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Dear Atheists: I will prove to you that there is a Creator to the universe. Come debate me.

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posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 10:32 PM
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a reply to: Barcs

I have come to the conclusion that I am a conspiracy...

Too much...

Lol...

Refute me or shove off...




posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:04 PM
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a reply to: 5StarOracle

Stop using argument from ignorance or shove off yourself.



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:06 PM
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originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: Barcs

What is my cause?


As far as I can tell it is the sight of your own messages.



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:10 PM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

that is argument from ignorance from you though...

And aside from that the basis of my argument has been based on the reality creation is governed by...

edit on 9-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: Add



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:21 PM
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a reply to: 5StarOracle

you should read what an argument from ignorance is before you condemn it.



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:26 PM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

I read it...

That's what you did when you presumed to know what my cause is...

You could argue that's what I did but I would of course disagree because I offered it up as my view and nothing more...

You have not changed my mind...
edit on 9-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: ...


I think I have ruffled some feather because of the plausibility...
edit on 9-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: ...



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:46 PM
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originally posted by: Aloysius the Gaul
a reply to: 5StarOracle

Stop using argument from ignorance or shove off yourself.



How about Circular Reasoning?



Circular reasoning is often of the form: "A is true because B is true; B is true because A is true.

en.m.wikipedia.org...


"The bible is true, because it says it is"

"God has always existed, because God is the Creator"



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:52 PM
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originally posted by: 5StarOracle

but I do believe in time travel I just don't have the proof...


I guess with Capt Kirk as your avatar you would...


I do not think forward travel is possible unless you feel it is all set already, and doesn't happen as it unfolds. Pass time travel happens every time you look at a star, but I'm not sure if it is possible with physical elements. It would seem we would be cluttered with time travelers if it was possible....



posted on Aug, 9 2015 @ 11:54 PM
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originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: Barcs

I have come to the conclusion that I am CONFUSED...

Too much...

Lol...

Refute me or shove off...





There you go fixed it for ya...



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:11 AM
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a reply to: Annee

Maybe it was this...

en.m.wikipedia.org...



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:23 AM
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a reply to: 5StarOracle

Here's some truth for you Capt. This is just a short yet powerful and insightful bit of profound wisdom in this video from a couple of great minds of our day. True modern day sages if you will. I'm even including the lyrics so you can think about exactly what they're saying. Let it sink in and I think you'll find there is much more Truth and Understanding in what they say than what's there at the surface. It may not be the answer to all your questions but it is a core truth that we all know deep down whether or not we admit it.


Lyrics:

Is this real?
Or is this just a ride?

The world is like a ride
You think it's real - it's just a ride
And we can change it any time we want
It's only a choice - between fear and love

The ride goes up and down and round and round
It has thrills and chills and it's very brightly colored
Up and down and round and round
And it's very loud

Don't worry, don't be afraid
It's just a ride
And we can change it any time we want
It's only a choice between fear and love

Why are we here?
I think we're part of a bigger wisdom
That we won't ever understand
A higher order - call it what you want -
Know what I call it?

The Big Electron
Whoa Whoa, Whoa Whoa

It doesn't punish, doesn't reward
It doesn't judge at all
It just is and so are we
For a little while
edit on 10-8-2015 by mOjOm because: (no reason given)

edit on 10-8-2015 by mOjOm because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:35 AM
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originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

I read it...

That's what you did when you presumed to know what my cause is...


Not at all -that was presumption - an entirely different fallacy


If you think me presuming to know what your cause is is argument from ignorance then you did not understand what you read about that - assuming you did read it and are not simply lying.


edit on 10-8-2015 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 12:55 AM
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originally posted by: Aloysius the Gaul

originally posted by: TheChrome


It's not a question of whether God is unable to prevent evil, he can. It's not a question whether he is malevolent, he isn't. It's that he has established a specific time period for those opposing him to prove their point that we as humans can govern ourselves and live separate from God.


So there is something opposing him/her/it??

Why did he/she/it create that??


How have we done? We have created wars, polluted the earth, and every advancement we make in technology we generally use to our demise rather than our benefit. We cannot end sickness, poverty, or death.


Ah - is this the "free will" argument?

God wants to see what we do with out free will??

From the same link above:


The free will defense is as follows:
1/ Maintaining free will is more important than removing evil.
2/ Altering someone's ability to impact others, in any way, removes their free will.
3/ Thus, an omnipotent omniscient (OO) entity cannot prevent evil without also removing free will.

One might question exactly what makes "free will" so good. Proponents of divine command theory might argue that free will is good because it is a part of God's nature or beliefs, while others might try to make the claim that total freedom really is good. One might wonder why most theists then support any attempts by people or governments to prevent the crimes which God apparently doesn't want to. If free will is so important, why does God allow brainwashing?

