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WTC-7 Mysteries FINALLY Solved.

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posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 03:58 PM
Sterling Seagrave became a member of this below Education forum on January 11, 2007. He has 103 posts there. Go read that very informative forum, and his 103 posts there.
This is his first post there on 16 Jan. 2007. CLICK HERE and read those 3 pages.

He was given his own thread where he and his wife Peggy could answer questions about their Gold Warriors book :
Sterling and Peggy Seagrave: Gold Warriors (also 3 pages) :
If you understood by now that all US Administrations after WW II have been taken over by endless-war criminals who all deserve the gallows, you MUST read these three pages.
Your country has become the home for all new reborn Nazi's. It was already the home for all the wealthy Nazi supporters before WW II. When that REAL American, President Roosevelt, died in early 1945, all these rats crawled out of the woodwork again and slowly took over again.

You don't believe that.? :
Assassination as a Tool of Fascism, a transcript of a talk by John Judge titled :
The Fourth Reich in America :

And, at that point, a different position was taken by some of the Allied countries. There were divisions within the class as to how much money should have been expended on these Fascists. There were others there who supported them, but it was time to regroup. It was time to back off a little, to try to get what they had together. The resources were more or less expended in the effort to set up a permanent war economy, which Charles Wilson from General Electric talked about. And to go into what they called the `Cold War,' or `low intensity warfare,' and genocide against Third World people, while they continued to build the empire and maintain the hegemony. And to re-establish the Fourth Reich, the Fascism, not only here in the United States but throughout the world.

1947-1948 is when the USA changed one vital institution from `Secretary of War,' to `Secretary of Defense.' And just that little word change is enough propaganda to make clear what's happening.

The death of FDR brought about a sea-change in America that restored to power essentially the same group that had gained control under Woodrow Wilson and hugely expanded that power under Herbert Hoover. They were the same people who would have preferred an alliance with the Nazis against the Soviets, but were outmaneuvered by FDR and Churchill. Many of them had never lost power under FDR, simply submerging, remaining as a 5th Column, or taking refuge in the OSS, or on Wall Street. Averell Harriman, for example, posed as a Democrat, while his magazine NEWSWEEK became a key reactionary instrument in attacking the credentials of war crimes investigators, journalists, and sabotaging systematically the long-projected reform of Japan into a democratic society. Only land reform was accomplished before the group including Hoover, Harriman, Morgan, Rockefeller, and others using General MacArthur as their cat’s-paw, were able to redeem Hirohito, free all the indicted war criminals from Sugamo Prison, and enlist the most dangerous of them to suppress any form of democracy, labor unions, or multi-party democracy, returning Japanese government to the wartime fascists where power remains today. This was done not only to fulfill America’s Puritanical obsession with righteous money, but to acquire Japan (the most industrialized country in Asia) as an economic ally, and as a fascist bulwark against the encroaching Maoists, Stalinists, Trotskyites, or any group of underdogs whose protests could easily be labeled Leftist. Control of US and European media was a priority, a lesson learned from Goebbels, and the vast treasures looted by the Nazis and the Japanese were used in secret slush funds to acquire newspapers, magazines, radio and later television, throughout the world. This was an imperfect effort at Mediopoly, but it had the result of numbing down the audience. And in the meantime war crimes investigators who persisted in Asia were victims of “assisted suicide” or mysterious plane crashes. Thousands of European and Asian POWs and civilian prisoners and slave laborers were buried alive in mine shafts and treasure vaults by Japanese corporations like Mitsubishi, while survivors were warned not to pursue lawsuits for compensation. Those tainted Japanese corporations quickly regained their global leverage, claiming that their war crimes had been the work of different, earlier, management.


Now let the next lines sink in slowly but thoroughly, especially the ones I bolded out :

John Simkin, on Feb 2 2007, 09:57 AM, said:
(3) What was the motivation of the American authorities to cover-up these events?
Sterling Seagrave :
Ultimately, the motive of American politicians, financiers, industrialists, lobbyists, and their journalistic pawns, was to replace global European empires with an American empire - to profit in countless ways from WW2 as they had from WW1. They were quick to do so, so quick that OSS agents in Bangkok who thought they were still at war with fascism were astonished to be replaced overnight by CIA agents who were allied with fascism against communism - publicly. It soon became evident even to the slow-witted among them that power and leverage were attained and secured by money, so once the Nazi and Japanese war loot was in the pipeline, drugs and the laundering of drug money replaced gold as the universal standard backing the dollar. It is no exaggeration to say that the day after WW2 ended, Richard Nixon woke up in bed with Meyer Lansky.


To top it all off, you should NOW read and then VIEW the first 4 videos at :
There's MUCH more to view and hear on that superb site. A treasure trove indeed. :
If you feel the need to read all its 9/11 sub pages, take a long vacation and a good chair.
It's certainly worth your effort.

