"Cecil" the Lion Hunted and Killed

a reply to: mindseye1609

First of all

Not always but a vast majority of the time these "sport" hunting events take place in areas of Africa that preserve the animals ONLY FOR HUNTING. The $$$ value of the animal being hunted has driven many animals back from the brink of extinction. None of this "save the whales" nonsense. If it's worth money for dentists to come from Minnesota to shoot a lion, you better believe there will ALWAYS be lions to shoot, how's that for conservation.

This argument is all nuance. It is designed to put trophy hunting in a better light but escapes the TRUE facts regarding the economic value. Let me put this in perspective for you. The University of Port Elizabeth estimates eco-tourism is 15X more lucrative than trophy hunting. In other words, Cecil was worth $819,195 alive vs $54,000 dead. What a ridiculous attempt to justify killing endangered species to compensate for erectile dysfunctional incompetents.

Second - Culling older males

Another poor attempt to articulate. Let me separate the myth from the facts for you. Culling older males disrupts the family hierarchy and creates disorder among the younger males. They will begin fighting and competing for females where needless death of breeding males occurs. It devastates the social order of things when you kill the ruling male. It's not natural selection when that happens.

And finally,

Bow and arrow was used in this instance, not very effective at all. 40 hours of stalking thereafter. Poor animal. Trophy hunting should be banned and eco friendly tourism is the answer for animal conservation. Like the other member said, peddle your crap elsewhere.

What is it that they say about people who are amused by killing animals?

originally posted by: IanFleming

I find it amusing that those who go on and on about "culling humanity" never, ever seem to be the first to volunteer.

I find it amusing that even after exposing you as a liar and asking you 3 times to stop talking to me that you still continue to do so as if anything you have to say is worth reading.

originally posted by: HumanPLC
a reply to: Dragoon01

I don't know where you have got your information from but i strongly suggest you do a bit of reading up mate. Most trophy kills are not hunts, they are carried out on closed reserves where the animal, which is essentially a sitting duck has been captured and/or reared for this purpose.

Thats it. Its nothing special.

This lions popularity helped generate around 9,000 p/w from tourist interest (pictures, tours to see him, etc) and that did go towards conservation. I would say the local community might disagree with your assertion that this is no big deal.

Where I got my info? I told you from guys who trophy hunt thats where!
People who have been on ten thousand acre ranches in Africa with no fences and stalked multiple animals over a week. No, most trophy hunts do not take place with fenced animals. Does that happen? Sure it does but its not the majority regardless of what some of the anti hunter types tell you. This animal was not caged. So your BS is irrelevant. It wandered off of the "preserve".

Look I like animals I love them even. I have pets and have endured the death of a few that really tore us up. The natural order of things however is that there is a food chain and we all fit into it. Lions are higher on that chain in the wild. They will kill you with no regard for your opinion. That's the reason they have been killed off. They kill people or they kill peoples food. End of story. If these animals are not made financially valuable then they are a risk to the people actually living with them. It all fine and good for people in the US or the UK to shake their heads and tisk tisk but if there were no big game hunters these animals would already be gone. Hunting kept them in place long before Eco-tourism became a thing. Locals would have killed them off a long time ago. Maybe in the near future the Eco-tourism will be enough of a draw to completely support national economies and hunting will only be done to carefully preserve the populations. That's the whole point of the tag system. Only so many tags are issued and I have no problem with that system nor do I have an issue with harshly dealing with poachers.
I don't think these guys were actually poachers. I think the hunters and the landowner got hustled by a local government official. I believe they legitimately had a tag for a lion and knowing that lions were in the area set up a lure. I dont believe they intended to lure this specific lion. They were after a lion in general and this one happened to wander into the situation. They could not see a collar on him at the time and only figured out what happened once they had found him and completed the kill. Thats not criminal behavior.

So, this palmer ass jacket, has a history of illegal hunting,

Palmer's hunting has attracted scrutiny in the past. In 2008, he pleaded guilty to lying to a U.S. wildlife agent about a black bear he killed in Wisconsin two years before.

He was accused of killing it 40 miles outside a permitted zone, hauling the carcass back into the approved area and certifying falsely that it was killed there. He was sentenced to one year probation and fined $2,938.

www.msn.com...

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: mindseye1609


Second - Culling older males

Another poor attempt to articulate. Let me separate the myth from the facts for you. Culling older males disrupts the family hierarchy and creates disorder among the younger males. They will begin fighting and competing for females where needless death of breeding males occurs. It devastates the social order of things when you kill the ruling male. It's not natural selection when that happens.

Stop peddling your own crap. This statement is not at all fact it is your opinion.

originally posted by: punkinworks10
So, this palmer ass jacket, has a history of illegal hunting,

Palmer's hunting has attracted scrutiny in the past. In 2008, he pleaded guilty to lying to a U.S. wildlife agent about a black bear he killed in Wisconsin two years before.

He was accused of killing it 40 miles outside a permitted zone, hauling the carcass back into the approved area and certifying falsely that it was killed there. He was sentenced to one year probation and fined $2,938.

www.msn.com...

