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Dear Atheists: I will prove to you that there is a Creator to the universe. Come debate me.

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posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:06 PM
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originally posted by: Aloysius the Gaul
a reply to: TzarChasm

Is that one of the "traditional family values" we should be keeping??



along with marrying your sister off at the earliest possible age to the richest man possible. especially if that man is you. and stoning people for looking at your wife. and stoning your wife for being outside of the kitchen. you know, the basics.




posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:17 PM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

What kind of evidence do you not see?



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:18 PM
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a reply to: randyvs

anything that is vaguely reasonable - supported by something other than itself, explainable in terms that do not require incredulity, that sort of thing.


edit on 11-8-2015 by Aloysius the Gaul because: Expand a bit so as not to be too dogmatic!




posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:22 PM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

Then your argument is just a difference of opinion.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:22 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

What kind of evidence do you not see?


oooh, ooh, can i try?

um...imaginary evidence!

did i get it?



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:22 PM
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originally posted by: Barcs

originally posted by: TheChrome
I would disagree with you. For the majority of history there was no such thing as a photograph. The only way to depict current circumstances was by art. Realism is not subjective, but depicts subjects and objects just like a real time photograph. Trying to turn every piece of historical artwork into a Picasso, saying all art is subjective, is a skewed thought process, and not based on any sound reasoning.


I didn't say that it was ALL subjective or abstract. HOWEVER, you can't logically say that all art depicts reality either, so unless you can prove which ones are real and which ones are fantasy, you can't use it as an argument. Many pictures have been painted based on stories, fantasies and myths. How exactly do you determine the difference without making assumptions? Sorry, but your argument is devoid of logic.

Like I said, if you think art proves god, then I can prove Lord of the Rings, Star Wars, or Zeus.


I understand what you are saying, but let's get one thing straight, I was not trying to prove there is a God by posting that photo.

What I was doing is establishing a frame of reference, that the idea Christians have that Jesus died on a cross, may not be accurate or fully supported by historical evidence. The writings by Josephus also support a non-cross execution.

Propaganda is similar to tradition. They are false advertising methods to mislead the masses. To find truth, a person has to pull out the shovel and dig through the dirt.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:29 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

Then your argument is just a difference of opinion.


an argument is a set of premise leading to a conclusion. If you can show such an argument then we can discuss the validity of the premise, and whether or not they lead to the conclusion - but you have not - you have just said something you believe in - that is not an argument.

I don't have an argument - I do not see the evidence I require to understand your statement as true.

I do not say there cannot be such evidence...but I do say I don't see it.

I certainly think that belief is a matter of opinion - but as has been pointed out many times, this thread is supposedly about PROOF.....the issue of belief has never been in dispute AFAIK.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:32 PM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

That is correct
I'll concede your point Gaul.

However if Jesus existed and I believe he is God?



I would call that evidence.
edit on Rpm81115v36201500000038 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:37 PM
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a reply to: randyvs

Thanks - It is the statement that there is PROOF of god that is contentious, or that I MUST see something that someone else sees in the same way as they do - the compulsion aspect.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:38 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

Then your argument is just a difference of opinion.


Repeat. This thread is not about opinion.

The OP addressed atheist claiming he can PROVE God.

Can you do that?



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:42 PM
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originally posted by: TheChrome

originally posted by: Barcs

originally posted by: TheChrome
I would disagree with you. For the majority of history there was no such thing as a photograph. The only way to depict current circumstances was by art. Realism is not subjective, but depicts subjects and objects just like a real time photograph. Trying to turn every piece of historical artwork into a Picasso, saying all art is subjective, is a skewed thought process, and not based on any sound reasoning.


I didn't say that it was ALL subjective or abstract. HOWEVER, you can't logically say that all art depicts reality either, so unless you can prove which ones are real and which ones are fantasy, you can't use it as an argument. Many pictures have been painted based on stories, fantasies and myths. How exactly do you determine the difference without making assumptions? Sorry, but your argument is devoid of logic.

Like I said, if you think art proves god, then I can prove Lord of the Rings, Star Wars, or Zeus.



What I was doing is establishing a frame of reference, that the idea Christians have that Jesus died on a cross, may not be accurate or fully supported by historical evidence. The writings by Josephus also support a non-cross execution.

Propaganda is similar to tradition. They are false advertising methods to mislead the masses. To find truth, a person has to pull out the shovel and dig through the dirt.


In my internet/forum travels, pretty sure researchers have never found punishment by "cross" in that area/time.

A single wooden stake in the ground --- maybe.
edit on 11-8-2015 by Annee because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:42 PM
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a reply to: randyvs

Yes your belief is evidence - I happen to think that it is not very good evidence tho'.