I do realize lately that the real researchers from the early years have given up on this forum, and that the bulk of this 9/11 forum its still present readers will scroll through my LONG posts as fast as can be.

Inevitably however, there will come a time, they will start to READ them, after at last realizing they are living an essentially slave-labor live, under ice cold bloody NAZI rulers and/or sympathizers, for a long, long time already.

Lots of good new threads will hopefully spawn from all my offered, above links.

posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 04:18 PM
a reply to: Doctor Smith

It could not have been a hologram because it generated physical material, landing gear and engine pieces. That material went to the street, the pictures showed it going to the street glowing. Holograms can't do that.

posted on Aug, 23 2016 @ 07:45 PM
The following details are taken from here :

Watch at 2:48 minutes into that 3 minutes long video, titled "Rockets at the World Trade Center", which shows the first seconds of the South Tower collapse from its 2:37 minute point onward.

This is my ATS-uploaded screenshot (340 kb) of that 2:48 minute point, which shows those peculiar "rockets" clearly in HD :

This below video starts at that 2:48 minute point (t=168).
After viewing that for a while, you should rewind the video by Pausing the video and then move the thin red bottom slider play-bar backwards with your mouse to 2:37 minutes, and then you should keep very fast double-clicking the Pause button (that small white triangle key in the left side bottom) with your mouse pointer during all those 11 seconds, and watch the still pictures after every double-click.
Keep double-clicking and keep watching the different pictures, up to that 2:48 minutes point.
Make screenshots if you see the rest of the "gravitational" anomalies.... post them in here.

Interesting, non naturally occurring, non-gravitational-effect things happen in that 11 seconds lasting time span before THIS happens at 2:48 :

Richt-CLICK this LINK first, and choose to open it in a new browser tab.!

This is the full length 3 minutes video, you can now watch in this ATS page :

After doing all of that you should play that video its 11 seconds period, after that 2:37 minutes point, at its normal speed again, now that you have a much better understanding about which unnatural things are happening in those 11 seconds. And thus, where your attention should be focused on.

posted on Aug, 23 2016 @ 07:48 PM
Then you should watch these three videos of real, genuine natural collapses, and try to show me the same unnatural events as the ones you saw in the above WTC2S Tower's collapse video :


Title : RAW: Moment five-story building collapses in Nairobi, Kenya

Title : Footage: Buildings collapse in Shenzhen landslide

Note that the dust clouds start to form only, after the first building parts hit the ground.

Side note : no fire involved, no high rise steel ones.
So, we have to find a video of a natural collapse, AFTER an initial fire, of a high-rise steel building, just as NIST and the US government so dearly try to convince us, should have happened on 9/11.

Well, that's not so difficult. Find the Madrid Windsor Building Fire videos of a 32 story, 106-meters-high building in Spain which its top 6 steel floors partially collapsed. Use the latest Opera browser, go to and fill in "Madrid Windsor Building fire" :
Link, CLICK here. You get f.ex. these videos :

Title : Windsor Building Fire BBC Report (0:58 min. ) :

Title : INCENDIO WINDSOR (1:00 min. ) :

This above Spanish news video shows as the best, that a NATURAL collapse of a steel high rise proceeds in a chaotic manner, and over a VERY long time span.
And the failing steel parts all come from the fire inferno area, not from still intact, not on fire, building floors as in the WTC Tower collapses after the initiation phase.
And they are not "spitting outwards in ring-form clouds" as in Manhattan on 9/11, but tumble down in a clearly gravity driven manner, one by one during many, many minutes.

posted on Aug, 23 2016 @ 07:56 PM
Title : The Collapse of WTC 1: Madrid Exposes a Fundamental Flaw :

The aluminum wings and the planes their fuselages would have been almost instantly shredded into pieces the size of an adult's fist, said Tomasz Wierzbicki, director of the impact and crash-worthiness laboratory at M.I.T. (Massachusets Institute of Technology)
Engines and other heavy parts continued to the core, but by working out the amount of energy involved, Dr. Wierzbicki and a student, Liang Xue, determined that at most half the inner columns could have been broken or severely mangled.
Source : New York Times.

The debris will have been immensely decelerated by the combined office debris and impacted floors debris that would have been shoveled forwards in front of the plane debris.
In my opinion, there was much less damage to the 47 core columns than these early analysis proposed. They all made pictures as if that huge office space was totally empty.
When you look at the HD-pictures of the inside of the impact holes in those two towers, you see HUGE heaps of debris resting against one side of those thick steel core columns.
That still further compacting building debris that was pushed ahead of the already severely compacted plane debris, after the initial steel facade columns and their spandrel plates impact by the then intact plane, worked however as a huge deceleration force.
An immense deceleration cushion, so to say.
Only the thin inner titanium axes of the two jet engines, parts of the thick aluminum wing struts and the longitudinal aluminum beams in the fuselage could perhaps have reached and damaged or cut a few of those core columns.