None of which has any bearing on the case at hand. No one is disputing the location that they said they were in when they killed this lion.

Americans love to murder; especially those / that which is weaker than themselves. It's a rodent-like trait that has festered in the nation ever since the lazy colonials absconded from Europe and came to the New World to turned it into a slave gulag.

originally posted by: Dragoon01

None of which has any bearing on the case at hand. No one is disputing the location that they said they were in when they killed this lion.

It shows a pattern of illegal activity from this guy. Don't tell me that being a repeat offender of the same type of criminal behavior has no bearing on this case. Of course it does. If you go to trial for the same or similar crime that you've done before you better believe it will get brought up in court. It will also influence your sentence if found guilty.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: starfoxxx


Should this guy be prevented from doing so?
No

What gives America the right to kill protected animals in reservations?

Nice selective editing.. If you would of read all my post in entirety, you would not
be picking bits and pieces you do not like ...

originally posted by: starfoxxx

originally posted by: bellagirl

originally posted by: starfoxxx
Check out this goofs dr. Walters YELP page. lmfao hours of fun. Here guys lol. This is something he should of thought about. m.yelp.com...

lol just read some of the reviews. He is ruined.

Will forever be known for what he has done. His actions will stalk him for the rest of his life.

I cant stop smiling at the fact he spent $50 thousands of his hard earned money to ruin his own life...bahahahah

He should of still had the right to go over and shoot the animal but he has to deal with the consequences also.

Big game hunting is NOT Illegal.. The guy paid guides thousands to do this, he for sure would
of not done that if he knew this was not going to be legal. I don't think they knew it was cecil the lion they were killing
and had a ;WTF UH OH; Moment after the fact they found out this was a well known collard lion.

originally posted by: starfoxxx Check out this goofs dr. Walters YELP page. lmfao hours of fun. Here guys lol. This is something he should of thought about. m.yelp.com...

Big game hunters should have the right to legally pay to shoot any animal they want, on a controlled
game preserve that is made for something like this..

The dentist now has to deal with the social consequences though of doing so, which
he is. His business is done for. I don't want the man dead its not like he murdered a human
but i am not upset over people being upset over what he has done and now the real punishment start..
Jail time is not needed, he has to endure a punishment much worse then a year or two in jail..

His entire life career is now destroyed..

SO stop going around acting like your some moral warrior.. What have you done for
the lions and wild life in africa and the villagers.?? NOTHING your one to talk.. pretty dunce

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: Dragoon01

None of which has any bearing on the case at hand. No one is disputing the location that they said they were in when they killed this lion.

It shows a pattern of illegal activity from this guy. Don't tell me that being a repeat offender of the same type of criminal behavior has no bearing on this case. Of course it does. If you go to trial for the same or similar crime that you've done before you better believe it will get brought up in court. It will also influence your sentence if found guilty.

A pattern? So far I've seen one proven.

I'm still waiting on the facts for this one. Seems to me he did everything legal, up to a point.

Questions on how the lion was lured out still need to be answered.

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: IanFleming

I find it amusing that those who go on and on about "culling humanity" never, ever seem to be the first to volunteer.

I find it amusing that even after exposing you as a liar and asking you 3 times to stop talking to me that you still continue to do so as if anything you have to say is worth reading.

The very fact that you are posting here alive and well, not having actually included yourself in the "culling of humanity" like you said, rather disproves your objection, doesn't it?

a reply to: Dragoon01

Where I got my info? I told you from guys who trophy hunt thats where!
People who have been on ten thousand acre ranches in Africa with no fences and stalked multiple animals over a week. No, most trophy hunts do not take place with fenced animals. Does that happen? Sure it does but its not the majority regardless of what some of the anti hunter types tell you. This animal was not caged. So your BS is irrelevant. It wandered off of the "preserve"

I can assure you that 'the anti hunter types' are not my source of information but i think its rather hypocritical that you would attempt to critiscise my source of information when you have basically stated that your sources are essentially people who you know, friends of yours.

So essentially your whole opinion is based on something your mates told you? Your friends who just happen to be trophy hunters. Have you ever considered that they may be just a little bit bias?

This is why i am telling you to go and read up on a few facts.

if there were no big game hunters these animals would already be gone.

Mate, go and read up on the many species that have now had to be protected due to them being hunted close to the point of extinction.

Lions are higher on that chain in the wild. They will kill you with no regard for your opinion.

A lion wont kill you for a trophy, it will kill you to feed or protect his/her family, that's a whole different ball park.

It wandered off of the "preserve".

I think "It 'wandered' off of the reserve. " is much more accurate... Its was lured off!


Mate, I have no problem with hunting for food, materials or self preservation as its for those exact same reason a wild animal probably would want to kill me if it could. But trophy hunting, that's a whole different thing! Killing for fun? Well, that says it all really. How can killing for pure fun ever be justified?

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

You do realize that these hunts donate the animal to local tribes correct?

