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Kerry/Edwards Ohio Strategery

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posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 10:53 AM
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Originally posted by syntaxer
I see that you have been blessed by your god, Carl Rove.

Make a single peep you demo's and you'll pay the price for a long time, a very loooong time

It's great to know the future of democracy lay in hands of simple 'bullying'


A word to the wise:



Americans are closing their eyes and letting a new form of fascism get rolling

By SPECIAL TO CITIZEN-TIMES
Jan. 4, 2005 6:46 p.m.
Before we tune in to the second inauguration of President George Bush, perhaps you should read this. When we ignore history, we are condemned to repeat it. Oh, not here in the good ol U.S.A., you say. Never here, the land of the free and home of the brave, the bastion of democracy for the free world. Well, open your eyes, America. We may not relive the human catastrophe of the Holocaust on our own soil, but were learning how to borrow from what helped it start. Billboards in Florida extol George Bush as Our Leader, placed by the conservative media conglomerate Clear Channel, owner/operator of scores of TV, radio and other news media across the country. German for leader is Fuehrer. Our conservative government is railroading a dismantling of social programs under the guise of economic reform, while waving the banners of domestic safety initiatives as the best form of security for our nation. Unfortunately, security is not closed borders, guns on every corner and limited civil rights. We cant be secure if our roads, bridges and schools are crumbling; if our water, air and food are dirty; if people arent healthy because they cant pay to see their doctors; and if we must remain in the workforce until were 70-plus years old with an average lifespan of mid- to high 70s, what kind of American Dream retirement is that? And now we have the Orwellian Patriot Act and the just passed 563-page Intelligence Reform Bill (Have you read it? You authorized your conservative elected officials to vote for it. ...) to shield us from harms way and still no responsible economic solutions, no new jobs, no health insurance for all Americans. We did get, however, a conservative invasion of our schools to remind us of the apocalyptic future we have in store, as the Revelations-reading religious right proclaims at every turn, while generals and clergy boast that our presidents re-election was through divine intervention (Gen. William Boykin and Rev. Pat Robertson). As Hitler descended from the clouds in the Leni Riefenstahl propaganda film Triumph of the Will. ... Lets top if off with a Cornell University poll just released and reported by the Associated Press, warning that a near majority of citizens favor restricting the civil liberties of Muslim-Americans. Whats next, will they have to wear a red crescent on their clothes like Jews wore their Stars of David during the Third Reich? I know many of you reading this will think that this is merely the alarmist ranting of a disgruntled liberal. But think again. When we close our eyes to little things that happen around us, suddenly those small steps along a dangerous path take us far away from where we started. We are nearing the precipice. Our nation is evolving into something very dangerous, and we have a responsibility to stop it. Be afraid of those who follow these principles blindly, of those who profess their allegiance to our leader undyingly. Those who accuse my words of being anti-American and anti-Bush have, regrettably, succumbed to the mass hysteria being created by a new American fascism and will be held accountable as accomplices, just as many aging Germans bear their guilt-by-silence still to this day.

Richard Nantelle III holds degrees in German studies from UNC-Chapel Hill and Ohio State University. He lives in Asheville.
www.citizen-times.com...




posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 10:55 AM
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I will applaud Sen. Boxer if she decides to stand up and fight this wrong-doing.

Republicans and Democrats alike should be willing to explore any accusations of wrong-doing. If they re-act against an investigation, they are either complicit or scared of what they'll uncover.

[edit on 19-09-2003 by EastCoastKid]



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 11:01 AM
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More to chew on..



Preserving Democracy:
What Went Wrong in Ohio
Status Report of the House Judiciary Committee Democratic Staff

Wednesday 05 January 2005

Executive Summary

Representative John Conyers, Jr., the Ranking Democrat on the House Judiciary Committee, asked the Democratic staff to conduct an investigation into irregularities reported in the Ohio presidential election and to prepare a Status Report concerning the same prior to the Joint Meeting of Congress scheduled for January 6, 2005, to receive and consider the votes of the electoral college for president. The following Report includes a brief chronology of the events; summarizes the relevant background law; provides detailed findings (including factual findings and legal analysis); and describes various recommendations for acting on this Report going forward.