Well, Charles M. Beck DID remove half of all those core columns from his engineering math calculations, and to top it off, he also removed half of ALL the inner and outer steel its strength....
And still those towers would not by far have collapsed, shows his engineering math.!

Title : The Madrid Skyscraper Fire :
Only the steel parts of the top 6 floors of the Madrid Tower failed, that were NOT fire insulated.
And only after they had been FULLY engulfed in a 3 hour long INFERNO of at least 800 Celsius.

Title : The 9/11 WTC Fires: Where's the Inferno? :

A powerful, high temperature, high explosive, capable of slicing the strong steel core columns that comprised the WTC towers central core, provided the energy missing in the official account :

I proposed for many years already they used Thermobaric explosives in several forms, which fit all effects we see in the WTC collapse videos, they deliver the high temperatures needed to scatter the steel reinforced concrete floor decks, when exploding, and can cut steel columns as butter, when their outer shell is ring formed and shape charged as pre-configured discus-formed exploding gas/plasma clouds that can reach speeds of 20,000 m/sec over a short distance.
And, they leave NO traces....

In a September 1, 2006, New York Times article, "U.S. moves to debunk ‘alternative theories’ on Sept. 11 attacks", Jim Dwyer reports that the National Institute of Standards and Technology, an agency of the U.S. Dept. of Commerce, disputes Professor Jones’ suggestion. NIST believes that such "enormous quantities of thermite would have to be applied to the structural columns to damage them", that engineered demolition is not feasible.
Gentle reader, note what NIST is saying.!

If no reasonable quantity of the explosive thermite which is used for engineered demolition (LT : or TBs used as in the Szechnia War by the Russian military, to collapse high rise buildings with sniper nests in them), could damage the powerful buildings, the measly energy from an airliner, a bit of jet fuel, and gravity could not have collapsed the buildings.
Source : Peoples Voice.

This is, on the other hand, an 8:15 minutes demolition jobs video compilation; pay attention to the last part from about 7:00 minutes on, where you see the detailed views of their explosions.

Suddenly realize then, that you see another demolition job while you saw pass by your eyes, the few shots of the WTC collapses, sprinkled through this explosive video compilation its first part, up to 7:00 min., since you now CAN compare them to the Madrid Windsor Tower fire video "INCENDIO WINDSOR" you just viewed 2 posts earlier :

Title : Building Collapse Only in 5 seconds


posted on Sep, 2 2016 @ 02:04 PM

originally posted by: [post=21162994]LaBTop
Watch at 2:48 minutes into that 3 minutes long video, titled "Rockets at the World Trade Center", which shows the first seconds of the South Tower collapse from its 2:37 minute point onward.


Motion capture and analysis in action. Chandler makes a claim and uses motion capture analysis to back his claim.

This is what I've been asking you to do when you make the claim that exterior columns can be seen to be "blown" upwards and then into a parabolic arc.

Why is it so hard to back your claims?

posted on Sep, 2 2016 @ 02:07 PM

originally posted by: [post=21163015]LaBTop

This above Spanish news video shows as the best, that a NATURAL collapse of a steel high rise

Well, there you have it folks.

FINALLY, an admission that it fell collapsed naturally from fire alone.

Who else will step into reality and admit that steel fails in fire?

posted on Sep, 2 2016 @ 02:28 PM

originally posted by: [post=21163045]LaBTop

Well, Charles M. Beck DID remove half of all those core columns from his engineering math calculations, and to top it off, he also removed half of ALL the inner and outer steel its strength....

Sad that you believe this. He's basing his paper on the failed belief that loads would be redistributed evenly among the remaining structure. But what happens when the column damage is asymmetrical? I'll tell you what happens - it isn't redistributed equally.

It goes something like this -

In a simple 1D model, we have 3 columns that can support 200 tons each, supporting a 200 ton load, giving them a 3:1 safety factor. If we remove the center one, then loads are equally distributed between the 2 outer ones.

So we go from this loading schedule, simply represented below-

67 tons 67 tons 67 tons

to this-

100 tons 0 tons 100 tons

However, if we remove the right column, what happens? Beck would have us believe that the loading schedule goes from-

67 tons 67 tons 67 tons

to this-

100 tons 100 tons 0 tons

Reality says that this doesn't happen. If we remove the right column, loads go to-

0 tons 200 tons 0 tons

Well lookie there! The center column is at 100% capacity!

How much fire weakening would it take to make the center column buckle and fail? Not much.

