Testosterone Blocking & Extra Estrogen Intake.

originally posted by: cosmic66
a reply to: JadeStar

Well I provided links, now please someone sensibly discuss with me

I took a look at your 2nd link. While interesting that one was not about exposure via drinking water.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

The links do not support your OP though.
But then what is your topic actually about, you have switched from contaminated water to supportive trans parents being abusers.
I don't think you really know, you just want anything that attacks trans folk and are attempting to do so with any argument you can find.

a reply to: grainofsand

How do we know it's not the mother and what she absorbs, not blaming anybody here.
Just asking the question.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

Well easy answer, find some research which supports your suggestion and share it with the class.
Your changing questions add no weight to whatever on Earth your argument actually is.

*Edit*
My late teen son has been drinking tap water all his life. Why is he not trans?
See, I can ask banal questions as well

a reply to: JadeStar
It's not the amount of water YOU have to drink, this has been in the environment since the late sixties and it's what your ,and everyones else, parents were drinking. THAT'S the start of the cummalative effect and that effect is passed on to their children who then carry on the consumption.

originally posted by: crayzeed
a reply to: JadeStar
It's not the amount of water YOU have to drink, this has been in the environment since the late sixties and it's what your ,and everyones else, parents were drinking. THAT'S the start of the cummalative effect and that effect is passed on to their children who then carry on the consumption.

Exxxxceeeeepttttt...

We're still talking about parts per million vs milligrams.

You realize how big of a difference in dosage that is right?

And AFAIK parents don't "pass on" the amount of estrogen they uptake to their children other than perhaps a mom during pregnancy.

Personally, I think male and female hormone levels ought to be a routine part of bloodwork done when you get a physical every few years.

It's expensive so it's not normally done, but there are diseases like cancer that can be aggravated by excessive hormones. A lot of weight gain can also be hormone related. If people knew where they stood in with their hormones, it might help us all be healthier. Certainly couldn't hurt.

a reply to: crayzeed

So do you have a link to research indicating a relationship between hormones in drinking water and trans rates?
I can't find any, just opinionated assertions similar to comments in this thread.

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Personally, I think male and female hormone levels ought to be a routine part of bloodwork done when you get a physical every few years.

It's expensive so it's not normally done, but there are diseases like cancer that can be aggravated by excessive hormones. A lot of weight gain can also be hormone related. If people knew where they stood in with their hormones, it might help us all be healthier. Certainly couldn't hurt.

Someday, not too far from now either, there will be an app for that.

There already are for diabetes so why not?

a reply to: grainofsand


I already stated what I was "asserting" if you want to put it like that, I wanted to discuss the enviromental factors of Pharmaceuticals on the endocrine system.

Your taking someone elses claim and applying to it my evidence, which I do not intend to prove anything, merely to help discuss what I already said..

How about you remember who your talking too? You know like reading and remembering different posts .

a reply to: cosmic66

But you have nothing though, and all I see is you, the OP and others, desperately looking for some way to link trans folk with water pollution of hormones, and/or otherwise discredit them in some way.
Remember the original OP was a lame attempt to blame trans people for polluting the water which was ridiculous of course, but now you've moved on searching for some other lame reason to criticise trans issues as something abnormal or caused by external influences.

originally posted by: JadeStar

Exxxxceeeeepttttt...

We're still talking about parts per million vs milligrams.

You realize how big of a difference in dosage that is right?

And AFAIK parents don't "pass on" the amount of estrogen they uptake to their children other than perhaps a mom during pregnancy.

You realise mg/L and PPM are virtually the same right?
Are m g/L and ppm measurements equal?

a reply to: grainofsand
Come on ,use your inteligence, of course it's my oppinion because IF I had the research it would be the biggest thing since sliced bread and we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Unless they are keeping the research under wraps!!!! What a conspiracy.

a reply to: cosmic66

Oh for goodness sake, Jade explained that her doses were in milligrammes measures not PPM, do you not even understand that basic difference?

a reply to: grainofsand

Thank you for your opinion.

I've not changed my stance in this thread, your confusing me with others AGAIN.

But I digress,

I never singled out Trans folk,

you keep doing that?

I was trying to have a separate, mature discussion, were people can be wrong and people can have differing opinions without having to shut each other down and accuse them of trying to discredit the other...

originally posted by: crayzeed
a reply to: grainofsand
Come on ,use your inteligence, of course it's my oppinion because IF I had the research it would be the biggest thing since sliced bread and we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Unless they are keeping the research under wraps!!!! What a conspiracy.

Then I shall just dismiss your opinions then if they are not based on any experimentation or research at all.
If I did otherwise I would be accepting that ATS has become like facebook.

a reply to: cosmic66

This OP was a lame attempt at blaming trans folk for hormones in drinking water.
You presented links which had nothing to do with the debate.
I am happy to debate anything in a reasoned discussion but just your opinions? Meh, nope, not interested, same as if a rabid Christian came into the thread and shared their unreferenced opinion.
Means nothing if you are making claims about a gender group.

*Edit*
I'm like a dog with a bone about all this because as a straight, self identifying male assigned at birth I'm actually sick of some of the crap I'm seeing posted on ATS about trans folk recently.
You don't like it, that's fine, but don't come out with lame arguments in an attempt to diss them without some supporting evidence.
Get over it people, there have been trans people for a long time in human history.
Topic such as this are useful though, they show me who are the bigots on ATS.

a reply to: grainofsand
Your mis-understanding. I'm not talking about Jade, I'm talking about her parents and if they are young, their parents before them. That is the cummalative effect of PPM. There are numerous studies of human derived oestrogen feminising fish over relatively short periods, three to four weeks. That's in PPM. Oh, you say "that's just fish".
In the real world this is a very, very hot potato so expect no evidence soon.

a reply to: crayzeed

So explain why over 99% of people in the UK are not trans?
My late teen rugby playing son has been drinking tap water all his life and he is not trans.
The study I presented on page 1 showed no abnormal levels of hormones in young trans people , so clearly there is some other factor involved.
With only opinion to play with may I ask what are you trying to assert exactly?

*Edit*
And stop with the silly misunderstanding thing, the reply of mine which you quoted was not even directed at you.
There was no misunderstanding, and your arguments are poorly constructed.

I just want to jump in and give a couple of suggestions to help save this thread. There is an interesting premise behind it (aside from the implied blaming of trans treatments) but everybody is going off track.

Can we discuss:
- Contents of public water supply. Are there tests to confirm anything?
- What could the contents do to people? Without tests to tell us what's in the water, this cannot accurately be assessed.
- Could effects on pregnant people be different? What studies suggest this?

What we really shouldn't be discussing (if you expect a conducive dialog) are things that are already established science. Transgender folks. We exist. Gender dysphoria is an actual thing and not an opinion. We know where and when it is developed. We know that no amount of social engineering can cause this but that it is something that happens in the womb. We also know the only treatment proven effective is to take varying steps towards a transition. These are not up for debate.

If we could leave all of that out, this conversation could actually go somewhere. Go do some research, find out what you can about the water. If you find nothing then all you have is guesswork that's not really based on anything other than your perceived opinion that there are more transgender people now (which there are not).