I need some help. I met a sovereign citizen. And Tech ?

Im going to try to keep it concise, but there are some interesting questions that I need some help with. (A full thread will follow if all goes well) I've found myself interested in the fmotl movement, sovereign citizen, whatever you want to call it, I'm not big on labels. I've read quite a bit on the subject, but I never thought I would actually meet someone practicing it.

I was talking with an acquaintance and a stranger, when the conversation suddenly took a very libertarian turn, at which point the stranger asked the acq if he had an open mind. Of course.

At this point he identified himself as a soveriegn by saying, " I have learned how to pay bills with my ssn." I had several questions, and we talked for a small bit, and he appeared on the level. He said he had all the info and documents. I gave him my phone number and asked if we could please talk when I had more time, and he agreed. This is where it gets really interesting.

I ran into the acquaintance later that evening (small world), and while he knew next to nothing of the movement, he had stayed and chatted with the stranger for some time after he left. He told me that the stranger had offerred him all the info for a nominal fee, on a cell phone sim card. At this point i recalled him asking me if my phone had a sim card, which it does not.

Now two days later, i receive a call, from the guy. After some pleasantries he asks if i am still interested in all of the info. I said absolutely, (perhaps a little giddy at getting a scoop to bring here), and he asked if i had a laptop. I said that I did. I do not. I told him i would not be in his area again for a week.

So now I want to buy a cheap netbook to go through with this. If I had a laptop, I would certainly wipe it clean as my know how allowed prior to meeting him.

It is this SIM card business that gives me pause. Ive never heard of transferring info this way, and arent they tied directly to your phone number?

Is there some scam I am unaware of?

What can i use, software etc, to monitor anything that his dox attempt to do on my as yet unpurchased netbook?

Is there anything, hardware or software, i should take into consideration choosing a netbook for this purpose?

Finally, if all goes well, which forum do i post the results in?


Thanks for your help, i apologize in advance for mistakes and clarity, on mobile.

SIM card is indeed a phone card that has a bit of extra storage. He may have meant a flash memory card, which doesn't contain any phone number company info on it, just a storage space.
Flash Card

SIM Card

a reply to: ISawItFirst

Why pay for info that:

1) Is legal garbage that will get you arrested, prosecuted and possibly beaten or shot if you attempt to use it?

2) Is readily available all over the Internet and Youtube anyway?

Most Sov scams are just that, scams. Somebody promising to give you the Freeman on the Land secret mojo sauce of Maritime Law, mixed with a dose of Magna Carta, jumbled into abstract and half-baked legalese and all for the low, low price of X amount of dollars.

Over the years I've studied this subject a lot and every single video posted claiming that a Sov won? Trace them all and the best cases merely end up being some idiot talked garbage and walked out of court - always civil court - proclaiming victory on the video... and then the court documents always say "Summary judgment" against the sov. Yet the videos don't mention that part, because they wouldn't sell if they did.

Of course a few members will show up and swear that they don't have legal drivers licenses or insurance and insist that they've made cops walk away and respect their authoritah... but to date I've never seen a single bit of actual proof to support a single claim.

This absolutely sounds like a scam.

If he wants money, then its a scam.

This is a common tactic by pyramid schemers. They act very confident but very enigmatic about what exactly they do. Their offers always sound too good to be true, because they are.

I remember I worked for Home depot, right out of high school. This customer came in saying he was looking for a guy that helped him last week because he wanted to offer him a job because he said he seemed very bright. I said I didn't know who it could have been. In reality he wasn't talking about anyone, he was bating me.

He gives me some DVD to watch, I watched about 5 minutes when I got home. I concluded it was a scheme in that short amount of time. I threw the DVD in the trash. The guy then keeps calling my work wanting the DVD back and getting kinda psycho, I tell him finally, I threw it away, he says I owe him 100 bucks. I laugh and hang up. Never saw him again.

a reply to: ISawItFirst

I was going to offer some comments but Heff pretty much nailed it.

There's a reason sovereign citizens' bullsnip only works for a few years. But hey, what a jolly few years it is!

originally posted by: Hefficide
a reply to: ISawItFirst

Why pay for info that:

1) Is legal garbage that will get you arrested, prosecuted and possibly beaten or shot if you attempt to use it?

2) Is readily available all over the Internet and Youtube anyway?

Most Sov scams are just that, scams. Somebody promising to give you the Freeman on the Land secret mojo sauce of Maritime Law, mixed with a dose of Magna Carta, jumbled into abstract and half-baked legalese and all for the low, low price of X amount of dollars.

Over the years I've studied this subject a lot and every single video posted claiming that a Sov won? Trace them all and the best cases merely end up being some idiot talked garbage and walked out of court - always civil court - proclaiming victory on the video... and then the court documents always say "Summary judgment" against the sov. Yet the videos don't mention that part, because they wouldn't sell if they did.