This is what happened, and this is why Beck is wrong.

posted on Sep, 2 2016 @ 04:04 PM
a reply to: LaBTop

Solved the day it happened. Buildings that aren't hit by falling debris or aircraft and only had a small contained fire on 1-2 floors DON"T collapse of their own accord. Explosives inside the building is the ONLY answer.

posted on Sep, 2 2016 @ 05:51 PM

originally posted by: richapau
a reply to: LaBTop

Solved the day it happened. Buildings that aren't hit by falling debris or aircraft and only had a small contained fire on 1-2 floors DON"T collapse of their own accord. Explosives inside the building is the ONLY answer.

Contained by what exactly?

Firefighters weren't fighting the fires in 7, so it wasn't them.

In reality, they weren't contained by anything, nor are there any positive evidence of explosives.

Therefore, your summation is in error.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 11:45 AM
A reply to: MrBig2430

I don't think you can simplify the load distribution problem to some sort of simplified see-saw example.
There were far more columns involved than just 3.
Hundreds more, and their composite floor connections.

In the next posts I will answer more of your remarks.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 11:53 AM
Now take the time to watch this 2 hrs video, published on Nov 27, 2015, also available as a YouTube video :
Title : Incontrovertible - New 9/11 documentary by Tony Rooke :

Tony is the man from England that went to court and won, when he refused to pay British TV tax. Based on his conviction that the BBC (who would benefit from his tax money) was encouraging in fact state-level based terrorism and fear mongering by the US and GB, based on the BBC their coverage of the WTC-7 collapse on 9/11.
The judge in that court let him go without any fine, and he is not paying that tax up till this day.

He invited the BBC to defend their position as shown in their TV-coverage on the day of 9/11/2001, but the BBC declined, to this day, to defend itself against his allegations against them, which he brought forth to the table in that British court.
His substantiated allegations laid forth at that court, which convinced that judge, that Tony Rooke indeed had a case against the BBC's coverage of state sponsored terrorism :

If you can't bring yourself now, to watch the whole very interesting 2 hours, just start at 1: 35:00 minutes....
You then probably gonna watch the whole video, after reading the words of Ben Griffin, former SAS (Parachute Regiment), and listening the next 5 minutes to Ken O'Keefe, former US Marine.

Ken damn well explains what ugly sickness the western world's elite leaders are suffering from since the time just after the end of WW II :
Psychopathic GREED at no personal risk at all, fed by utter egoism and a total disdain for basic rules which will originate from a Caring Society.
These people only seek after implementing greedy societies, usually led by the political puppets of a super-greedy military-industrial elite and only sporadically led by a self-declared dictator, who of course also leans strongly on his own installed egoistic elite.

You then watch the rest of this video because it is stocked up full with personal stories from Law Enforcement and Firefighting Departments members from the US and GB, and also members of the Military from both countries, who all question the official stories as told by their governments, and they tell you WHY they do so.

And a lot more 9/11 related information, dressed up quite different than we used to view in older 9/11 documentaries.

"Artfully crafted - manages to convince cumulatively that there are still questions to answer" - Joe Gill - Journalist - Middle East Eye

"Absolutely first rate! The film manages to navigate the broad aspects of 9/11, with all the complexity, and even tie it with 7/7 and JFK, while avoiding the pitfalls of discredited speculative theories. I have no hesitation in sharing this with anyone" - David Chandler, retired physics teacher.

-- snip --
Section 15 Article 3 of the UK Terrorism Act (2000) states:

(3) A person commits an offense if he— (a) provides money or other property, and (b) knows or has REASONABLE CAUSE to suspect that it will or may be used for the purposes of terrorism.

This film gives us more than REASONABLE CAUSE to suspect that in the UK we are ALL guilty of funding the purposes of terrorism through our taxes and funding of the BBC.

And his evidence in court convinced that judge that he had a reasonable case against the BBC.

Btw, Tony Blair was forced lately by the outcome of a very thorough investigation, to admit that his decision in early 2002 for British participation in the Gulf Wars was based on deceitful Intelligence information he got from his US allies.
AMEN to the lifes of all their victims.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:13 PM

originally posted by: LaBTop
Tony is the man from England that went to court and won,

There you go, posting made up crap again.

He did not win, he LOST!

Rooke, who admitted owning a TV and watching it without a licence, was found guilty of using an unlicensed set, given a six-month conditional discharge and told to pay £200 costs.

One of the conditions of his conditional discharge was he had to get a licence. And pay £200!

So not a win at all.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:24 PM
End note :

More British soldiers commit suicide than die in battle, new figures revealed....1:39:25 min.
There's 22 US Service members a day who are committing suicide every day...

These youngsters can't live anymore with the guilt and the shame. And the way they were treated after they returned to their homelands...
Listen to Ken O'Keefe, explaining why these veterans kill themselves in such shilling numbers. Up to 1:40:17 min.

