WTC-7 Mysteries FINALLY Solved.

Originally posted by: skyeagle409
A reply to: LaBTop

""LaBTop : Again, you needed to introduce King Kong again, to push those tops through the rest of those towers.""

skyeagle409 : Do you mean like this demolition process where upper blocks crush through lower blocks without the use of explosives?

You show utter ignorance of basic understanding of demo-techniques, with those repetitive posts about the Verinage technique of demolishing a building WITHOUT explosives, however WITH the assistance of hydraulic jacks that remove all RESISTANCE from pre-cut vertical steel embedded in concrete columns or precut steel columns, at a carefully chosen floor area position.
At such a low position, that the weight of the top part is exceedingly enough to crush the underlaying still erect part of that building, after the top part falls as one entity down, over the height of one floor.
And that top part is chosen for such an amount of weight, that that weight delivers enough mass acceleration and mass deceleration, to crush both upper and lower parts EQUALLY.
The upper part is crushed by the sudden deceleration of its mass when it impacts the first lower floor, the lower part is crushed by the impacting top part its mass' acceleration, when the upper mass is hitting and penetrating the lower mass.
This can only happen when the upper mass, chosen by calculation, is sufficiently heavy and big enough, to be able to crush through all the underlaying floors, and in that process, crush its own top part floors also over the length of that downward trajectory by means of sufficient deceleration. To achieve both downwards and upwards crushings, the amount of top part floors/weight has to be chosen with enough over-weight, to keep both crushings at pace, but not too much, or a part of the building's top will still be standing afterwards.

Simple questions to you :
1. Was the mass and height of the upper Twin Tower parts enough, to crush the much higher in height, and exceedingly becoming stronger, vertical and horizontal steel strength over that increasingly thicker-tapering vertical steel columns height, the lower you found that vertical steel in those towers?

2. Was the INITIATING failure occurring in the Twin Towers, the same as in the Verinage technique, where ALL the vertical steel/concrete over the FULL area of one carefully chosen floor, is suddenly totally removed?

Ad. 1 : You seem to think as so many with you, that a whole huge donut-formed area of ONE WTC FLOOR placed around the 47 steel core columns, fell down the height of one floor, and then that debris impacted the lower floor while it had collected already a lot of acceleration.
Let me wake you up. That's not what happened, at all. See the Charles M. Beck papers above. See Major_Tom's extensive explanations at his site, written as a book with hundreds of pages.

Ad. 2 : All the video and photo evidence points at one INITIATION failure : the invisible CORE COLUMNS.
Followed thereafter by the failure of the visible EXTERIOR COLUMNS.
Exactly how any clever planner would have done it. No visual evidence of the INITIATION moments.
However, we have many videos of the directly after the core columns failure, following next exterior failures, visible on a few sides of those Tower top parts.

There is one impressive animated GIF to be found at waypastvne's repository at photobucket.com that clearly shows that the failure must have started at the outer row of thick steel CORE columns :
s995.photobucket.com...
imageshack.com...
Since it's a 3.39 MB big Hi-Res animated picture, we sadly can't save it to our ATS uploads, which are allowed up to 1 MB pictures only.





As you can see, it's clearly caused by the failure of at least a few CORE columns around that stronger, also failing corner CORE column from the WTC-2S tower. Which failure is invisible to any camera.
They clearly pulled the still firmly attached COMPOSITE corner floor decks, attached to these corner CORE columns, STRAIGHT downwards with them, causing the EXTERIOR columns to get pulled inwards by those sinking long floor decks. It also means that the whole area of those composite floor decks were also STILL FIRMLY attached to those exterior columns. So, both sinking floor deck-sides their bolds and welds were strong enough to pull a whole row of exterior Vierendeel panels with them, inwards.

If those floor decks connections would have failed to one side ONLY, f.ex. the core column side, that floor would have hinged down from their connections at the exterior facade side, in an outward and downward falling arc, inside the building, without pulling at the exterior panels and NOT bowing them.
If the floor decks would have been disconnected from BOTH the core and the exterior columns, the exterior panels would also NOT have bowed inwards.
Just as is the case when the floor decks would have been cut only from the exterior columns, then those floor decks would have hinged down from their connections at the interior core columns side, in an inwards and downward falling arc, inside that building's floor area.

