It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
originally posted by: pfishy
a reply to: Korg Trinity
I did read your post. Twice. This is why I asked if that's what you meant, or if I had misunderstood you. I had just asked PublicOpinion if their previous post was trying to paint me on one side or the other, and you started your post with quoting that question and said "I think the definition is clear". Pretty simple to see how I could have misunderstood that, I would think.
originally posted by: pfishy
a reply to: Korg Trinity
Oh, ok. I understand what you meant now. And I'm perfectly clear where I stand on the issue. I just don't share my opinion about it on this forum. I prefer to contribute in other ways.
And it's not in the Grey area, in case you care to know.
kay, just to put this out there, it is entirely possible that if the Twin Towers were rigged with explosives, it is entirely possible that they could have been detonated in such a fashion as to make them fall unevenly.
skyeagle409, page 50 : Of course it is BS, and as proof, point out the time lines where demo explosions are heard in the videos as WTC 1, WTC 2, and WTC 7 collapsed. If you are unable to provide the time lines, your case will be dismissed.
originally posted by: skyeagle409
a reply to: Salander
skyeagle409 : We have proven the truthers are not only conveyors of disinformation, hoaxed and bogus videos and doctored photos, but are also known for not telling the truth.
"[T]here was a rumble [coming from WTC7, which was captured on video a second before collapse initiation]. ... Pop! Pop! Pop! was all you heard until the building sunk into a rising cloud of gray."
2002, Chris Bull and Sam Erman, Editors, 'At Ground Zero: Young Reporters Who Were There Tell Their Stories', p. 97 (words of New York Daily News reporter Peter DeMarco, later of the Boston Globe)
MSNBC reporter Ashley Banfield, primarily known for her observation at the time of the WTC 7 collapse at the end of the afternoon, was already at Ground Zero when the towers came down. Around 11:15 a.m., 45 minutes after the second tower had come down, she told her listeners from West Broadway, roughly 400 meters from WTC 7, that she'd heard no less than 4 explosions which sounded like car bombs:
"Yeah, hi, I'm just about 5 or 10 blocks north of the site where these two towers actually came down. We're obviously having a bit of trouble right now maintaining our location as we just heard one more explosion. That's around the 4th one we've heard. The police are telling us they're either car bombs or they are simply cars that have overheated that are exploding. But every time that happens, there's a flurry of activity and more emergency vehicles that come down this road."
While maybe not very well known, these reports are absolutely accurate. We know this from videos that are even less well known than these, the most important being one of Richard Peskin, who was shooting from his high-rise apartment building roughly 650 meters (700 yards) south of Ground Zero.
His tape for WTC 7 starts just before 11:00, right after he heard a major explosion and noticed a new cloud of smoke rise from WTC 7's east side, where later in the day the collapse initiated from. In the minutes after that he captures what appear to be four additional explosions and reports on at least one other he failed to record. So we're talking at least 6 loud potential explosions in the minutes before and after 11:00 a.m. which NIST hasn't addressed. Peskin:
"[Start video; Peskin zoomed in to east corner of WTC 7:] A blast, explosion, or something, because now there is a lot of police activity and sirens and more smoke rising from the ground. [Smoke is rising from the side of WTC 7's east corner, but not exactly clear which smoke cloud Peskin means.] New smoke. So there was some kind of additional explosion, but I don't know what it was. Definitely. Smoke is rising from the ground. Maybe it was a federal building or something like that. Okay. Okay, sweety, I'll call you later.
"[New take:] It's now 11 o'clock. We're still continuing to hear explosions. [Another crack or explosion can be heard.] I don't know what it is. A lot of smoke. ... [Another crack or explosion can be heard.] ... There's a fire [away from of WTC 7]. Maybe a car on fire. [Another crack or explosion can be heard.] ...
"[New take:] [Very loud crack/explosion and echo] It's another explosion. [Seems to be not much after 11:05, judging by the shadows.] ... [New take:] It's now a little bit after twelve."
The initial explosion right next to WTC 7, or possibly inside it, which Peskin failed to capture, appears to have been picked up by at least four other cameras that we are aware of :
These cameras were operated by 9/11 "filmmaker" Gideon Naudet, independent journalist Lucia Davis, firefighter Steve Spak and another unknown camera man. Possibly they picked up different explosions, but at the very least they were all captured in the same period around 11:00am. We know this for a variety of reasons.
Bloom Box 2109315 : Astounding and compelling testimony from a brave 9/11 firefighter that was ignored by the 9/11 Commission has added further weight to the already overwhelming evidence that the Twin Towers were brought down by means of explosives.
Firefighter John Schroeder, assigned to Engine Company 10 directly across the street from the World Trade Center complex, holds back tears and describes his first-hand experience on Sept. 11th in an emotional interview with We Are Change and Loose Change.
Much of Schroeder's testimony directly contradicts the official story (OS) and the 9/11 Commission, to which he spoke, but was ignored.
Perhaps the most important aspect of Schroeder's testimony is his recollection that there was a distinct gap between the plane striking the North tower and the elevators exploding.
"We're standing there in the lobby....all of a sudden we hear (explosion noise) and the elevators exploded like something out of a Bruce Willis Die Hard movie," said Schroeder.
"People just come running out of the elevators on fire....I was like what is going on here, something's up here - I mean the plane's up there now there's fire down here?"
Schroeder said his team were in the North tower for at least 5 minutes after the first plane hit before the elevators exploded, contradicting the official explanation that jet fuel cascaded down the elevator shafts and caused them to explode immediately after the plane struck.