Then hear that father EXPLAINING the atrocities his suicide son had to go through, around the 1:42:45 min. point....about the order to shoot begging Iraqi children, it's too sad to even be able to cry.
You can't grasp what all these kids at both side of the fences are going through, it's an endless disaster.
First the Korean War, then the Vietnam War, then the Nicaraguan War, then the Afghan and Iraqi Wars, now the Syrian War, it goes on and on, a truly war based economy.

How can you still live a happy life with all that shared, endless guilt.?

You really should watch the first of those last 20 minutes of this video, especially if you are a dad or mom of a serving soldier. From whatever country....It's very, very moving, but only when you still have some compassion left.
My hat's off, for that American father. So balanced in his analysis of his sons suicide reasons.
Can't express it any better, so, also a deep, deep bow to him.

It's time for REAL chance.
Bring an END to that state of perpetual WAR that your country is forced upon by a far too greedy and far too rich psychopathic elite. The greed has gone far out of hand.
Eradicate those kind of decisions makers. Get rid of them. Force them out of power.

Make room again for the genuinely compassionate civil Servants. The non-fakers.
Do it the Gandhi way. Don't slip away as a coward, stand for what you believe. At every cost.

At 1:53:20 min. (at 1:47:55 min he comes first in view) , the famous Italian Mafia- and Gladio investigating Judge, the brave Ferdinando Imposimato says :
"We have had this problem now for many years. But it is not finished."
He means 9/11, it's not going away until fully solved.

1:54:24 minutes, read Judge Imposimato's explanation for 9/11...
He's a very old, wise and honest man.
His brother was murdered as a cruel warning, and still he didn't give up his investigations into the Mafia and Gladio.
Gladio was (is?) a, by NATO top-brass endorsed terror group, operating in the 60ties to the 90ties, that executed many very bloody false flag terror attacks in Italy and the rest of Europe, search f.ex. for "Bologna train station attack". Those attacks were all meant to blame the "communists", but were all done by Gladio members who were all former or active duty military men :

Judge Imposimato : "The 9/11 attacks were a global terror operation permitted by the administration of the USA, which had foreknowledge of the operation, yet remained intentionally unresponsive, in order to make war against Afghanistan and Iraq.
To put it briefly, the 9/11 events were an instance of the strategy of tension enacted by political and economic powers in the USA to seek advantages for the oil and arms industries".

Well said.!

A Roman Empire Senate speech : "It doesn't matter if they love us or not, as long as they fear us".
And then the fear ebbed away, and the Romans learned to fear...and lost their empire, and Rome, to the plundering barbarian hordes coming from the East.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:28 PM
For those youngsters everywhere, who want to know the real reasons for 9/11, you should listen to, and view at least the first 10 minutes of this documentary from Nov. 29, 2015 :

Title : Declassified Documents Expose Why 9/11 Happened and The Masterminds Behind it.
It is an update of this former documentary, titled :
Hijacking Catastrophe - 9/11, Fear & the Selling of American Empire.

The rest of this 1:11:04 hr long documentary deals with a very detailed explanation of the first 10 minutes full of 9/11 reasons.

The whole 9/11 follow-up reactions of the United States of America were based on falsified and knowingly falsely indicated Intelligence information.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:36 PM
At 1:17:57 / 1:40:40 in this August 2013 re-published "9/11 Eyewitness" video which was originally made by Rick Siegel in 2004, he and his team (that he abandoned not much later) are looking at the projectile motion of the North Tower WTC1N debris.
Click this link to start that video at that point :

They first show you, that a cannonball trajectory when shot away horizontally, does not fit the dust cloud form they used to show you the unnatural NON-gravitational behavior of these dust clouds.
They also show you some chunks falling near to the tower sides that DO act gravitational.

Then they show you that an UPWARD shot cannonball trajectory PRECISELY fits that formed dust cloud.
What they did is find a trajectory that precisely fitted the LOWER and upper boundary of that formed right side dust cloud.

That's however wrong.
They should have used a solid piece of steel debris, from the moment it came in sight, and followed its unfolding trajectory outwards, then find a fitting cannonball trajectory that covered that outer trajectory part precisely. And then they should have projected that trajectory backwards to find the originating point at the side of that tower. Using horizontally AND upwards shot sample cannonball projectories as comparisons. And thus find the real starting speeds and the force needed to first break those wall pieces loose, then launch them that far outwards.
If it would have been solely the weight of all the situated steel above those pieces , it would have followed the same pattern as the top floors facade steel columns did, that broke away and fell closely to the sides, in the Madrid Windsor Tower fire.

Of course it seems as if the dust clouds are forming as first upwards and then downwards oriented parabolic trajectories, but that upwards part of the dust its trajectories is partly a result of the immense suction effect on that dust from the collapsing building debris, if those dust trails are taken from a mid-collapse, trajectory-starting point.