You and some of your fellow 'skeptics' still hold on to long since debunked theories that the pancaking floors were the INITIATING events, while it's years long already evident that the failure of the core columns was that initiating event.
You proposed during this whole thread, that one whole floor as one entity, fell the height of one floor. Followed by the pancaking of the rest of the floors, all around the still erect 47 core columns, which then broke slowly after your pancaking proceded far enough down along the 4 core sides. That's a very old theory, already debunked 10 years ago.

Look again at that animated high resolution GIF, and thou shall be cured.

NOTE also the smoke and dust squib, spitting out to the left, from just under that exterior column's corner failure.
Indicating a possible explosive event. To cut that stronger than the rest of the exterior panels, corner exterior structure.? It's difficult to prove, it's however very peculiar that it happened, exactly at that moment, just before that corner failed.

WTC North & South Tower Mysteries Solved.

We will compare the two plane impacts and the WTC-7 collapse their seismograms, all three expressed in a sensitive 10 nm/s (nanometer/second) amplitudes range;
with the two Twin Tower collapses, which were expressed in a less sensitive 100 nm/s amplitudes range. Their wave train velocities were for all five seismograms based on a main velocity of 2 Km/s.
Which resulted in a 17 secs travel time period of seismic signals through the New York State's upper crust over the distance of the 34 Km between Manhattan and the seismographs installed at the Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory (LDEO) station at the Palisades seismographic station from Columbia University.

The two plane impacts into the tops of the two towers were not explosions, more like conflagrations of a huge cloud of dispersed jet fuel. We can't expect them to behave on a seismogram like real explosions, with their much faster explosive gas-front speeds, and resulting sharp spikes on a seismogram.

We also have to differentiate between three types of explosions.
1. Aerial explosions. Low seismic spikes.
2. Sub-aerial explosions. Medium spikes.
3. Subterranean/basement explosions. Huge spikes.


Let's review this link's text from a post on this below thread's page 20 by Informer1958 :
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I added all the pictures and diagrams, to show the reader the similarity between the huge sudden spike in a seismogram from a huge explosion, and the Twin Tower seismograms that showed a similar huge sudden spike at the very start of both tower collapses. Seconds before the first debris hit the ground.....
What caused these TWO HUGE seismic spikes, comparable to a huge explosion.?

www.911review.com...
Seismographs at Columbia University's Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory in Palisades, New York, 21 miles north of the WTC, recorded strange seismic activity on September 11 that has still not been explained.
files.abovetopsecret.com...

While the aircraft crashes caused minimal earth shaking, significant earthquakes with unusual spikes occurred at the beginning of each collapse. The Palisades seismic data recorded a 2.1 magnitude earthquake during the 10-second collapse of the South Tower at 9:59:04 and a 2.3 quake during the 8-second collapse of the North Tower at 10:28:31.
(LT : in reality it took about 17 s for the S.Tower and about 15 s for the N.Tower to collapse)
files.abovetopsecret.com...

The Palisades seismic record shows that -- as the collapses began -- a huge seismic "spike" marked the moment the greatest energy went into the ground. The strongest jolts were all registered at the beginning of the collapses, well before the falling debris struck the earth. These unexplained "spikes" in the seismic data lend credence to the theory that massive explosions at the base of the towers caused the collapses.

A "sharp spike of short duration" is how seismologist Thorne Lay of Univ. of California at Santa Cruz told AFP an underground nuclear explosion appears on a seismograph.
files.abovetopsecret.com...

The two unexplained spikes are more than twenty times the amplitude of the other seismic waves associated with the collapses and occurred in the East-West seismic recording as the buildings began to fall.