"We said something's wrong here - I mean the plane hit up on the 80th floor - 5 minutes later and the elevators are suddenly exploding on the first level - why?" asked Schroeder.
"There was definitely a distinct time delay between the planes hitting and the elevators exploding," he added.
After attempting to make their way up the towers and then returning back down to the lobby, Schroeder and his colleagues were shocked to see that the lobby was totally deserted.
"We got down to the lobby and everything was blown out, exploded, and we were the only ones in the lobby....everything was exploded, everything was gone, we're like what is going on here?" said Schroeder. Schroeder's team was baffled as to why so much death and destruction was evident in the lower levels of the tower when the plane had hit so high up. "It looked like a bomb went off in the lobby," said Schroeder.
They were also shocked at how the building seemed to be collapsing in on them from the interior. Schroeder's company was heading up to the 24th floor of the North tower when the second plane hit the South tower. "We were tossed like a rag doll by another explosion in our building," said Schroeder. "People were making their way down the stairwells, burnt like you couldn’t believe. We were all shocked, because it seemed as if there was fire everywhere, on so many floors. It just didn’t make sense."
"Explosions, fires everywhere, is something happening that we don't know about here? recalled Schroeder. "I mean a plane just hit - it wasn't an F-14 coming in and shooting rockets at us."
Bloom Box 5016405 ( + edits by LaBTop) : Despite some damage to the south side of WTC7, it essentially came down for the first 2.25 secs of the global collapse (that's over the height of 8 floors! ) at free-fall speed.
Through the path of greatest resistance (straight down) The only way that was physically possible is by controlled demolition.
jomper : This NIST computer model of WTC-7's first 2 secs of its collapse sequence doesn't represent what actually happened, doesn't explain how the building fell at free fall acceleration, wasn't based on the examination of any physical evidence from the building and can't be checked by independent experts because its data has been hidden. It's totally unscientific.
NIST will not allow its WTC-7 data fed into its computer animation to be independently verified.
remorris, NZ, 3 years ago :
At the risk of repetition. WTC7 was an 81 vertically columned, 47 storied steel framed high rise, that dropped into its own footprint in 6.5 seconds +or-.
2.25 Seconds of that in total gravitational free fall. Forensic study found temperatures up to 4,735 F [Molybdenum spherules USGS]. FEMA reported steel vaporized and evaporated with holes in it 'like Swiss cheese'. RJ.Lee found spherical metallic particles 150 x normal building dust, spheres produced by molten droplets being violently introduced into air.
Independent analysis of DUST found active thermitic material [Harrit/Jones : Bentham].
High grade energetics IN the dust. Molten metal was seen in the piles 'running down the channel rails like in a foundry'.
Eyewitness testimony of explosive events before, during and after aircraft strike were established 118 times in audio transcripts [Barry Jennings.FDNY transcripts].
NIST report is a 'probable THEORY', based on computer modeling un-tested by peers or x-examination paradigms not for public disclosure.
Poseidon, Bristol, 3 years ago :
For those who complain that opponents of the official 9/11 story just "cry about melted steel and stuff", I'll explain the significance. The laws of probability, thermodynamics and thermo-chemistry dictate that military-grade unreacted nano-thermite does not form spontaneously, and office fires of hydrocarbons burning in air of up to 21% oxygen cannot melt iron or steel. The time evolution of a spontaneous process will be in the direction of increasing entropy; thus, a sophisticated, highly energetic, nano-engineered accelerant comprising 40 nanometer-thick aluminum plates and 100 nanometer iron oxide grains requires a 'creator' - e.g., the U.S. military.
Dr. Ed Kendrick of ReDiscover911.com, Kansas City, US, 3 years ago :
The record is being written longingly--establishing who are complicit in the cover-up. Those who deceive with intent to conceal a crime are as guilty as the perpetrators of the crime. It's not to late to whistle blow about your assignments to cover-up who really did 9/11. It is clear by the ratings that this disinformation article, and the growing awareness of the 9/11 bamboozle, indicate growing awareness and courage to speak truth to those who abuse positions of power--especially in the media. An informed citizenry depend upon media. This article violates the trust in media to inform. Turn yourselves in--but to whom? Wikileaks? We will succeed to the degree that we confront and expose pure evil. All together now!
Brian Good, California, 3 years ago :
Not only fell in free fall, but fell in near-perfect symmetry. This can happen only if all the structural support is removed simultaneously. And consider that according to NIST's theory of an internal collapse, the columns at the east end of the building failed though they were carrying no load beyond their own weight.
Adrian M, Stevenage, UK, 3 years ago :
At a press conference in Nov 2008 Shyam Sunder, Lead Investigator for NIST stated (correctly) that it was impossible for Building 7 to have collapsed at free fall acceleration due to resistance from the steel structure below.
The problem was that it's easy to measure the acceleration of the collapse, so when the NIST final report was released a month later they were forced to admit in it, that the building fell in free fall for 2.25 seconds. They have since completely refused to explain how.
This is one of hundreds of problems with the official investigations. The people who believe 19 hijackers managed all this support the Bush Administration conspiracy theory.
Acknowledging that the official story is impossible is frightening but our politicians are still making decisions today based on a false flag operation from a decade ago.
Those who support the official story avoid facts in their arguments and just rely on abuse and poster Sara Goldstein is a classic example. Do your own research.
Anyone believes that there were no explosions after watching this video is lying to themselves.
If you can't point out demo explosions in the WTC videos, I will be clearly evident that no demo explosions occurred as the WTC buildings collapsed.
He already did that, funny only your videos fail to have true audio.