There still are (however less explicit in their starting trajectories) lots of downwards oriented parabolic trajectories of solid steel or aluminum cladding to observe at the onset of the collapse.
And of course also in- and outside the rest of the lower dust cloud movements, those starting trajectories are however quite distorted by the huge suction effect of the thundering down building debris.
Especially in the first part of their trajectories, its trailing concrete dust is sucked back in, and downwards by the loosely compacted center of the huge amount of downwards falling debris pieces.
That's why you need to calculate with trajectories of solid steel debris pieces.

Concrete dust weights far less than concrete debris pieces. Which pieces were mainly absent in the debris heaps. The huge dust clouds were spread over the whole S. Manhattan area and part of the Hudson River. So that concrete (dust) had no influence of any importance on the supposed mass that kept the collapse going.

One thing is sure however on 9/11, the far too wide spread out trajectories of multiple metric tons weighting steel debris pieces is enough to show you effects that can only be achieved by explosions.
Such wide spreads will not occur in a natural collapse, as can be observed as evidence in the Madrid Windsor Tower fire its natural steel parts collapse videos.
The burning steel pieces collapsing and breaking off there, from within the burning top floors that were stocked with non-insulated steel, fell down very closely to the sides of that tower.
And were certainly not catapulted hundreds of yards/meters away from its sides. They buckled, broke and fell down as if tumbling over after breaking away from their original bottom positions. Indicating that the weight of the steel still above them, forced them to first buckle, then break and then topple over the sides.
See for it, my former posts on that Madrid Windsor Tower fire, a few days ago in this thread.

The Twin Towers however, did not topple, but collapsed in on themselves.
Only when such huge buildings completely or partly topple over to one side, can steel end up as far as, in the case of the North Tower, into the SE corner of WFC3.
That was a distance of more than 2 x the width of a side facade of that tower, traveling all over the double lanes of West street and the free space adjacent to WFC3, and all over the full length of the pedestrian North Bridge that lead into the Winter Garden from WTC6 and the NW corner of WTC1N.

You can try to come up with as many excuses as you can, you will never be able to defeat simple Newtonian science laws for that case. That catapulting of a triple Vierendeel steel facade plate, weighing several metric tons, supposedly coming loose from somewhere at the western facade side of the North Tower, into the SE-WFC3 corner was not the result of a natural collapse.

You know, those steel parts had ID numbers pressed in them.
Did they tell us, based on those identification numbers in that triple column piece, stuck in the corner of SE-WFC3, after comparing them to the original steel factory orders, and the building's blueprints, where that Vierendeel piece that was stuck in the SE-WFC3 corner originated from.? Or did they not offer that information in the NIST reports.?
The lower it would come from, the more idiotic it would be to keep defending the natural collapse scenarios.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:47 PM
This is indeed the full original video from 2004, titled then as "9/11 Eyewitness", it shows the 3 tower collapses on 9/11.
It is re-posted in August 2013 by a guy calling himself FreedomRebel, who seems to think that there are fake parts in this video, he's not showing us WHY he thinks so.
Perhaps we can find it somewhere in the 2.735 video comments.? Good luck with that.
I'd love to hear it from the persistent ones who are willing to look it up.

In my opinion, Rick Siegel gave us the only fully covered, privately filmed coverage of the 3 tower collapses on 9/11/2001, with the added possibility to check its timeline by listening to the hourly time signal beeps in the radio station coverage of 9/11 (they come f.ex. from the atomic clock at NIST) which he also recorded from a pocket radio that hung on his camera tripod, and which full 9/11 events covering commentary you hear during the full time of Rick's video camera recordings.

Rick Siegel and his crew were the very first ones who pointed on the free fall acceleration part of the WTC-7 collapse, and we should be very thankful to them for doing that.
Rick Siegel started to film when he arrived after the first and second plane impacts, he filmed from 2 Hoboken piers on the other side of the Hudson River :

Btw, Rick Siegel once explained that the FBI confiscated his original video when they raided his office, and luckily he had already made a copy before they arrived, so that's why we still have this non-mainstream original footage from the important part of that day, filmed by a private citizen, so we can compare his video and especially his recorded accompanying SOUNDS with those from the major network cameras and their (superior) attached sound equipment.

It shows that heavy sound editing took place by the networks and/or the designated military editors, who were already present in all their main editing rooms for some weeks before 9/11.
If you don't believe that story, then you can search for it here at ATS, or at Google or the Internet (Film) Archive, while at their Wayback Machine page you can search for eradicated former web pages, up to a date not earlier than six months ago, so further back than 6 months ago, you can find quite a lot of deleted pages back again.