You also do realize when they do these hunts that the animals are picked to protect the integrity of the "herds" and or "prides" right?

You do realize that they arrange the hunts to maintain optimal population to keep the species strong righ?

Knee Jerk reactions = ignorance

You do realize his guides are being prosecuted for illegally hunting a studied animal....at night when they knew what they were doing was illegal.

Cecil had a colar, they removed and destroyed it knowing they had done an illegal hunt. They let him suffer for 40 hours.

If he wants to feed the locals, maybe buy them a cow and fly all the way to Africa to shoot the cow humanly if his intentions are so honorable?
No he is a bloodthirsty lunatic just wanting to bag a lion.

he is a pig.

originally posted by: AlexJowls
Americans love to murder; especially those / that which is weaker than themselves. It's a rodent-like trait that has festered in the nation ever since the lazy colonials absconded from Europe and came to the New World to turned it into a slave gulag.

I am a proud American.......Go back in this thread and read my posts. I am a constitution loving conservative that is very pro-gun. Many people have seen my posts on gun rights and conservative anti progressive values.



I respect life......I have empathy and compassion and could not even imagine doing something like this. I am pro hunting for food and the greater good. I am against hunting for fun or pure sport......Trophy hunting. People in the US are just like any other group of people......Good and bad and for the most part just looking to build a better life.



Your comments show a lacking of wisdom or thought. Your anger made you into what your are angry about.........Irony at it's best.

Anyone who kills for fun is a psychopath.
We get warning signs if kids kill animals for fun did everyone miss this psycho?.
If you hunt to just to kill you need to get mental health help.

Yeah... this is all kinds of ****** up really.
This guy is scum... straight up, fully-fledged, subhuman scum.
Who the F gets their rocks off by shooting and chasing and murdering other living beings on this planet??
I mean.... WTF??

You have money and love lions and are a conservationist... then open a sanctuary, donate to a reserve, pay for some more guards, buy some land.... do all manner of frickin' stuff but travelling around the world tooled up to go and brutally slay a perfectly happy lion is just sick.
I don't really care about the BS and propaganda from the Trophy Hunting nutjobs, it's pure lunacy.
If they cannot find a better and more peaceful, humane way to live their lives then they are seriously messed up people.

If you live by the sword then, well you die by the sword.

Maybe this guys falls into a lion enclosure... fingers crossed eh?

We do so much good as a species... we have advanced so much in terms of science, medicine and can help so many people and there are good selfless, caring people out there who dedicate their lives to helping others and making the world a better place for humans, animals, nature.... and THEN... you get scum, pure ****ing disgraceful excuses for human beings like this "man" who finds enjoyment and pleasure out of slaughtering animals.
Animals that are endangered or at risk... White Rhinos, Lions and christ knows what else he's killed, he's not a young man and has been hunting (not for food or out of any kind of need, but for entertainment and fun, and to hang dead animal heads in his house) for many, many years.... I mean??

Seriously people.

Its 2015.

Him and his ilk are hugely in the minority, like that woman who killed a giraffe the other year... she spent like half a million or something going and killing all these amazing animals.
All of these people have big, sh** eating grins on their faces... they get off on this ****.

Absolute filth the lot of them

You do realize that these hunts donate the animal to local tribes correct?

Actually what happens is that the Lions head and coat are removed for the paying 'hunter', thats the trophy. The body is then decapitated further by removing all the bones which are then sold to various countries such as China.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
Anyone who kills for fun is a psychopath.
We get warning signs if kids kill animals for fun did everyone miss this psycho?.
If you hunt to just to kill you need to get mental health help.

I agree 1000%........Empathy and compassion are learned traits that parents need to invest time in teaching. Killing for fun is cruel in my eyes. I can not even fathom doing something like this.......It is not something I could do.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: Dragoon01

None of which has any bearing on the case at hand. No one is disputing the location that they said they were in when they killed this lion.

It shows a pattern of illegal activity from this guy. Don't tell me that being a repeat offender of the same type of criminal behavior has no bearing on this case. Of course it does. If you go to trial for the same or similar crime that you've done before you better believe it will get brought up in court. It will also influence your sentence if found guilty.

A pattern? So far I've seen one proven.

I'm still waiting on the facts for this one. Seems to me he did everything legal, up to a point.

Questions on how the lion was lured out still need to be answered.

The compulsion to kill an animal for pleasure, like any predatory behaviour, will probably lead you to circumstances and people that are unscrupulous, where the drive is strong enough...the 'pattern', at the very least', shows an unwillingness (and I mean that politely) to vet an activity...luckily, adjudication is carried out using the historical record of events in relation to 'suspected' crimes, many of our sons, daughters and grandchildren are safer because of this...of course, the same claim of 'innocent until proven' could be levelled - without the use of 'priors' (proven or unproven) but that would be myopic, and an exercise in excuse-making...I approve of the tenet 'innocent until proven', but, being in the wrong place with the wrong people, and attracting the attention to the level of court several times, is highly suspicious...proves stupidity, or intent...

Å99