This should also count for those who believe in demonic possession, especially if the demons doing the possessing have free will themselves. Why does the free will of the brainwasher matter more than the free will of the victim? Furthermore, "free will" is merely the ability to choose among available options.

The ability to have all options available is not free will but omnipotence. Humans are not able to kill each other by simply wishing it; does the lack of this ability mean that humans do not have free will? There are already restrictions on humans' ability to kill each other.

So, is the current level of ability somehow "optimal"? (Having free will to decide on accomplishing an action deemed evil is not the same as being able to accomplish it)

Furthermore, one may argue that omniscience and free will are mutually exclusive:
1/ A truly all-knowing being will know everything that will ever occur in the future before it occurs.
2/ An all-knowing being's knowledge cannot be flawed.
3/ From Items 1 and 2, an all-knowing being will know, in advance, what decisions will be made before a decision is made.
4/ From Item 2, this knowledge must be true.
5/ From Item 3, all decisions have already been made in the all-knowing entity's knowledge before they occur.
6/ From Item 4, nobody can freely make a decision because its result is known in advance. Therefore, free will is mutually exclusive with an omniscient entity.

One of the more effective rebuttals to the argument of Free Will is to ask whether there is free will in heaven. If the answer is "yes", then the next logical question to ask would be "If God can create Heaven with free will AND no sin, why didn't he just do it with this life?"

Which brings us back to questioning the theist idea of omnibenevolence. If the answer is "no", then naturally the question of "why then is free will so valuable?" gets raised.


Your turn again......


I disagree with the previous illogical arguments. Free Will is the ability to make decisions for oneself, yet understanding that there are certain consequences for deviating from what is good. If I decide one day to call my boss an @$$hole, I am probably going to get fired rather than promoted. He may have hired me with the assumption that I would do a good job and did not expect for me to create dissent.

Similarly God created Spirits and Humans with the expectation they would do good, but at a certain point Satan chose to rebel and bring others down with him. True, God can look into the future and foretell the future, but did he create perfect beings with the knowledge they would rebel? No! God also has a choice. To trust. While he knows everything that happens to everyone, he doesn't necessarily have to peer into the future as to what choices his creation makes.

It's really not hard to understand that there are morals that guide us, and choosing to set those morals aside causes hurt to us and others. If a person expresses their free will by murdering or raping, then I think anyone with morality would agree these things are not good things. These very things are what Satan and his followers promote, and therefore they choose to pervert their thinking intentionally into something contrary to Godly ethics.

That beckons the question, what is total freedom? Would it not be being free from guilt and fear, and feeling happiness for doing good for yourself and others? A sense of security? If a person thinks freedom is deception then they have no understanding of what free will is.

As far as brainwashing is concerned, the bible gives us the knowledge that we need to not be brainwashed. Scientists are making advancement in brain scanning, to the point they are progressively getting better at reading what a person is thinking. You can only imagine what an evil spirit being can do as far as mind manipulation.
edit on 10-8-2015 by TheChrome because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:01 AM
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a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

true
false
unknown between true or false
being unknowable (among the first three).[1]

You claimed my "cause" is to see my own messages...

I say that the above is true of your statement...



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:10 AM
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a reply to: mOjOm

All hail the prophet bill!
.
Love that guy.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:19 AM
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a reply to: 5StarOracle

One thing you lack which has been obvious respect.
Barcs is one of the most respected members on ats for his critical intelligent mind.
He can and always will wipe the floor with you using his obviously superior intellect.
Shove off lol no.



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:22 AM
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a reply to: mOjOm

While this was a decent video and even close to what I believe it is inaccurate because we can't change everything...

Some things are bound by laws beyond our means to change...

An example is how I can't change your mind...

a nice light message non threatening yet it lacks the complexity of reality for there is consequence for each and every action...

You are not just on a ride you are driving so watch where you take yourself...
edit on 10-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: Edit



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:24 AM
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a reply to: boymonkey74

I have trouble respecting somebody lying about me...



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:26 AM
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a reply to: 5StarOracle

Im wonderong why you need to brag about it.
Normally people don't even bring stuff like you have up.
I think you lie but you can prove it...company name please.
No one is going to hire a construction team ran by a 19 and 17 year old.
Unless you are just building tree houses for local kids.
Oh and if you will not prove it stop bragging.
No one believes you.
edit on 10-8-2015 by boymonkey74 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 10 2015 @ 01:29 AM
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a reply to: boymonkey74

I told you I'm not telling you my company name because I don't want you causing me any problems...

I don't care if you believe me or not it makes no diff to me...

I build big stuff like multi family, strip malls,retirement homes, apartments, shops, custom house etc...

A lot of projects over 60000 square feet...


edit on 10-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: ...

I'm not the one that keeps bringing it up...
edit on 10-8-2015 by 5StarOracle because: ...



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