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Baby’s lives matter: Journalist questions abortion after PP videos

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posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:23 PM
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I Don’t Know If I’m Pro-Choice After Planned Parenthood Videos

Has anyone here changed their opinion on abortion since the PP videos were shown?



I, like this writer ( is now since the PP videos) am ambivalent and always have been though these videos are disturbing to say the least.


This journalist who I don’t know much about is apparently soul searching his support for abortion since the PP videos.


Abortion is something I never wanted to get too close to being a male but perhaps something should be done about this, I don’t know.



The only thing I hate more than talking about abortion is writing about it. It’s no accident that, in 2000 columns over a quarter century, I have never—ever—written about abortion. I’ve avoided the topic like a root canal.
But that is getting harder to do with the release of what are now five gruesome,albeit edited, undercover videos by The Center for Medical Progress depicting doctors and other top officials of Planned Parenthood discussing, and even laughing about, the harvesting of baby organs, as casually as some folks talk about the weather.
It’s jarring to see doctors acting as negotiators as they dicker over the price of a fetal liver, heart, or brain, and then talk about how they meticulously go to the trouble of not crushing the most valuable body parts. This practice is perfectly legal, and for some people, it is just a business. With millions of abortions each year in America, business is good.
Who could forget Dr. Mary Gatter, Council President of the Planned Parenthood Federation of America’s Medical Directors, when, in Video #2, she tells undercover investigators that it isn’t about the money—before she zeroes in on dollars and cents?
“Let me just figure out what others are getting, and if this is in the ballpark, then it’s fine,” Gatter said. “If it’s still low, then we can bump it up.”
Then, going for broke, she added: “I want a Lamborghini.”
I want a shower.





This poor guy's wife is pro life and getting in his case




At least that’s how my wife sees it. She’s pro-life, and so she’s been tearing into me every time a new video is released. She’s not buying my argument that, as a man, I have to defer to women and trust them to make their own choices about what to do with their bodies. To her, that’s ridiculous—and cowardly.



Difficult issue...we all need more information maybe.

But I do know this: Baby’s lives matter too!




posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:26 PM
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a reply to: Willtell

Sorry but I am 100% confident here that baby matters in some way....No matter the case! There are adoption agencies that will gladly accept your little angel if you can't/won't take care of it....No need to terminate, there is a reason for us all!



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:32 PM
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You won't hear too much here from Planned Parenthood apologists about any people having second thoughts about their unconditional support for Planned Parenthood abortionists...due to the video's shocking revelations...but I've noticed views changing from talking to friends and family.

My wife is a PRIME example of someone who has had her opinion dramatically changed about abortion and PP as a result of these videos.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:43 PM
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there is the case from 1962 with sherri finkbine and her thalidomide deformed fetus which she did get approved to have a therapeutic abortion and when she went public to raise awareness about thalidomide there was a public outcry and her american abortion was cancelled and she had to go to sweden where they told her the baby would not have survived anyway because it was so deformed... en.m.wikipedia.org...

and also the case of gerri santoro who died from basically a back alley abortion in 1964. before it was legal.....en.m.wikipedia.org...


i really can't say that the baby's lives are monumentally more important than the mother's. and those and many other cases like them are the reason why i am pro-choice. because women DO have the choice to abort whether it's legal or not. they can take a hanger and do it if they are really desperate or take other measures that will endanger their lives too.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:45 PM
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Sometimes I think humanity is on the verge of another Dark Ages where reason, common sense, and real science are being tossed out the window for the sake of 'feel good' politics and so-called social awareness of all manner of idiocy. They label things progressive when in actuality, it is regressive.

I agree with one of the candidates (can't remember which one) who said that generations will look back on this period of our history where abortion is commonplace and accepted and will be appalled at the flippant disregard for an emerging life and think how callus and inhumane we were. (paraphrasing)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: Willtell

Hey, I think the link in your OP in busted. I would like to add a comment though.

A couple of things are left out of the Planned Parenthood dialogue. A important one, in my opinion, is birth control. Ever heard of Ovarian Cysts?



About 8% of premenopausal women develop large cysts that need treatment.1 source


Do you know how they treat this cysts? Hormone therapy using birth control pills. Ever try to buy Birth control without insurance? It's around $150 a packet, which is about a month's worth. If you go through Planned Parenthood, $100 can get you an entire years worth of birth control.

Abortions are just a small fraction of the service Planned Parenthood provides.... Just sayin.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:56 PM
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originally posted by: IAMTAT
You won't hear too much here from Planned Parenthood apologists about any people having second thoughts about their unconditional support for Planned Parenthood abortionists...due to the video's shocking revelations...but I've noticed views changing from talking to friends and family.