Here are the LDEO seismograms that I converted to the more sensitive 0-10 nm/s scale.
The same sensitivity as from the two plane impacts and the WTC-7 collapse seismograms.
It means that now the Twin Tower collapse seismograms are as sensitive as, and COMPARABLE to those three 0-10 nm/s scaled ones.
The original two LDEO collapse seismograms their less sensitive 1-100 nm/s do not show you the collapse-preceeding amplitudes groups, which are suddenly clearly comparable in magnitude with the two plane impact seismograms and the WTC-7 collapse seismogram.
Note especially that this latter one was a 47 storey building, collapsing neatly into its footprint.

First collapse, the WTC-2 South Tower collapse, in 0 - 100 nm/s sensitivity :



First collapse, the WTC-2 South Tower collapse, now in 0 - 10 nm/s amplification :




Second collapse, the WTC-1 North Tower collapse, in 0 - 100 nm/s sensitivity :



Second collapse, the WTC-1 North Tower collapse, now in 0 - 10 nm/s amplification :




And these are the WTC-7 collapse, and the two plane impact seismograms in their original equally sensitive 10 nm/s sensitivity scales :

WTC-7, the third Collapse seismogram, 0-10 nm/s scale :


WTC-1N, the first Plane Impact seismogram, 0-10 nm/s scale :


WTC-2S, the second Plane Impact seismogram, 0-10 nm/s scale :



It's quite clear after those two collapse seismogram amplifications, that they both were preceded by some strange seismic signal amplitudes, that were however comparable in energetic strength to the WTC-7 GLOBAL collapse of a 47 storey steel and concrete building.

In other words, the same energy as was necessary to flatten a 47 storey high steel and concrete building, was unleashed in the seconds BEFORE the Twin Towers started to GLOBALLY collapse.

As you can clearly see in this animated GIF by waypastvne, those corner CORE COLUMNS of the South Tower must have been compromised and sunk all at once, to be able to let the whole COMPOSITE corner its floor-decks pull those exterior column lines at both sides of that burning corner hole, inwards. The adjacent exterior panels on the right side of the floor/exterior failure, were not moving at all at that moment of corner failure. We sadly can't see if that's true for the left side too.
It means that those corner floor decks must still have been solidly connected to both exterior and interior steel columns. And when the weight of the top floors and the hat truss began pushing on the failing core column pack, they were pulling those floor decks down, and they pulled those exterior corner columns inwards, together with their aluminum cladding.
Which core columns corner failure was the collapse INITIATION of that South Tower :

Floor-sagging-observed-at-East-wall-of-WTC-2S--NCSTAR_1-6D_p324.png :


Inward-bowing-West-Wall-WTC-2S-at-Collapse--NCSTAR_1-6D_p327.png :


High resolution 3.5 MB animated GIF by waypastvne of the South Tower corner's floor-inward pull :
s995.photobucket.com...



Note also the smoke and dust squib spitting out to the left, from just under the corner failure.
When you look carefully to the right upper side of this facade side of WTC-2S, in this You Tube video of the collapse INITIATION of the South Tower, you see the failure progressing at a floor much higher than the above burning corner hole.
The top tilting after that as a whole block is obvious, by the hinge forming in those exterior panels line, situated along one floor level line much higher than the corner hole, at the far right side of that facade :
www.youtube.com...





REFERENCES

1. Some Practical Applications of FORENSIC SEISMOLOGY.

9-11-01 History Archive: 2.
World Trade Center Evidence-Based Research. 9-11-01 Visual Evidence Archive.
A World Trade Center Collapse Investigative Resource

3. Seismic Proof – 9/11 Was An Inside Job (Updated Version II)
by Craig T. Furlong & Gordon Ross (Member, Scholars for 9/11 Truth) © 2006

a reply to: LaBTop

You show utter ignorance of basic understanding of demo-techniques, with those repetitive posts about the Verinage technique of demolishing a building WITHOUT explosives,...

On the contrary, I am right on the money. Ever seen the video of crews pulling down WTC 6 with cables where the steel frame building eventually collapsed straight down?

Ever wondered why steel frame buildings are structurally pre-weakened and gutted before explosives are attached to the steel columns?

Ever wondered why this steel frame building collapsed without the aid of explosives?