Just like if I say there are invisible unicorns in my garage - that is evidence too...........but also not very good evidence!!


good evidence has a degree of support from checkable and/or independent sources.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:44 PM
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originally posted by: Annee
In my internet/forum travels, pretty sure researchers have never found punishment by "cross" in that area/time.

A single wooden stake in the ground --- maybe.


there's lots of evidence for Roman crucifictions - although the "cross" might not have ben the classically depicted "t" of the christian crucifix - wiki article on crucifiction
edit on 11-8-2015 by Aloysius the Gaul because: quote tag



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:46 PM
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originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: TheChrome

You talk about the light/circle around Jesus' head.

Ever heard of Auras?

As I've said, I believe everything is energy. I believe in different vibrations and frequencies.

I do believe there was a man the myth Jesus was based on. Kind of like Johnny Appleseed.

He may have been an enlightened man (no, not a god), but a person with an energy that affects people.

We've all met people we are attracted to, people we want to be around because their energy makes us feel good, or energetic, or powerful, etc.



I am familiar with Auras, and according the tests I am Indigo.

Jesus (Not in a biblical context) on the other hand was clearly cut and pasted from mythology to convert the Roman masses. He was pasted upon Jupiter. To become the new sun god. He was pasted to follow the traditions of Utu, Shamash, Ra, Surya, Mithra, Apollo etc.

To understand truth, you must be able to identify tradition and propaganda and cull it out.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:48 PM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

But Jesus wasn't a rhinoceros as the Bible mentions unicorns.



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:50 PM
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a reply to: randyvs

funny....



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:50 PM
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a reply to: Barcs


I claim Man and apes have separate ancestry based upon the following facts...

evolutionists use highly imaginative "transitional form" between man and ape like creatures based upon fragmentary evidence though... while the fossil record documents separate origins for primates...
Or monkeys apes and man...

there are no "fossil traces" of a transformation from "ape like" to "man"...

Fossils of Neaderthal man and the features exhibited were at one time considered to elude to a primitive "sub human" known as "Homo Neandertalensis"...

However these primitive features are now know to have been caused by nutritional deficiency and pathological conditions...

he is now classified as fully human...

Also "Ramapithecus" was once considered to be partially "manlike"...
but Is now known to be fully "ape like"...

many evolutionists are also mislead by the acceptance of two "missing links"
Proven to be fraud in the case of Pitdown Man "Eoanthropus"
As well as a Pigs tooth in the case of Nebraska Man "Hesperopithecus"...

I have stated facts to back up my argument other arguments against this can not yet be claimed to be factual...


edit on 11-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: Spell

edit on 11-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: Spell



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:50 PM
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originally posted by: Aloysius the Gaul

good evidence has a degree of support from checkable and/or independent sources.



Some like to use paranormal (for lack of better word) as proof of God.

I've had a lot of experiences since first memory. I do believe we are all "ripples in the same pond". Waves Hi to Odo.

Evidence? It's all interpretation of experience. If you're raised to believe it's God, thats probably what you will believe.

Human conditioning.
edit on 11-8-2015 by Annee because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:54 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

That is correct
I'll concede your point Gaul.

However if Jesus existed and I believe he is God?



I would call that evidence.


a youtube video barely qualifies as evidence, and only if it provides citations, sources, verifiable claims. but the crux here is not evidence, it is proof. indisputable data that exclusively and conclusively points to a statement of verifiable (read: falsifiable) fact.

and according to such standards, your video fails dismally. not a huge surprise seeing as how its ehrman.

who, by the way, identifies as agnostic. check out his book "jesus interrupted".



posted on Aug, 11 2015 @ 04:57 PM
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originally posted by: TheChrome

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: TheChrome

You talk about the light/circle around Jesus' head.

Ever heard of Auras?

As I've said, I believe everything is energy. I believe in different vibrations and frequencies.

I do believe there was a man the myth Jesus was based on. Kind of like Johnny Appleseed.

He may have been an enlightened man (no, not a god), but a person with an energy that affects people.

We've all met people we are attracted to, people we want to be around because their energy makes us feel good, or energetic, or powerful, etc.



I am familiar with Auras, and according the tests I am Indigo.

Jesus (Not in a biblical context) on the other hand was clearly cut and pasted from mythology to convert the Roman masses. He was pasted upon Jupiter. To become the new sun god. He was pasted to follow the traditions of Utu, Shamash, Ra, Surya, Mithra, Apollo etc.

To understand truth, you must be able to identify tradition and propaganda and cull it out.



OK. I have read all that stuff, from various perspectives.

I'm just too old now to let it take time in my life. I used to keep files of information.



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