Aren’t you glad you were born into the right religion?

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope

If only charity worked. It is only an ointment, not a cure. The underlying problem remains unscathed.

Not sure what the cure is other than reduce the world population, limit people's choices to have kids etc. Outside of that there will always be people in need, and the Government does the worst job of do that and are the most costly in the process...

originally posted by: Realtruth
a reply to: enlightenedservant

I did realize that, so laughing about it only shows you are trying to shame. Religion has taught you well.

Your original claim was that we didn't see "those groups" meaning other than religious folks, but what I saw was human beings helping human beings, and it was a cross section of diversities.

So, you tried to refute my point that religious groups were there by pointing out that religious groups were there? And you can't prove the volunteers didn't do it because of religious reasons either? So in other words, you can't admit you were wrong?

Also, I'll laugh at whatever I choose to. Laughing has nothing to do with shame. Maybe you should reevaluate your own doctrine because you're projecting your beliefs onto me.

Although I do find it both funny & ironic that you're tying to call me out for "shaming", even though you felt you had to make an entire thread shaming religious parents for teaching their beliefs to their kids. I guess atheism doesn't care about "hypocrisy"?

originally posted by: Realtruth

Are they doing it out of fear because if they don't they'll burn, or perhaps they'll have a place in heaven if they do, or are they doing it simply out of altruistic reasons not associate with religion?

That is some pretty old Medieval mentality crap there...lol. I think their religion says its a priority to help others and so they make it their priority too, kind of plan and simple without Dogma and hell involved.

a reply to: Xtrozero
I would agree. That's why we leave the critical thinking to think tanks, and the charity to charity organizations.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Realtruth

Are they doing it out of fear because if they don't they'll burn, or perhaps they'll have a place in heaven if they do, or are they doing it simply out of altruistic reasons not associate with religion?

That is some pretty old Medieval mentality crap there...lol. I think their religion says its a priority to help others and so they make it their priority too, kind of plan and simple without Dogma and hell involved.

And some people just like to help others. Most women I know are like that (as long as we appreciate their efforts, of course).

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

Although I do find it both funny & ironic that you're tying to call me out for "shaming", even though you felt you had to make an entire thread shaming religious parents for teaching their beliefs to their kids. I guess atheism doesn't care about "hypocrisy"?

That is how you view the OP, so I'll have to respect that.

I think religion has it's place, but the perversions that have come out of religion have blurred any goodness that is typically preached.

Young children are blank slates, and adults that talk about something, or someone they can't prove seems rather deceptive would you not agree?

btw I'm an agnostic

originally posted by: Xtrozero

That is some pretty old Medieval mentality crap there...lol. I think their religion says its a priority to help others and so they make it their priority too, kind of plan and simple without Dogma and hell involved.

As long as religion is involved there is a dogma.

"religion says it's a priority to help others" Then why is the world in such chaos currently? Religions have been around for 1000's of year yet we don't have peace yet.

And I would agree religions have done good, but it's not the religions that do the good, but rather the goodness inside the people.

That is why I posted the original question in my OP. I found I had the goodness on the inside without a particular religion.

Aren’t you glad you were born into the right religion?

a reply to: Realtruth

Young children are blank slates, and adults that talk about something, or someone they can't prove seems rather deceptive would you not agree?

Just an aside, but beware this dogma.

There's a fascinating and enjoyable book by Stephen Pinker called "The Blank Slate" where he basically destroys this idea, that I would highly suggest. It's a fascinating read on the history of this idea and its current dogmatic status in academe. It's so deeply entrenched in contemporary social sciences that the idea still persistently raises its head.

A preview:

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I probably should have said children are impressionable, instead of blank slates.

I saw this video awhile back and found it extremely interesting, but I would agree with him 100%

Thanks for posting.

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: Xtrozero

That is some pretty old Medieval mentality crap there...lol. I think their religion says its a priority to help others and so they make it their priority too, kind of plan and simple without Dogma and hell involved.

As long as religion is involved there is a dogma.

"religion says it's a priority to help others" Then why is the world in such chaos currently? Religions have been around for 1000's of year yet we don't have peace yet.

That is why I posted the original question in my OP.

Aren’t you glad you were born into the right religion?

That's because of human nature, not because of some implied weakness of religions. People fight over greed, power, lust, anger, jealousy, nationalism, bigotry, revenge, and pretty much everything else. These aren't faults of religion. In fact, most religions try to help people overcome or reject these negative tendencies.

To put it another way, none of those things would stop if all religions disappeared right now. Even in a world with no religions, people would still wage war. People would still get raped & children would still get abused. Theft, bigotry, anger, murder, genocide, and every other crime & atrocity would still exist.