Steel Frame Building Collapsed without Explosives

Note also the smoke and dust squib spitting out to the left, from just under the corner failure. When you look carefully to the right upper side of this facade side of WTC-2S, in this You Tube video of the collapse INITIATION of the South Tower, you see the failure progressing at a floor much higher than the above burning corner hole.

The top tilting after that as a whole block is obvious, by the hinge forming in those exterior panels line, situated along one floor level line much higher than the corner hole, at the far right side of that facade :

It all proves my point that fire was mainly responsible for the collapse of the WTC buildings.

About the tilting of WTC 2, you will notice in this video that WTC 6 tilts as well, but it doesn't fall over on its side.

a reply to: LaBTop

About the seismic data, nowhere in that data does it depict demo explosions and you can ask the demolition experts whose monitors were in use that day and yet, they have stated for the record that their seismic monitors did not detect such explosions. Check it out.

Brent Blanchard: Demolition Expert and Demolition Writer

Brent Blanchard: One thing I would add is that there are vibration recordings from the site. The seismograph readings that were recorded on 9/11, as they are every day worldwide, recorded the impacts of the planes and the actual collapses of the structures.

You can see in those waveforms and in that data that there was no sudden catalyst at 10:06 or any other time; there was no explosive event. So in order for an explosive detonation to be hidden, folks at those laboratories, actual scientists at Columbia University and other places, would also have needed to be part of the conspiracy.

In the end there is absolutely no scientific evidence that there were explosions in any of those three buildings, and that means a lot to me.

undicisettembre.blogspot.it...

To sum it up, ground zero seismic data does not depict demolition explosions, which is confirmed by the fact that no demo explosives are seen nor heard on video as WTC 1, WTC 2, and WTC 7 collapsed and by the fact that no evidence of explosive hardware was ever found at ground zero.

Brent Blanchard's Interview

Furthermore, if you were going to bulk load the columns, you would have not only seen the fireball where the plane hit but also huge fireballs everywhere these explosives detonate, and nothing of the sort was seen.

Brent Blanchard: To prepare those buildings for being demolished would take a lot of preparation. You would need a lot of people involved or you would need a few people for a very long time: weeks minimum, months probably. And they need direct access to the columns. They would not only need access to the buildings undetected but they would need access to the H-beams. They would need to do something to pre-weaken those flanges. There's work that needs to be done or the explosives just wouldn't work.

So you would need people to go inside the building for a long time, and people in the offices would obviously notice that there's something going on. You would also need all these people working on the columns – and witnesses - to stay completely silent about this for many years afterward and not tell anyone, not even their parents or their wife. Not even on their death bed.

undicisettembre.blogspot.it...

To sum that up, the claim of explosives at ground zero was nothing more than a fabrication on the part of the Truth Movement.

a reply to: LaBTop

The two plane impacts into the tops of the two towers were not explosions, more like conflagrations of a huge cloud of dispersed jet fuel. We can't expect them to behave on a seismogram like real explosions, with their much faster explosive gas-front speeds, and resulting sharp spikes on a seismogram.

We also have to differentiate between three types of explosions.
1. Aerial explosions. Low seismic spikes.
2. Sub-aerial explosions. Medium spikes.
3. Subterranean/basement explosions. Huge spikes.

As noted by Brent Blanchard, his company's seismic monitors, which were in used at the time of the 9/11 attack, did not detect demo explosions at ground zero.

Protec Documentation Services

Protec Documentation Services is recognized as an international leader in the field of vibration studies, field monitoring and structure inspection services.

www.protecservices.com...

Now, that you know that Protec Docmentation Services Co. is a world renowned conpany, let's hear what they had to say about seismic data at ground zero.

Interview with Protec Documentation Services Co.

Protec: All Seismic evidence from many independent sources on 9/11 showed none of the sudden vibration spikes that result from explosive detonations.

Claim #9: Anyone who denies that explosives were used is ignoring evidence.

Protec: Most of our comments apply to the differences between what people actually saw on 9/11 and what they should have seen had explosives been present.

The hundreds of men and women who worked to remove debris from ground zero were some of the countries most experienced and respected demolition veterans.

