines were being tested for dimensions that matched those of the F-35. A more fuel-efficient AETD engine could overcome one of the longstanding concerns about the F-35 in an era of ever deeper anti-access/area denial defenses, its relatively short unrefueled range of a bit more than 600 nautical miles.

Then General Electric put out a release late yesterday about testing for its Adaptive Versatile Engine Technology (ADVENT) project, which achieved the highest combined compressor and turbine temperature operation “in the history of jet engine propulsion.”

breakingdefense.com...




posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 11:20 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

So what is the suggested range of the AETD?



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 11:25 PM
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a reply to: Wide-Eyes

It depends entirely on the airframe it's put into. But it will use the ADVENT core, which means that it has an extra bypass flow that a normal engine doesn't have. This can be blocked off and fed through the engine core, for additional thrust, or used as a traditional bypass, for longer range. So when going to the target area, they can use it as the bypass, to increase range and loiter time. When in combat, they feed it through the core, and have additional thrust for combat purposes.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 11:30 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

Oh okay. Sounds useful. I hope we get these on our new aircraft carrier.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 12:22 AM
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Wonder if the Brits will do the same thing with SABRE..



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 03:42 AM
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Love yout threads, Zahp, but I have a qusstion...
What is it with the obscure acronyms no one can remember in the armed forces? I've been following for quite a while. It seems almost counter-productive.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:55 AM
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originally posted by: Blackfinger
Wonder if the Brits will do the same thing with SABRE..


Whats that - I thought the program went all to P&W when they decided on one engine?



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 05:56 AM
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Looks like it through AFRL at Wright Patterson.
SABRE
Strange the Brits didn,t keep it.Thought they would have learnt their lesson with the data for Supersonic flight in the 50,s.

edit on 11-8-2015 by Blackfinger because: Corrected



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 08:20 AM
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a reply to: Blackfinger

The Brits still have SABRE. It is still in development with Airborne Engineering Ltd. in Westcott, UK.

www.reactionengines.co.uk...

The SABER in your link refers to a construction contract at Wright Patterson.


www.defenseindustrydaily.com...



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 09:21 AM
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a reply to: the owlbear

Because it's still easier than remembering the full name.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 10:18 AM
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So, ADVENT is part of AETD or are programs that compete with each other?, or they target different airframes?.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 10:23 AM
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originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: Wide-Eyes

It depends entirely on the airframe it's put into. But it will use the ADVENT core, which means that it has an extra bypass flow that a normal engine doesn't have. This can be blocked off and fed through the engine core, for additional thrust, or used as a traditional bypass, for longer range. So when going to the target area, they can use it as the bypass, to increase range and loiter time. When in combat, they feed it through the core, and have additional thrust for combat purposes.


hey zap....this type of engine would seem to be intuitive for engine design, was it too complex in past airframes, or just cost prohibited.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 10:36 AM
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a reply to: drwire

AETD is the second generation of ADVENT. AETP is the next step and will power the next generation of fighters.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 10:37 AM
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a reply to: jimmyx

The technology didn't exist. ADVENT is running at pressures and temperatures no existing engine could handle for longer than a few minutes at best.

GE has a full up ADVENT engine running in Ohio, using all the new technology. It actually exceededdesign temperatures in the core by 130 degrees during testing.
edit on 8/11/2015 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 10:32 PM
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originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: Wide-Eyes

It depends entirely on the airframe it's put into. But it will use the ADVENT core, which means that it has an extra bypass flow that a normal engine doesn't have. This can be blocked off and fed through the engine core, for additional thrust, or used as a traditional bypass, for longer range. So when going to the target area, they can use it as the bypass, to increase range and loiter time. When in combat, they feed it through the core, and have additional thrust for combat purposes.


This is so badass to me! I can see such a benefit for a UCLASS type airframe.



posted on Aug, 12 2015 @ 02:40 AM
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a reply to: WeOwnTheNight

The ADVENT engine is already flying in the new bomber prototypes from what I've figured out. It's father along, and has been far more successful than they've said.



posted on Aug, 12 2015 @ 03:05 AM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

I was wondering...wasn't those engine already burning through decks and melting pavement???



posted on Aug, 12 2015 @ 03:11 AM
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a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

No. The F135 that is in use has had issues with the B model, but is a completely different engine than either ADVENT or AETD. The reason that it has those problems is that unlike the Harrier, which used multiple exhaust nozzles, the F-35 uses two. One for the lift fan, and one that's the regular exhaust, so it's far more concentrated than previous exhaust types, as well as being the most powerful engine ever put into a single engine aircraft.

It didn't burn through the deck though, it only damaged the non skid coating much faster so it would have to be replaced during the cruise or they would risk minor damage to the deck.



posted on Aug, 12 2015 @ 04:33 AM
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a reply to: Sammamishman

Hhhhmmm Tsr2 reborn



posted on Aug, 12 2015 @ 07:37 AM
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originally posted by: Sammamishman
a reply to: Blackfinger

The Brits still have SABRE. It is still in development with Airborne Engineering Ltd. in Westcott, UK.

www.reactionengines.co.uk...

The SABER in your link refers to a construction contract at Wright Patterson.


www.defenseindustrydaily.com...


SABRE isn't that more for a SSTO rocket than a fighter engine? I thought it was tech forum the HOTOL program?



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