Or have you forgotten the atrocities committed in the names of Social Darwinism, eugenics, vulture capitalism, and communist purges? Or the mass tortures & human experiments done in the name of science (especially Imperial Japan's experiments on the Chinese)?

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: Xtrozero

That is some pretty old Medieval mentality crap there...lol. I think their religion says its a priority to help others and so they make it their priority too, kind of plan and simple without Dogma and hell involved.

As long as religion is involved there is a dogma.

"religion says it's a priority to help others" Then why is the world in such chaos currently? Religions have been around for 1000's of year yet we don't have peace yet.

That is why I posted the original question in my OP.

Aren’t you glad you were born into the right religion?

That's because of human nature, not because of some implied weakness of religions. People fight over greed, power, lust, anger, jealousy, nationalism, bigotry, revenge, and pretty much everything else. These aren't faults of religion. In fact, most religions try to help people overcome or reject these negative tendencies.

To put it another way, none of those things would stop if all religions disappeared right now. Even in a world with no religions, people would still wage war. People would still get raped & children would still get abused. Theft, bigotry, anger, murder, genocide, and every other crime & atrocity would still exist.

Or have you forgotten the atrocities committed in the names of Social Darwinism, eugenics, vulture capitalism, and communist purges? Or the mass tortures & human experiments done in the name of science (especially Imperial Japan's experiments on the Chinese)?

No I haven't forgotten, just as I haven't forgotten the atrocities that are committed in the name of religion today, and have been done for 1000's of years.

I think it all comes to what people chose within themselves. Will it be constructive or destructive, most people want to be constructive, as long as it fits their personal dogmas, if it doesn't then many times they are threatened by something different or foreign, thus fear and destruction follow.

Excellent input btw and well thought out.

a reply to: Realtruth

Yes, I truly AM blessed that I was born from Christian parents. In fact, I thanked God just this morning at Church for incarnating on earth 2000 years ago to show his sheep The Way.

I had my periods of doubts, of questioning and outright disobeying. But after a thorough inventory of my life, and an intense period of study of Christian Church history, (along with a few miracles), it was plain as day that The Catholic Church is the one, true church started by Jesus Christ.

One God who became man, enlisted 12 followers who then went out and spread the Word. We now number 1.3 billion, only 2000 years later. In every country. In every municipality. In every corner of the earth. This is a sociological fact and a phenomenon that can't be ignored.

The conversion rate to Christianity is still accelerating at an enormous pace. Muslims, Buddhist, Atheists, Agnostics, etc; are fleeing to Christianity at an amazing rate. It is so wonderful to witness. Once Jesus calls their name, it's a done deal.

He said he'd come and do stuff, it was predicted. Then, He came and did it, to prove the prediction. And He's STILL doing it, just as He predicted. Isn't this the very least a quote/unquote " GOD " could do? Well, mine did it. And its the ONLY God that can make that claim. And as folks open their eyes to the miracles that occur right in front of them, they follow...like dumb sheep. Cuz that's what we are really, in the grand scheme of things. Baaaa Baaaa. I love being a sheep.

Thanks mom and dad!

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: Xtrozero

I remember when Katrina hit I drove by an area in Arkansas and there were 100s and 100s of people filling up about 25 tracker trailers full of cloth, food and other needs to send down to the area hit. They were all from the local churches and I failed to see any critical thinking groups out there doing the same...hehe

So you are saying if religion did not exist those people that were hit by Katrina would not have been helped?

People have goodness in them without the confines of religious dogma's, most have yet to realize this.

No, what he's saying is that unlike atheism & the sciences, most religions actually make charity one of their priorities.

Atheists don't make the media wrte ups. Neither do Mormons who work closely with Catholic Charities.

From the American Atheists website, here's a list of non-religious charities who are providing aid and relief to Katrina victims. www.atheists.org... / Helping the Victims of Katrina… “All we have is each other…” AMERICAN ATHEISTS urges all fellow nonbelievers to contribute to the rescue and other humanitarian efforts in the devastating wake of Hurricane Katrina. www.democraticunderground.com...

originally posted by: Annee
Atheists don't make the media wrte ups. Neither do Mormons who work closely with Catholic Charities.

Also, religions tend to do things in groups and have indicators on their vehicles that proclaim their affiliation. Atheists tend to give as individuals (since atheism is an individual belief about one thing) and don't carry signs proclaiming their beliefs for others to see and note. A person's personal beliefs are irrelevant when helping other people.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: Xtrozero

I remember when Katrina hit I drove by an area in Arkansas and there were 100s and 100s of people filling up about 25 tracker trailers full of cloth, food and other needs to send down to the area hit. They were all from the local churches and I failed to see any critical thinking groups out there doing the same...hehe

So you are saying if religion did not exist those people that were hit by Katrina would not have been helped?