My wife is a PRIME example of someone who has had her opinion dramatically changed about abortion and PP as a result of these videos.


did you tell her about the "hyde amendment" where by law no government funds can be used for abortions?....guess not. so......if the republicans cut government funding, abortions will still be done.....what will be cut....the other 97% dedicated to womens health care needs....I guess you left out those parts too
edit on 10-8-2015 by jimmyx because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:07 PM
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a reply to: jimmyx

The videos are about savagely butchering babies for body parts and haggling over their sale price.
...and, no, de-funding PP is about redistributing PP's yearly 1/2 Billion tax dollars to the other 9,000+ existing community clinics which already provide MORE women's health services than PP (including the mammograms, PP DOESN'T provide).



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:13 PM
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a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Is there a source for your assurance that there are adoption agencies that will gladly take an unwanted-unneeded-handicapped baby from a mother who gives birth? I'm not being flippant; I am curious. The invitro fertilization business is booming, which leads one to think that an adequate number of babies/children are not available for adoption. There are 7.3 billion people on our poor planet now, soon to reach 9.7 billion by 2050. That makes me wonder how much an unborn fetus matters "in some way." Why are there so many weekly posts in print media for "Wednesday's Child" et al about children who have lived their lives in foster care crying out for a family to call their own? Are there enough families looking for children to adopt that agencies are actively seeking out more babies to place? Somehow, I just can't imagine that to be the case. I don't feel like a barbarian, but to me, an unborn fetus is just so much tissue until 'way late in gestation and it should be the mother's choice as to whether or not to keep carrying it.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:14 PM
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a reply to: Lazarusman04

Oh my God....I am not answering your rant there...NOPE

Find one if you would like:

www.google.com...< br />

edit on 8/10/2015 by Chrisfishenstein because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:18 PM
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a reply to: Willtell

The journalist should start by actively relearning how to properly vet evidence. Then read up on US law. It's rather easy to stand tall in your pro-choice opinion during this controversy. Not to mention, if you are questioning the ethics of abortion over Planned Parenthood allegedly selling baby parts illegally, then you have the wrong idea as to what the issue even IS.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:20 PM
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originally posted by: queenofswords
Sometimes I think humanity is on the verge of another Dark Ages where reason, common sense, and real science are being tossed out the window for the sake of 'feel good' politics and so-called social awareness of all manner of idiocy. They label things progressive when in actuality, it is regressive.

I agree with one of the candidates (can't remember which one) who said that generations will look back on this period of our history where abortion is commonplace and accepted and will be appalled at the flippant disregard for an emerging life and think how callus and inhumane we were. (paraphrasing)


It's interesting you have the first paragraph here about "feel good" politics and real science being tossed out the window then the second paragraph is an anti-abortion rant, which is "feel good" politics to a T. Science SUPPORTS pro-choice btw.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:21 PM
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originally posted by: IAMTAT
a reply to: jimmyx

The videos are about savagely butchering babies for body parts and haggling over their sale price.
...and, no, de-funding PP is about redistributing PP's yearly 1/2 Billion tax dollars to the other 9,000+ existing community clinics which already provide MORE women's health services than PP (including the mammograms, PP DOESN'T provide).


Which health services are these exactly? Care to name a few that have national exposure level on par with PP?



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:23 PM
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a reply to: theNLBS

Expect this post to fall on deaf ears. The pro-life crowd doesn't like to hear that PP's services that aren't abortion related FAR eclipse their abortion services. To them Planned Parenthood = abortion factories.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:25 PM
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a reply to: IAMTAT

Like Crisis Pregnancy Centers? Which have been caught on tape Lyi ng to woman about abortions. Driving their own right wing agenda?

You're right though. Planned Parenthood doesn't do mammograms, because they don't have the equipment. They do however provide referrals and access to grant money throughNational Breast and Cervical Cancer Early Detection Program (NBCCEDP) to help poor, uninsured women, get a mammogram.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:25 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: theNLBS

Expect this post to fall on deaf ears. The pro-life crowd doesn't like to hear that PP's services that aren't abortion related FAR eclipse their abortion services. To them Planned Parenthood = abortion factories.


No Krazy...PP=selling babies for parts on the open market...=a$$holes!!



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:27 PM
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originally posted by: theNLBS
a reply to: IAMTAT

Like Crisis Pregnancy Centers? Which have been caught on tape Lyi ng to woman about abortions. Driving their own right wing agenda?

You're right though. Planned Parenthood doesn't do mammograms, because they don't have the equipment. They do however provide referrals and access to grant money throughNational Breast and Cervical Cancer Early Detection Program (NBCCEDP) to help poor, uninsured women, get a mammogram.