They of all people processed the experience and expertise to recognize evidence of controlled demolition if it existed. None of these people has come forward with suspicions that explosives were used.

911blogger.com...

So once again, no evidence of demo explosions, either in your seismic data, video, audio, nor found in the rubble at ground zero. In other words, zero evidence for explosives and thermite.

Truthers taking comments, data and evidence out of context are not doing their homework, or doing their homework correctly when they do, are primes reasons how they have distorted facts and evidence over the years, which have clouded the 9/11 terrorist attack with disinformation on a grand scale.

It seems that truthers haven't a clue as to why after 14 years, not one shred of evidence has surfaced that proves a false flag operation or the used of thermite and explosives for that matter. Their evidence of explosives consist of hoaxed and doctored videos and photos, or comments from people who said they heard what sounded like explosives, when it fact, their comments were later clarified that indicated the sounds they heard had nothing to do with explosives, never mind that many things not associated with explosives can generate explosion-like sounds as well.

a reply to: LaBTop

Why does this depiction debunk claims that explosives and thermite was used?

imageshack.com...

Answer: The depiction proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that fire is slowly weakening the steel structure. Additionally, there are no demo explosions evident in that depiction. Once the floors gave way, there was noting to stop the pancake collapse.

Here is the video of WTC 2 and you will notice that there is no sound of demolition explosions prior to the collapse of WTC 2, which effectively debunks claims that seismic data depicted explosions just prior to the collapse of WTC 2.



Now, let's take a look at WTC 1 and notice that there is no sound of demo explosions prior nor duriing, the collapse of WTC 1, which effectively debunks the claim that seismic data depicted explosions prior to the collapse of WTC 1.

Also take notice that debris in free fall are outpacing the collapse of WTC 1, which in itself, effectively debunks truther claims that WTC 1 fell at free fall speed.



To sum it up, the claim that seismic data depicted demo explosions is an attempt to distort the facts and spread disinformation.

Assuming the role of a disinterested observer, the analysis and conclusions put forth by LaBTop are far more logical and persuasive than the material put forth by Skyeagle.

There is simply no way the official story can be believed. The buildings were brought down by some sort of explosive devices.

A reply to: waypastvne

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Page 41, waypastvne : Did you ever notice the layer of fire proofing laying on the ground after the impact but before the collapse.

9:08 in this video.
www.youtube.com...

I don't notice it at 3:11 nor at 3:26 in your video :

youtu.be... (3:11 / 1:02:59)
3:11 - That's clearly a 200 meter long, CLEAN street leading to a side of a tower, which base can be seen in the near distance. Even closer in time to the impacts, if there is a logical video time line. Only a few papers laying around.
youtu.be... (3:26 / 1:02:59)
3:31 - Another clean street with some papers, followed by a zoom-in at the burning tower side.
Thus, after impacts, before ANY collapse.

At 5:05 you see both towers burning.
At 6:00 you see perhaps a very thin layer of dust on the street, but not on top of the round dust-bin, nor on the street signs, nor on the trees.

No collapse yet, no heaps of EVENTUAL fireproofing dust to see. Only a thin layer of probably gypsum dust mixed with a bit of fireproofing particles that got scraped off by the impacting planes.
Nobody has collected dust from those nearby streets from the period in between the plane impacts and the first collapse, so it's totally impossible to ever prove that that dust at 9:08 was fireproofing, or whatever else. Logic again tells us however that the biggest chance is, that it was mainly gypsum from spacing walls and elevator shafts covers, and other materials, f.ex. cubicles material like vermiculite filled cubicle dividers, slammed into dust by those huge impacts.
IF it was dust from the impacts...

That really thick layer of dust covering everything, comes after the collapses. And a lot of it is plain gypsum from those thousands of gypsum filled wall boards. And perhaps some vermiculite dust. And plain dust from girders and other former tower surface areas, hidden for the eye, covered with years of dust.

At 7:20 the guy in the gray New York T-shirt explains that he saw the second impact. He's interviewed near the tower, and there's only a very thin layer of dust on the street, at the most.
At 7:36 the man in the suit says he saw the first impact from inside the Millennium Hotel.
At 9:08 you see that thin layer of gypsum dust etc. covering the road surface.