People have goodness in them without the confines of religious dogma's, most have yet to realize this.

No, what he's saying is that unlike atheism & the sciences, most religions actually make charity one of their priorities.

Atheists don't make the media wrte ups. Neither do Mormons who work closely with Catholic Charities.

From the American Atheists website, here's a list of non-religious charities who are providing aid and relief to Katrina victims. www.atheists.org... / Helping the Victims of Katrina… “All we have is each other…” AMERICAN ATHEISTS urges all fellow nonbelievers to contribute to the rescue and other humanitarian efforts in the devastating wake of Hurricane Katrina. www.democraticunderground.com...

Wait, that doesn't dispute my point. I said that unlike them, religions make charity one of their priorities. Charity isn't a priority in atheism. In fact, most atheists I've talked to say there's no doctrine at all. So it would be impossible for atheism to make charity a priority if there's no common belief system in atheism to begin with.

Also, there can be atheist charities. I didn't say they don't or can't exist. I was pointing out why religious affiliated groups are always at ground zero. And why those think tanks & other groups aren't.

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: Xtrozero

That is some pretty old Medieval mentality crap there...lol. I think their religion says its a priority to help others and so they make it their priority too, kind of plan and simple without Dogma and hell involved.

As long as religion is involved there is a dogma.

"religion says it's a priority to help others" Then why is the world in such chaos currently? Religions have been around for 1000's of year yet we don't have peace yet.

That is why I posted the original question in my OP.

Aren’t you glad you were born into the right religion?

That's because of human nature, not because of some implied weakness of religions. People fight over greed, power, lust, anger, jealousy, nationalism, bigotry, revenge, and pretty much everything else. These aren't faults of religion. In fact, most religions try to help people overcome or reject these negative tendencies.

To put it another way, none of those things would stop if all religions disappeared right now. Even in a world with no religions, people would still wage war. People would still get raped & children would still get abused. Theft, bigotry, anger, murder, genocide, and every other crime & atrocity would still exist.

Or have you forgotten the atrocities committed in the names of Social Darwinism, eugenics, vulture capitalism, and communist purges? Or the mass tortures & human experiments done in the name of science (especially Imperial Japan's experiments on the Chinese)?

No I haven't forgotten, just as I haven't forgotten the atrocities that are committed in the name of religion today, and have been done for 1000's of years.

I think it all comes to what people chose within themselves. Will it be constructive or destructive, most people want to be constructive, as long as it fits their personal dogmas, if it doesn't then many times they are threatened by something different or foreign, thus fear and destruction follow.

Excellent input btw and well thought out.

Thanks. Just to be clear, I don't actually have a problem with you. I don't care if people worship a tomato, Einstein, or a statue of a epic raccoon karate chopping the moon, as long as they're not causing harm to others.

But it always irks me when people try to act like religion is the cause of the negativity in the world. It's clearly people that are the cause, not religion. Any ideology, theory, or concept can be used for positive or negative purposes. Singling out religion is ridiculous because the atrocities & crimes in the world would continue, with or without religion.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: Annee
Atheists don't make the media wrte ups. Neither do Mormons who work closely with Catholic Charities.

Also, religions tend to do things in groups and have indicators on their vehicles that proclaim their affiliation. Atheists tend to give as individuals (since atheism is an individual belief about one thing) and don't carry signs proclaiming their beliefs for others to see and note. A person's personal beliefs are irrelevant when helping other people.

Yes. I'm actually an atheist that supports organizing meeting groups. And charity is one of the top reasons I've read from others why it's a good idea. Not, that I'm proposing recognition.

a reply to: Realtruth

It must be nice to know for a fact that your right. I admire the faith you have in yourself. Then again, you are on here trying to attack those you disagree with, so maybe you aren't so sure of your conclusions..... I just don't know what to think.

originally posted by: Dfairlite
a reply to: Realtruth

It must be nice to know for a fact that your right. I admire the faith you have in yourself. Then again, you are on here trying to attack those you disagree with, so maybe you aren't so sure of your conclusions..... I just don't know what to think.

Right about what exactly?

I never claimed to be right about anything.

In religion, and metaphysics there are no conclusions, only personal experiences, and observations.

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: Dfairlite
a reply to: Realtruth

It must be nice to know for a fact that your right. I admire the faith you have in yourself. Then again, you are on here trying to attack those you disagree with, so maybe you aren't so sure of your conclusions..... I just don't know what to think.

Right about what exactly?

I never claimed to be right about anything.

In religion, and metaphysics there are no conclusions, only personal experiences, and observations.

Deny the intentions of your post if you must. Doesn't make any difference to me. The goodness inside you knows what this post is all about, even if you don't openly admit to it.