Forum pages are sporadically preserved, site owners try to block Internet Archive and Google page scavenging-bots to lessen the burden on their server space, it's quite sad indeed, but at the moment logical. When server space will become available in abundance, and we are very near to that point, I hope site owners will allow those Way Back-bots to do their important historic page conservative work again :

Internet Archive : Digital Library of Free Books, Movies, Music & Way-back Machine

September 11 Television Archive :
Free Movies : Download & Streaming : Internet Archive

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:53 PM
Since I really doubt anyone will read those 2,735 comments, I did it, and found this JEWEL :

Obsidian Wolf, 3 month ago.

Building 7 is the best obvious proof.
If the Pentagon wasn't enough or if asymmetrical damage on WTC 1&2 leading to near symmetrical collapse wasn't good enough. If eyewitness testimony of fire personnel, police, civilians, and rescue crews talking about multiple explosions before and during isn't enough. If the only consistent constant is the inconsistency of the official stories and expert opinion isn't enough. Just ignore everything else and focus on building 7.

Fire has never before caused a collapse of a steel reinforced high rise (LT : higher than 15 stories). Even NIST admits this much.
There are larger and less reinforced buildings that have burned days and weeks longer yet never fell.
NIST even updated their report to say that for at least 2.25 seconds that building did experience free fall. The equivalent of 8 stories (100 ft.) So for at least 100 feet, free-fall officially happened. Free fall can only be achieved when all resistance under it is removed.

Once the penthouse folds in on itself the entire building takes about 7 seconds to collapse.

Dozens of witnesses saw, heard, or felt the collapse, some were warned to move prior to being told it was coming down or being brought down.

Vast footage shows explosions that can be seen, some appear sequential, there is also audio evidence.

Remember, no plane on this one, no jet fuel excuse, just furniture, paper, electronics, etc. Jowenko (Dutch demolitions company owner, RIP) is one example of an expert on the subject who absolutely understands from footage alone the professionalism and efficiency is proof positive of collapse from explosives.

Medical crews were told to move triage because the building was to be brought down.
Fire teams received the same warning.
Are the eyewitness testimonies of fire personnel, police, rescue crews, civilians, and the conclusions of experts on the subject, and civilians all telling lies?

Silverstein had the building reinforced far beyond requirements to accommodate Solomon Brothers (brokerage firm) $200 million in reinforcement -

Silverstein (New York Times, 1989):
"We built in enough redundancy to allow entire portions of floors to be removed without affecting the building's structural integrity...more than 375 tons of steel - requiring 12 miles of welding - will be installed to reinforce floors..."

The 911 commission report states:
"what may have happened...will require additional study..." regarding WTC 7.

NIST admits this is the first time in history a building taller than 15 stories fell due to fire
NIST's official answer (theory) is office fires
NIST ignored testimony and never tested debris for explosive residue
NIST updated to admit at least some free fall did occur
NIST changed drafts omitting certain parts of the structure
NIST's computer models are inconsistent with video footage of the collapse
NIST classified its input data for computer models in the name of public safety

And anyone wanting to use NIST's conclusion as scientific evidence needs to remember :
no NIST report has been or is open for peer-review and therefore is not to be accepted as proof, evidence, or a sound conclusion, scientifically or otherwise.
There were closer and more damaged burning buildings that did not collapse.

Varied theories are not as important as the fact that questions exist. Theories arise and are ridiculed because the "official" answer is unacceptable, illogical, and has no support given the evidence. People come up with their own answers because they don't accept BS, not because they are crazy or paranoid. The fact that questions remain is blatant in itself as proof that we have been lied to absolutely regarding all the details surrounding the horrible events of that day.

The Chief of Fire Sciences at the time, (now former) leading expert worldwide on the subject of fire and fire safety, a decorated Ph.D., is now asking for an independent review, notes much inconsistencies, and admits lawyers blocked much of his inquiry.
Think about this carefully. The man in charge of fire and fire safety wants to see why other reasons and concepts besides fire causing collapse wasn't investigated, is very troubled by lack of timeline and inconsistent data, the models, and inconclusive tests performed. That should really speak volumes to supporters of the "official" fairy tales. Are they just going to label him crazy or paranoid as well? I wonder.

I wonder as well. Anyone knows who it is.? You should know this.