No parked cars covered yet with that same dust, very strange indeed. As if that first thin dust layer was precipitated by a layer of blown away dust from just above the street level. For example from those reported heavy basement explosions, preceding the plane impacts by 13 seconds. See the above Furlong & Ross paper from 2006 and look at the radar times which differ about 13 seconds with the NIST plane impact times for both towers.!


On a side note, of course a lot of fireproofing was scraped off the by plane parts impacted steel. Logic tells us however, that most of it stayed inside the impacted holes, and only a small amount made it outside.
There's a whole other story to tell after each tower collapse.

A reply to: skyeagle409

Ask PROTEC, the firm which Brent Blanchard works for as a journalist/editor, to produce that PRIME EVIDENCE for natural collapses.

I assure you that they will not do that, since they told me years ago already, that those precious pieces of seismic evidence were lost from their repositories...

Of course they won't produce them, because a child would immediately see the evidence for explosions on such very nearby registering devices. Just as could be seen on the handhold seismograms from Dr Brown during the demolition of the remnants of the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City in 1995, a few weeks after MCVeigh and others blew up 1/3 of that building.
Those hand-holds were situated very nearby too.

If at some time in the future, anybody turns up with falsified seismograms from PROTEC's handhold devices, I, and a few seismologists will fall all over them. And I warned PROTEC that if that would happen, the whole Blanchard CANARD would blow up in their faces.

They never produced them.
And you don't find that suspicious at all?

Any fanatic OS defender such as you, would give his left pinky for such prime evidence, if there were NO sudden huge spikes of much higher amplitudes from the explosions than the following natural falling building debris hitting ground on such seismograms.
Of course these impacting-debris preceding huge explosives evidence spikes would be there, if those seismograms really existed....and that's why they never produced them, if they ever really had them...

I'll say it again, right in his face, Blanchard was a hired propagandist for the OS, or a self proclaimed one. He never returned to this ATS 9/11 forum to defend himself, after I challenged him to produce those seismograms from these hand-holds, his bosses were not taking risks with the guy anymore. And took the clever way out of that quagmire Blanchard had brought them in : ""We're SOoo sorry, we lost them."" ?

As a person who blows up things for a living, let me explain a few things.

Do any of you have even a small idea as to how long it takes to prep a building for demolition? WEEKS.

Now I'm only talking about 10 stories and less. Huge Sky Scrapers? MONTHS to YEARS.

I get the biggest kick out of these conspiracy theories. So, let me make sure I understand. For WEEKS ahead of time, teams of demo people infiltrated the building, removing walls so that specific charges could be placed, the walls were then replaced to hide the evidence, then cabling was run to "some location" where no one noticed and no one reported that strange people were in the building disrupting the tenants as thousands of pounds of high explosives were "planted". And no one noticed the 20 tractor trailers parked on the streets where the explosives and assorted cabling and demo gear were stored as they were clandestinely planted.

Then, coordinated with a group of terrorists who didn't have anything to communicate with (I'm guessing that some weird theory about mind reading is going to be invoked here), they waited for a specific time to then blow up their "planted charges" in sequence with the 2 airplanes that slammed into the towers, to "make sure" the buildings collapsed?

Did I get this right? Do you have any idea how complicated this is, when it's done in the wide open, let alone being done "clandestinely"?

Oh come on, seriously? It takes our teams weeks to get a building ready for demolition, we did a multi-story building in Vegas a couple of years ago, that took 115 people 5 weeks to get the building ready, and that was with the building completely empty (and most of the interior already removed so we had easy access to the building's infrastructure) with no one around to "wonder what we were up to". Imagine how many people would be needed to wire up the twin towers.

Imagine what you could be inventing with all of this mind work instead of looking for a boogie man that simply doesn't exist.

As far as "explosive sounds" go, I have heard steel beams snap in buildings as they are in the process of going down, that sound far louder than the explosives we used to destabilize the building.