Oh then the million abortions they have done in the last 3 years is ok....And selling baby parts is fine...Because they offer other services...Whew, I was afraid they only killed and sold babies!



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:31 PM
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The thing is what is the solution being laid out by the pro life campaign. Make it illegal and charge women for murder who do have an abortion. I don't think that's going to help is it? Women are still going to have an abortion?



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:31 PM
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originally posted by: Chrisfishenstein

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: theNLBS

Expect this post to fall on deaf ears. The pro-life crowd doesn't like to hear that PP's services that aren't abortion related FAR eclipse their abortion services. To them Planned Parenthood = abortion factories.


No Krazy...PP=selling babies for parts on the open market...=a$$holes!!


Case in point. Thanks for proving my point Chris.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:35 PM
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I know most people on ATS won't believe it, but before this PP fiasco and travesty, I was wishy washy about abortion.

When all abortion was illegal,
I had a friend who was carrying an anacelephic baby
(the baby had no brain),
and she was forced to carry it to term,
when she found out early enough to have an abortion
early in the second term.
That affected me greatly and after that I changed my mind about abortion, seeing that there are times when abortion is compassion.

Then I taught Human Development in Univ. for many years.
I learned more and more details about fetal development
as I taught and as sonograms began to inform us,
and then along came 3D sonograms which better informed us
about life in the womb.
Let me tell you there is nothing like teaching a subject to learn it so well and so thoroughly and in such detail.

I believe and still believe that in the first trimester abortion
while not desirable simply because
the baby would be an inconvenience in the life of the mother.
(Yes, this happens frequently, my daughters friends in college
and college student I knew personally had abortions for this reason alone,
it would inconvenience their lives)
If abortion in the first trimester happens it is between the woman and her physician
and I am accepting of legal abortion in the first trimester.

In the second trimester things begin to get tricky
with what science has enlightened us is happening in the womb.

Babies after 16 weeks look exactly like itty bitty humans,
shortly afterward during the second trimester,
they begin to suck their thumbs (self sooth),
laugh (we have seen this on 3D sonograms),
shield their eyes from direct light or sonar pulses.
In other words, they exhibit human behavior.

After learning that the most desirable baby parts
were from 16+ week old fetus' it totally disgusted me.
Because I knew they were chopping up real babies (not blobs of tissue)
and selling their parts.

We have since learned through these videos
and descriptions of the unreleased videos,
that an intact fetus (ie born alive in the second trimester,
when they automatically die due to a lack of breathing ability)
is sold at the highest price and that abortionists
were adjusting their methods to try and get intact fetus
(ie born alive but unable to survive).

I have now become, as many on ATS are aware
a rabid anti-abortionist after 16 weeks (4 months pregnant).

12 weeks or earlier, I think should stay legal, even if I don't like it.

After viability, which is currently 24 weeks,
meaning a baby born alive has a 40% chance to survive
and thrive as a person given the proper medical care;
I think abortion is out and out murder.

Saving the life of the mother is moot at that point,
as to abort after the 24th week the same methods
are used to abort that would allow a live birth
and allow the baby a chance to live;
except in abortion after week 24 the babies are killed with a shot
to guarantee they will not live before labor is induced or a c-section is done.
If a woman was raped and doesn't want the baby after 24 weeks,
give it up for adoption. There is a huge shortage of babies for adoption,
I know because friends of mine are in an infertility group who mourn for the aborted babies that they would love to adopt.

Yes, the PP videos changed me from sort of ok with abortion
and with it legal until 24 weeks, to rabid anti-abortion after week 16.
Just read any of my posts on the subject and it is quite clear how strongly I now feel about the issue.

But while the videos have change me to see the 4 month and older
fetus as a person who should be given the right to life as is
guaranteed in the constitution.

There are many that I have "tangled" with that their position on
abortion has grown in the opposite direction, that they feel
abortion on demand at any stage is acceptable, and that selling
body parts for research is a desirable action. They feel that
the research that comes from these tiny brains, kidneys, lungs
etc are well worth the death of the fetus, even one who could
survive outside the womb.
Their tenacity and strength of conviction has grown stronger
hanging on to the idea that abortion is wonderful for women
and that all fetus' are simply blobs of tissue for which there can be no
exploitation because they are blobs of tissue, even at 24
weeks and beyond.
And I am astonished at their absence of compassion for the
littlest and most helpless of humans, and at their total
denial of what science has enlightened us on about the
fetus in recent years.




edit on 1Mon, 10 Aug 2015 13:47:24 -0500pm81008pmk101 by grandmakdw because: addition



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