I found also this commenter, who came to the same conclusion as I did above :

Thrashaero, 10 month ago :
The arc analysis is a bit flawed, given how the smoke arcs were descending as things fell, the center was being drawn down faster, not reflecting the actual arc. Either way, the explosiveness of flinging massive chunks in all 4 directions doesn't make any sense for a regular collapse.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 12:59 PM
Another seemingly interesting "impressive" calculative answer by a YouTube member on the following short question in the same 9/11 Eyewitness re-posted video, its comments section :

Phong Tran, 6 month ago :

36 answers, the 35th one is this long and seemingly impressive one - for a casual reader - by one Tony Duncan, who starts to base his idea of massive buckling steel columns on the misconception in the NIST report, that a floor was visibly sagging and sinking behind a row of windows.
Which was no floor at all, but in fact a piece of lowered ceiling and its outer aluminum rail you looked at.
Here's his (and also from most of the resident "quasi truther-debunkers" here at ATS) hugely flawed reasoning :

Tony Duncan : What if, after all, the towers fell down ONLY because they were hit by passenger planes?
How is your maths and physics? If good enough, you can argue this point:


A standing WTC tower possessed two hundred and forty six tons of TNT of POTENTIAL ENERGY merely by just standing there We shall call this energy Eo.
(LT : he provides the calculation of it a bit further down).
The tower fell by taking the direction of LEAST RESISTANCE, which was THROUGH ITS BUCKLING COLUMNS.
The columns failed by BUCKLING because their STRUCTURAL STABILITY had been compromised by LOSS OF FLOOR ATTACHMENTS. No steel got crushed when this buckling failure occurred.
The floors had detached themselves by sagging to an angle which snapped their connections. Photographs of these separated floors (taken shortly before collapse) are plainly shown in the NIST Report.

He's totally utterly wrong, the floors were still firmly attached with their multiple connections to the huge spandrel plates of the Vierendeel column triplets in that huge composite tower facade, as demonstrated by the other photographs, and screenshots from videos, in that same NIST report page he mentions, by the inward facade columns bowing of about a 1/4th part of the width of a tower side, in a perfect horizontal line comparable to the floor attachments to those spandrel plates, behind the outer facade.

Thus, quot erat demonstrandum, there was no "LOSS OF FLOOR ATTACHMENTS" at all.
And no buckling there BEFORE the initiation event at the core. Buckling of the facade columns followed AFTER the inward bowing of that horizontal line in the facade along one floor space.

posted on Sep, 10 2016 @ 01:03 PM
He then goes on with an overload of misconception calculations which seem to the non-informed, and less educated reader quite impressive, but he also shows a total misconception of physics.
He thinks that he can explain the enormous residual heat in the basements, that was measured for many month afterwards, by coming up with some quasi intellectual calculations of residual G-effects on the total amount of steel in the collapsing towers, during the collapse :

Tony Duncan : As each tower fell some of that stored energy, converting to kinetic energy by falling, was released to damage and dismantle itself on the way down.
The amount of the initial energy consumed in such a manner was inversely proportional to the rate of acceleration of the tower as it descended. It can be calculated. We shall call it Ed.
The amount of energy remaining (Er) when the tower wreckage hit ground zero is then (Eo - Ed).
This energy, transferred elastically, caused PLASTIC DEFORMATION in the crushed base steel wreckage, and became HEAT. This too can be calculated.
The heat was considerable. The signs of it were captured by satellite. It amounted to the equivalent of a thousand tons of steel raised to a temperature exceeding 1,000 degrees Centigrade.

He forgets one thing : those towers were not compressed as one giant block of iron, but on the way down, most of the still intact but detached steel columns were spread around the former footprint of the core and the facades of those towers, so can not be used at all as part of his misconception enormous residual energy calculations.

Then he starts to throw in some shady chemistry, totally forgetting that the aerial IR photos taken during several weeks showed localized hot spots, and not as he assumes, a full tower footprint full of heat, and don't forget that he assumed that all the steel ended up inside the basements, which it certainly did not, most of the steel came to rest outward from the tower footprints, so his reasoning for that curious residual heat is total bogus too :

Tony Duncan : This hot steel oxidized its surface and absorbed local oxygen gas, leaving a reducing atmosphere.
In these reducing conditions, and at a temperature of 1,000+ degrees C, fireman’s water which had percolated through crushed gypsum wall boarding DISSOLVED calcium sulfate, the sulfate ions of which were reduced to sulfur which combined with the exposed iron to form IRON SULFIDE, which at such temperatures is MOLTEN. It flowed away.
Such hot reducing conditions also caused the water/steam to be REDUCED to hydrogen gas which was noted by firemen to be burning at the surface of the wreckage.

To calculate the original potential energy of the tower in TNT equivalent,
G = 9.81 metres/sec^2
Mass (M) of tower = 5e8 Kg
Height (h) to the tower’s CG = 210 metres
1 ton of TNT (Kt) is equivalent to 4.184e9 Joules

Equation: PE(Eo) = ( M * G * h ) / Kt = ( 5e8 * 9.81 * 210 ) / 4.184e9 = 246 tons of TNT.

That's his "Eo : two hundred and forty six tons of TNT of POTENTIAL ENERGY", he mentioned up there in his first text part.

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