That's what you are hearing. The buildings internal structure collapsing. I've heard it hundreds of times.

Okay, slam away!!!

Here is a building in ATL, it took them 4 MONTHS to prepare the explosives and get the building ready to implode. Imagine how long it would have taken to prepare the twin towers.

www.youtube.com...

a reply to: matadoor

Oh come on, seriously? It takes our teams weeks to get a building ready for demolition, we did a multi-story building in Vegas a couple of years ago, that took 115 people 5 weeks to get the building ready

And yet, an hour of fires on a couple of floors can do the exact same job........do you really believe that?

a reply to: Flatcoat

I sure as hell believe that over any other option, anything else makes no sense what-so-ever, I can't imagine no one noticing demo crews planting explosives for weeks on end into TWO skyscrapers, let alone the traffic snarls from the tractor trailers where everything would be staged.

Reality is a real b!tch sometimes.

originally posted by: Flatcoat
And yet, an hour of fires on a couple of floors can do the exact same job........do you really believe that?

Yup.

Granted, you are trying to equate an uncontrolled collapse from structural failure to a controlled demolition...so, I do see why you are having trouble accepting it.

You gotta love Popular Mechanics.

www.popularmechanics.com...

Case closed. Anything else is complete fantasy.

For any other theories, you need to also explain the logistics for how it was possibly set up weeks in advance WITHOUT being noticed by anyone, including the building maintenance people, who, BTW were a UNION shop and would have singled out even a single person who appeared to be doing work in ANY of the buildings, they would have DEMANDED that any such work stop immediately until a union representative showed up to see why a union worker was not performing the work.

There is no possible way workers could have gone for weeks on end without being noticed, trust me, my company has been shut down PLENTY of times for not knowing a certain area was a union shop.

a reply to: Flatcoat

And yet, an hour of fires on a couple of floors can do the exact same job........do you really believe that?

Yep Here's a partial collapse due to a vending machine fire.
Delft University
Do some research beyond 911 conspiracy sites.

a reply to: Salander

Assuming the role of a disinterested observer, the analysis and conclusions put forth by LaBTop are far more logical and persuasive than the material put forth by Skyeagle.

Pure bunk on your part. Even demolition experts have trashed LaBTop's claim that seismic data depicts demo explosives and look what you posted.

You are not playing with a full deck.

a reply to: Salander

For example from those reported heavy basement explosions, preceding the plane impacts by 13 seconds.

That is false because witnesses later said that the explosions they heard were from falling elevators. Let's take a look at reality.

The Elevator Man's Tale

Robert Jones:
Occupation: Elevator mechanic for Ace Elevator in the World Trade Center
Was in the south tower when the first plane hit.


We heard the explosion and within a matter of seconds after that impact, I heard – and as well as everybody else heard – this noise, this increasing sound of wind. And it was getting louder and louder. It was like a bomb, not quite the sound of a bomb coming down from a bomber. It was a sound of wind increasing, a whistling sound, increasing in sound.

What we heard was 6 and 7 car free-falling from the 107th floor and they impacted the basement at B-2 Level. And that’s the explosion that filled the lobby within a matter of two or three seconds, engulfed the lobby in dust, smoke.

www.thrnewmedia.com...

The fact that truthers have tried to portray the sounds in the basement as the result of explosive when witnesses have said the sounds were the result of falling elevators proves that truthers are in the habit of distorting facts and evidence on a regular basis.

a reply to: matadoor

You gotta love Popular Mechanics.

www.popularmechanics.com...

Case closed. Anything else is complete fantasy.

For any other theories, you need to also explain the logistics for how it was possibly set up weeks in advance WITHOUT being noticed by anyone, including the building maintenance people, who, BTW were a UNION shop and would have singled out even a single person who appeared to be doing work in ANY of the buildings, they would have DEMANDED that any such work stop immediately until a union representative showed up to see why a union worker was not performing the work.

There is no possible way workers could have gone for weeks on end without being noticed, trust me, my company has been shut down PLENTY of times for not knowing a certain area was a union shop.

It all goes to show that truthers deal only in fantasy, not facts.