We have found numerous, serious election irregularities in the Ohio presidential election, which resulted in a significant disenfranchisement of voters. Cumulatively, these irregularities, which affected hundreds of thousand of votes and voters in Ohio, raise grave doubts regarding whether it can be said the Ohio electors selected on December 13, 2004, were chosen in a manner that conforms to Ohio law, let alone federal requirements and constitutional standards.

This report, therefore, makes three recommendations: (1) consistent with the requirements of the United States Constitution concerning the counting of electoral votes by Congress and Federal law implementing these requirements, there are ample grounds for challenging the electors from the State of Ohio; (2) Congress should engage in further hearings into the widespread irregularities reported in Ohio; we believe the problems are serious enough to warrant the appointment of a joint select Committee of the House and Senate to investigate and report back to the Members; and (3) Congress needs to enact election reform to restore our people's trust in our democracy. These changes should include putting in place more specific federal protections for federal elections, particularly in the areas of audit capability for electronic voting machines and casting and counting of provisional ballots, as well as other needed changes to federal and state election laws.
www.truthout.org...




Editorial: Don't certify Ohio results

An editorial
January 5, 2005

Indeed, the tightly focused debate that would follow upon acceptance of an objection could be just what is needed to get this Congress, and this country, talking about the steps that must be taken to ensure that American elections provide a true representation of the people's will. Yet as of now, no senators have expressed their intention to sign the statement of objection to certifying the Ohio results. It is for this reason that we urge Feingold and Kohl to join Conyers and members of the House in forcing a debate.
www.madison.com...



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 11:41 AM
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Barbara Boxer has just signed on to protest the results from Ohio. I guess this means she's not compromised in some way.



Democrats to Force Debate on Ohio Results

7 minutes ago Politics - U. S. Congress


By ALAN FRAM, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - A small group of Democrats agreed Thursday to force House and Senate debates on Election Day problems in Ohio before letting Congress certify President Bush (news - web sites)'s win over Sen. John Kerry (news - web sites) in November.
story.news.yahoo.com.../ap/20050106/ap_on_go_co/electoral_vote



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by Kidfinger

Originally posted by jsobecky

Clean and legal are very rarely one and the same. Legal is what counts in the end result.


So you admit to advocating a DIRTY system?
So, are you a representation of most conservatives? If so, it would seem that the conservatives who preach a so called higher moral level, are willing to accept dirty politics because a law makes it legal. Well thats a good outlook for our country


So if they legalize murdering someone because they took your tootsie roll, it would be OK. I mean, after all, there would be a law allowing it.

I just jumped back into this thread and lo and behold, another of Kidfinger's sophomoric attempts to twist words jumps off the screen.

Where did I ADVOCATE a dirty system, Kidfinger? Just because I ACKNOWLEDGE a dirty system does not mean that I ADVOCATE it. Is that really too difficult for you to grasp?

And your tootsie-roll analogies are so weak, they are best stuffed back up from whence they came.



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by jsobecky



Where did I ADVOCATE a dirty system, Kidfinger? Just because I ACKNOWLEDGE a dirty system does not mean that I ADVOCATE it. Is that really too difficult for you to grasp?


I guess you didnt type this.


Clean and legal are very rarely one and the same. Legal is what counts in the end result.


No, you dont advocate it.................lollollollol


And your tootsie-roll analogies are so weak, they are best stuffed back up from whence they came.


Hardly. You agree with everything Bush has done. You have defended everything Bush has done. And not only that, but you continue to lob insults because that is your only personal defence agianst your own ignorance.

It is absolutly true that you would advocate killing someone over something trivial if a law were made allowing such acts. Your statement alone says this.
Lets look at it one more time.


Clean and legal are very rarely one and the same. Legal is what counts in the end result.


If this is not how you really feel, I suggest you recant your previous statement that I quoted, because what I am accusing you of is exactly what you typed


Conservative denial..........PRICELESS!

C'mon jsobecky, got any more insults? Keep em coming. I LOVE the way you make the Bush supporters look. Its is a service to all Liberals that you so easily prove our points with every insult filled post you love to sling.