Of course a few members will show up and swear that they don't have legal drivers licenses or insurance and insist that they've made cops walk away and respect their authoritah... but to date I've never seen a single bit of actual proof to support a single claim.

Yah, im with you. I've done much of that which you have. I agree with most of what you have said, thats why when i met someone who talked the talk, and claimed tk be able to back it up with proof, my ears perked.

It may well be a scam. He hasnt mentioned selling me anything, but thats why i am trying to protect myself.

a reply to: ISawItFirst

They all talk the talk.

And that's all they can do: talk.

a reply to: ISawItFirst

Drop it altogether. See Hef's post above.

OTOH, I am a Nigerian Princess and if you just give me your bank account info........

not.

The only thing you will get is some layman's legal mumbo jumbo. It is not legal and will only result is trouble if you try and use it. There may be some good points, but we have gone way beyond what is constitutionally relevant at this point and you are subject to their police powers whether you like it or not. They are not taking their toys and going away. I realize you are wanting to get this info, but why spend money on bogus bs? You can read all their stuff on the net anyway. If you want to be free of US laws, you better emigrate while you still can to a country that is not bent on violating human rights. Our constitution is being violated en mass at this point. When Bush said the constitution is just a GD piece of paper, he let out exactly what your rulers think of it. It would take massive resistance to change that. Even never taking a plea agreement would clog the system up beyond functioning and that is legal to do.

If you want to spend your money, get an annotated book of laws the police use against you. You can only win by knowing exactly what the laws are and interpretation the legal community is using them in court against you as. Keeping your mouth shut except answering your identity questions and providing the necessary instruments that you are required to will go a long way. Often you hear police say are you sure when stating the law. Or they ask you what it means. If you do and clearly so, they will not overstep it in most cases. But, people that go out there with some pseudo law and don't understand the laws and legal interpretations used by the state are only going to find trouble.

a reply to: ISawItFirst

This is probably a scam, if he isn't one of those who believe their own bull#. Paying bill with his ssn? Think about it.

HOWEVER, I think you should go talk to him more and then post how it goes. Might get some entertainment out of it. If he gives you some documents or whatever, share them with us.

But don't give him credit card numbers or anything that he can use to actually rob you or hurt you.

I have no idea what he wants with the sim card. Offer to use a USB drive instead. If that's a no go then you can be sure he trying something shady. Absolutely no reason to insist on the sim card weirdness.

I reiterate: see what he wants to offer, make a thread about the experience, but do not let him take advantage of you. This way others who may be approached in the same way will know what it is all about.

I have no intention of paying for anything.

Nationality plays into his schemes, im sure, but what im most interested in is any proof of monetization.

I get what all of you are saying, and I agree, but there is more to this guy than meets the eye, and if he has documents surely they warrant a look see.

Im not interested in trying to replicate his methods, i just want to see them.

a reply to: Subnatural

Thanks for posting, you get where my head is.

Im almost more interested if it is a scam. Ive never heard of a sim card scam, and perhaps if there is malicipus code involved, the smart people here can help me to expose it for what it is.

originally posted by: ISawItFirst


I get what all of you are saying, and I agree, but there is more to this guy than meets the eye,

This is exactly how they want you to see them. This is an act and it just means he is skilled in the trade-craft.

Their whole act is to seem mysterious and intriguing.

originally posted by: bananashooter

originally posted by: ISawItFirst


I get what all of you are saying, and I agree, but there is more to this guy than meets the eye,

This is exactly how they want you to see them. This is an act and it just means he is skilled in the trade-craft.

Their whole act is to seem mysterious and intriguing.

How many have you met? Are you in their union or something? Get the newsletter?

I was careful not to give my impressions of this guy for a number of reasons.

I read people for a living, but i didnt want to color the dialogue in such a manner.

Im fairly well versed in scams, grifts, flim flams, angle shoots, and their respective provacateurs.

Im not sure thats not what this is, but the time to describe the details of this guys person, and what i gathered conversationally about his life, is some other, if at all.

So take my more than meets the eye comment as there are likely more interesting details to this story yet to be discovered.

a reply to: ISawItFirst

For what it's worth, as a person who lives in a somewhat rural area of the deep south, I have met several. My former landlord, who lived next door to the home I rented, was a total and absolute Sovereign. He and I spoke at great length on the issue.

The end of the story is: After he failed to convert me, his latch ditch effort was to inform me that the world is controlled by thirteen ancient families of draconian lizard aliens. No lie. Other Sov's have never gone that deep with me, but this man was deeply interested in getting me to join his cause and apparently he felt that the lizard "secret" would be the one thing I could not argue nor deny. That it would be the factor that pushed me in.

In fact his great revelation was that the Magna Carta was not actually a contract between classes, but, rather, was a peace treaty between the humans and our reptilian overlords. From that, he explained, all of the other Freeman on the Land "secrets" flowed.

Unfortunately he had two facts working against him. First that, as an ATS member, talk of reptoids was not new to me, so I didn't succumb to the "shocking truth". Secondly, as I was not bashed in the head with a cinder block, as an infant, I was equipped to use basic logic to kind of sort things out.

I should note that one of the high points of our little discussions was when he explained to me that the Commerce Clause meant that the government could not make a person pay to "travel" at all. No drivers licenses, no tags, no insurance, no registration... All totally illegal. And he assured me that he had handed many a Judge their own asses in court over just this issue...

Only upon the bumper of his brand new truck sat a valid and current license plate. In order to get said license plate he had to have a valid drivers license, a valid registration and valid insurance. When I pointed this out he balked and brushed it off, saying "Yeah, yeah, yeah. See, I messed up as a teenager and got a drivers license before I knew these things. Once I did that I was forever tied to my strawman..."

Of course you, OP, are free to do as you wish. But the reality is that if you do get sucked in and you try to use whatever this guy says or teaches you? It won't work. Then, when you confront him about it, he'll just say something like "Oh, you forgot to say this, so of course it didn't work!" or "Sadly, you already signed a legal document, tying you to your strawman. You had already consented by default..." or "You didn't push hard enough. You were too timid and the cop violated your God given rights".

It never ends well.

originally posted by: Hefficide
a reply to: ISawItFirst

For what it's worth, as a person who lives in a somewhat rural area of the deep south, I have met several. My former landlord, who lived next door to the home I rented, was a total and absolute Sovereign. He and I spoke at great length on the issue.

The end of the story is: After he failed to convert me, his latch ditch effort was to inform me that the world is controlled by thirteen ancient families of draconian lizard aliens. No lie. Other Sov's have never gone that deep with me, but this man was deeply interested in getting me to join his cause and apparently he felt that the lizard "secret" would be the one thing I could not argue nor deny. That it would be the factor that pushed me in.

In fact his great revelation was that the Magna Carta was not actually a contract between classes, but, rather, was a peace treaty between the humans and our reptilian overlords. From that, he explained, all of the other Freeman on the Land "secrets" flowed.

Unfortunately he had two facts working against him. First that, as an ATS member, talk of reptoids was not new to me, so I didn't succumb to the "shocking truth". Secondly, as I was not bashed in the head with a cinder block, as an infant, I was equipped to use basic logic to kind of sort things out.

I should note that one of the high points of our little discussions was when he explained to me that the Commerce Clause meant that the government could not make a person pay to "travel" at all. No drivers licenses, no tags, no insurance, no registration... All totally illegal. And he assured me that he had handed many a Judge their own asses in court over just this issue...

Only upon the bumper of his brand new truck sat a valid and current license plate. In order to get said license plate he had to have a valid drivers license, a valid registration and valid insurance. When I pointed this out he balked and brushed it off, saying "Yeah, yeah, yeah. See, I messed up as a teenager and got a drivers license before I knew these things. Once I did that I was forever tied to my strawman..."

Of course you, OP, are free to do as you wish. But the reality is that if you do get sucked in and you try to use whatever this guy says or teaches you? It won't work. Then, when you confront him about it, he'll just say something like "Oh, you forgot to say this, so of course it didn't work!" or "Sadly, you already signed a legal document, tying you to your strawman. You had already consented by default..." or "You didn't push hard enough. You were too timid and the cop violated your God given rights".

It never ends well.

So, Aliens then?


Thanks, didn't think wed get there!

To reiterate, i have no intention of filing ucc papers or anything crazy as such. I have my own reasons for being interested in this topic, none of which involve taking any action other than investigating.

OH, and this guy had the proper answers for your DL, i asked him what he had on his car bumper. That topic is for the thread ill write if i can verify his claims.

a reply to: ISawItFirst
Okay, now you piqued my interest. What are you a detective or a psychic or a mentalist or something else?

I read people for a living, but i didnt want to color the dialogue in such a manner.

edit on 6-8-2015 by bananashooter because: (no reason given)

a reply to: bananashooter

I should have been a detective, if i didn't believe I'd have had to spend 3-5 years #ing on people to become one, i probably would have went for it.

I was hoping the guys answers for the most obvious soveriegn questions would have piqued the most, but I am pretty interesting myself.

Ive had some personal undeniable scrapes with the paranormal, but I dont claim any such abilities, and although I do a few very convincing prestidigitations, Ive never given in to mentalism, and ive never done them for profit, other than the occasional bar tab.

Ill put it this way, when i tell a guy Im calling his bluff, I mean it literally.

a reply to: ISawItFirst

So you go around declaring ownership's of other peoples escarpments for a living?

a reply to: bananashooter


Who ever truly owns an escarmpment anyways. I call them, but it always goes straight to VM.