[edit on 1/6/05 by Kidfinger]



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 05:29 PM
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Please stop with the personal insults and inflammatory statements, Kidfinger. You are adding nothing to the discussion with these types of personal attacks.



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 05:59 PM
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Have you ever watched boxing?

"Keep it clean..."



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 06:57 PM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
Please stop with the personal insults and inflammatory statements, Kidfinger. You are adding nothing to the discussion with these types of personal attacks.

What I added to the conversation was a look into your point of view, which you didnt appreciate. I think you have confused me for yourself jb. Not once have I insulted you except when I suggested ignorance. Ignorance is not an insult. It simply means that you have no knowledge of a particular subject.

You are the one who resorts to name calling and mud slinging. I have done my best to stick to the facts here. I have avoided making insinuations that you are a child abuser ( which you have done to me.) and calling you a loser because I dont believe in your ideals (which you have done to me as well.). I could go on to list the insults you have thrown at me. I do believe you were even warned once for it.

It sounds to me like you might have a guilty conscience.



posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 01:21 AM
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What is your problem, Kidfinger? What gives you the right to come in here and "accuse" people of things that you know are lies?

I made a statement of fact. You accuse me of advocation of those facts. What kind of game are you trying to play?

You don't insult? What is this?

It is absolutly true that you would advocate killing someone over something trivial if a law were made allowing such acts.


Yes, I got a warning one time because I called you a troll. These last few posts prove that I was correct. But I doubt very much if the mods will take any action against you. That's OK too.



posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 01:40 AM
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Kid, I have to say that you took a small comment and built something onto it that greatly exceeded its capacity.

Nevertheless, who cares, calm down both of you. It's pretty silly to get mad in a faceless platform. It has the capacity to have a face and honor, but it is more likely to be anonymous.

Anyway, no one know if it was fixed or not, from the Abortion voter to the gay marriage voter.

This election was a sham based solely on its stage production and the same sound bits being said by the reps all up and down the DNC and RNC chain of command.

The propaganda was thick and idiotic, and the 527s were prominent along with some media help.

Why fight about the lesser of two men? Are either really capable of handling the monolith government we have in Washington?

I don't think anyone is, because it's really too big to handle.



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 09:13 AM
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It looks as if the scandal is not gonna go away like Rove wishes...


It sure would be sweet if this festers into a gaping administration wound into Bush's second term. As Nixon watchers can attest, there's always impeachment.



Many Americans Refuse to Concede 'Stolen Election'
On Eve of Bush's Inauguration, Challenges Continue

by Leila Atassi

While a two-hour debate raged on the floors of the U.S. House and Senate over the certification of the presidential election, more than 400 activists waited outside to learn which of their leaders would join their cause.

Under an overcast sky, the Rev. Jesse Jackson told the activists - still refusing to accept the results of the November election - not to be bitter.

As he spoke, many of them wept, because for some, the anger over what they refer to as "the stolen election" is precisely what won't let them let go.

It has been more than two months since President Bush declared victory. But the activists who assembled Thursday in Washington, D.C., and countless others across the country say they refuse to concede and have made investigating voter irregularities in Ohio their top priority - sometimes forsaking their livelihood or former selves.
www.commondreams.org...



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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Yeah right. Blackwell is a partisan hack and should be held to account.



Ohio Letter Seeks Illegal Contributions

COLUMBUS, Ohio (AP) - The state's chief elections officer, accused of mishandling the presidential vote in Ohio, sent a fund-raising letter for his own 2006 gubernatorial campaign that was accompanied by a request for illegal contributions.

A pledge card with the letter from Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell, a Republican who co-chaired the Bush-Cheney election campaign in Ohio, said "corporate & personal checks are welcome."

Corporate donations are illegal in Ohio.

His spokesman, Carlo LoParo, said Saturday that any corporate donations would be returned.

A group of voters citing fraud has challenged Bush's 118,500-vote win in Ohio with the state Supreme Court, citing irregularities including long lines, a shortage of voting machines in minority precincts and problems with computer equipment.

Blackwell has maintained that he is permitted to campaign for Bush and that Ohio's election system has checks and balances to ensure fair elections.

"I have an obligation to follow the law," Blackwell said.



Copyright 2005 by The Associated Press.
All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
www.wjla.com...



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 04:37 PM
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This is a kid from the west coast.

Sorry to report the death of all your liberal dreams on overturning the popular will of the people in this election. Bush was confirmed by the electoral college electoral college certificates and will be inaugurated on January 20th, 2005.

My suggestion is for you to Moveon(.org)



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 05:22 PM
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www.scoop.co.nz...

is an interview with Cameron Kerry on things strategeric and otherwise.



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 05:27 PM
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Originally posted by djohnsto77
The software of these machines was tested and the source code examined by the States and shown to be accurate


Your search - "source code examined by the States " - did not match any documents.

Please attribute this to a credible source.



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 05:45 PM
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Good grief, amazing that this thread is still alive.
BTW, really want to see real fraud at work? Look no further that Washington State's Governor race and one will see why the majority of Democrats continue to keep the focus on "Ohio": distracting from real voting frauds and practices, courtesy of the Democratic Party.

I, for one, wish that a full investigation would take place in "Ohio" so that maybe we can all, once and for all, see that both sides had a hand in the problems of "Ohio", unlike the Democratic under-handedness that they perpetuated in Washington State....but hey, I guess whats going on in Washington State has no bearing on such a pivit state as "Ohio", being it was to determine the next President of the U.S., despite what is taking place in Washington State implies, huh?



BTW: note to ECK, and others, please re-read your initial article that started this thread:


There are many conspiracy theorists opining these days. There are many allegations of fraud. But this presidential election is over. The Bush-Cheney ticket has won. The Kerry-Edwards campaign has found no conspiracy and no fraud in Ohio, though there have been many irregularities that cry out to be fixed for future elections.


May the farce continue to be with you.







seekerof

[edit on 11-1-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Jan, 11 2005 @ 06:04 PM
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Originally posted by Noumenon

Originally posted by djohnsto77
The software of these machines was tested and the source code examined by the States and shown to be accurate


Your search - "source code examined by the States " - did not match any documents.

Please attribute this to a credible source.


I don't have time to look up the laws and procedures of each of the 50 States, especially since like seekerof alluded this thread is beating dead horse. Generally it is the law of most if not all states that the chief elections official of the State, usually the Secretary of State, must inspect and approve any type of voting machine used in the state and certify that it works accurately. There's some information about Federal Elections Committee standards here: www.uselections.com....

[edit on 1/11/2005 by djohnsto77]



posted on Jan, 13 2005 @ 03:50 PM
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www.chuckherrin.com... is something I thought most people interested in this issue would have had a look at by now. An IT expert. He claims to be a Republican disgusted by the current administration, as others are. Obviously one can't cover the entire voting fraud possibility issue in one link but he provides links for responsible researchers to look at the electronic hacking possibilities. Black Box Voting covers a lot of the same stuff but are holding back on a lot of info to sell the book of the same name. I myself am not a Democrat. I tend to be repulsed by "lesser of two evils" choices. I am Vietnam era, never served, escaped the draft lottery narrowly. I knew a few Vietnam Veterans Against the War and they were all stand-up guys. I don't say that lightly.

I voted for Kerry. I often wish for a Libertarian candidate with the historical savvy, policy knowledge, muscle and connections to actually run the Executive branch.

The door is wide open for election fraud and there is nothing - nothing - that will convince me that after Rove's dirty tricks regarding McCain in S. Carolina, for example, they would stop at anything to keep power. Honor? As far as I am concerned, they don't have it. It's proven.

Beating a dead horse? Is the possible death of democracy, not on persistant but local election fraud issues, but nationwide, something to be just pooh-poohed? I don't KNOW what happened in election 2004, and you don't either. THAT'S what concerns people.



posted on Jan, 13 2005 @ 04:04 PM
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Yes, beating a dead horse.

That seems to be the conclusion of many regarding democracy in the US courtesy of election fraud... that the electorate should suffer the consequences of its action as if it elected the Bush administration a second time, and that it does not matter that no audits were carries out on EITHER the tabulation systems of the voting machines specified and designed (and sometimes approved) by criminal cronies OR the reasons for their bizarre field performance.

Carry on as normal, your vote doesn't count and who cares anyway it makes no difference, that is democracy in the US. A dead horse.



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