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Is nlp or hypnosis magic?

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posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 12:36 PM
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I asked on another thread 'what is magic' most people said it magic is 'controlling outside forces' which wasn't that helpful, so I'll be more specific-is nlp or hypnosis practising magic?




posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 12:44 PM
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a reply to: gell1234

What is nlp? I can't say anything about that without knowing that. I will say that no, hypnosis is not magic, at least in my opinion.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 01:03 PM
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so I'll be more specific-is nlp or hypnosis practicing magic?

I don't know what the acronym stands for but hypnosis is not magic. It is control of people with suggestible minds.

Ever have a hypnotist come to school?

We did, it was a riot. In the beginning they do the fold your hands with fingers interlocking and imagine them fusing so you can't get them apart… after a bit of 'suggestion' they say, alright now separate your hands. Those that can't become the 'subjects' on stage because they are suggestible.

I reflect back on that now and wonder if they were looking for people to participate in some covert program. Every year in high school they did his in the gym to the entire class.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 01:10 PM
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No.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 01:11 PM
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originally posted by: wtbengineer
a reply to: gell1234

What is nlp? I can't say anything about that without knowing that. I will say that no, hypnosis is not magic, at least in my opinion.

Neuro-linguistic programming



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 01:21 PM
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a reply to: gell1234

Both are affairs of the mind that are poorly understood.
Hypnosis, which I've done with success on others, is a technique that is an aspect of psi abilities and denied for the most part by modern science because it basically cannot explain it.

There is immense power within those talents and the need and desire by those in control of you is that you must rely upon physical work (action) rather than a reliance upon mind over matter. (Granted MOM powers do not come easily.) However, while science/government delve into and learn the realities of such techniques (such as Remote Viewing) the more they will hide those discoveries and use turn them into methods of control.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 01:38 PM
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a reply to: Klassified

Thanks Klassified!



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 02:09 PM
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No, neither hypnosis or neurolinguistics programming have anything to do with magic. They both work psychologically with your subconscious state of mind. They both are quite natural processes and there is nothing magical nor supernatural about them. Stage hypnotist like to entertain like a magician would, but like a magician on stage, there is no magic, just skill and the art of directing another's attention where you want it to go.
edit on 7 24 2015 by CynConcepts because: Spelling error



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 02:26 PM
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Yes. At least according to Crowley it can certainly be part and parcel of a Mage's trick bag:


Crowley defined Magick as "the science and art of causing change to occur in conformity with will."[4][5] He goes on to elaborate on this, in one postulate, and twenty eight theorems. His first clarification on the matter is that of a postulate, in which he states "ANY required change may be effected by the application of the proper kind and degree of Force in the proper manner, through the proper medium to the proper object."[6][7] He goes on further to state:

Magick is the Science of understanding oneself and one's conditions. It is the Art of applying that understanding in action.

en.wikipedia.org...(Thelema)

Most of the Adepts skills are nothing more than the manipulation of people and the mage's manipulation of his own psychology and 'reality.' You can tell those who know nothing about the subject if they fail to understand and/or note this. Any "manipulation"--whether common or paraphysical--that is done with intent and achieves the desired outcome is therefore 'magick'.


edit on 24-7-2015 by The GUT because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 02:31 PM
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I know that Blavatsky goes into animal magnetism, hypnosis and such things. I would consider it a sort of magic, somewhere on the treshold.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 02:49 PM
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a reply to: gell1234

The beauty of NLP is that it can work very well in a therapeutic setting and specifically one-to-one. It relies on soft cues and messages that are essentially subliminal in the sense that the recipient isn't aware of them. It actually depends on the patient being unsuspecting because becoming aware of the subtle praise creates a false relationship. It's benign manipulation isn't it? As soon as someone realises that the doctor is trying to inject positive ideas of self into their consciousness they resist and become objective.

It's not magic, it's psychology.

Of course, many a stage magician would say they are one and the same. I guess it depends on whether you see 'magic' in Harry Potter terms or in psychological terms.

In a conspiracy context, what would we call NLP when it's applied by several people to an unwitting individual? I wonder if anyone's every tried that?! [big dumb smile]



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 02:58 PM
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NLP and hypnosis is not magic. It is spelling, or making a spell, on someone. Writing was an old form of magic, black on white. Magic, magnetics, carrying a current of light into the mind in a pattern we call communication. It's not magic if you think it's not magic.

Hypnosis is about going faster than the other person is what is rational, so the other person can't keep up. Symbols, words. TV, radio, news. Commercials are hypnosis for example. You might not realize those aren't people on the screen. It is flashing light patterns that looks like the real thing. Programs.

NLP and hypnosis are 2 varieties of make-believe. If someone believes they can be hypnotized they can be. You tell them they can by showing pictures of other people going under hypnosis before they do. They think it works that it's safe, they play the game. If they believe what you say, they agree, then it leads them.

Altered states of mind, make-believe.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 03:05 PM
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its applied psychology. just like most "magic" you are familiar with.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 04:43 PM
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originally posted by: CynConcepts
No, neither hypnosis or neurolinguistics programming have anything to do with magic. They both work psychologically with your subconscious state of mind. They both are quite natural processes and there is nothing magical nor supernatural about them. Stage hypnotist like to entertain like a magician would, but like a magician on stage, there is no magic, just skill and the art of directing another's attention where you want it to go.


You confuse a stage hypnotist with a stage magician's sleight of hand tricks.

Absolutely no similarity between the two



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 05:05 PM
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a reply to: gell1234

Pretty sure I replied to your last thread.

My reply wouldn't have altered. Personally I consider the manipulating of people/self/or other living things to be a magic. I guess the why is the important thing as we all attempt to do this both unconsciously as well as consciously.

If it' follows nature correctly then it brings joy and a thriving vs self gain and pain.

The levels of how far this goes is very wide though, and presents a very narrow razors edge. It can very easily mess with the mind.

Before embarking on any of it I would be very careful to know my who,what and why of myself first to ground myself also in the here and now.

Cheers



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 05:30 PM
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a reply to: The GUT
An interesting take on this topic, Gut. As an amateur practitioner of both, I have never thought of either as "magic". But I can certainly see the application of his definition, albeit loosely. Thanks for posting it.


edit on 7/24/2015 by Klassified because: grammar



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 07:24 PM
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Yes they are. If you're planting anchors in a person's subconscious or influencing them in any way then technically you're using magic. Like any other tool, the intent behind it determines whether it is 'good' or 'bad'.

If you're using NLP to game chicks using negging etc then this could be considered black magic. If you're using hypnosis to help a person through a traumatic event then this could be considered good magic.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 07:34 PM
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originally posted by: MagnaCarta2015
Yes they are. If you're planting anchors in a person's subconscious or influencing them in any way then technically you're using magic. Like any other tool, the intent behind it determines whether it is 'good' or 'bad'.

If you're using NLP to game chicks using negging etc then this could be considered black magic. If you're using hypnosis to help a person through a traumatic event then this could be considered good magic.

As I told Gut. I can see the application specific to Crowley's definition(loosely). Nevertheless, it's still psychological manipulation, whether it is being used for benefit or detriment. If some see that as magic. So be it.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 07:39 PM
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a reply to: Klassified

Hiya, Klass!

Of course Crowley certainly isn't the last word. But I'm of the opinion that it's a fairly comprehensive description and to the point. Also, it appears, all mage are tricksters to some degree. Those of any oomph anyway. Power of presence and personal mythology being simple sorts of examples. Indigenous shaman incorporate these "powers" too.

It's also good to acknowledge that the practice of magic(k) is generally about the accruement of various degrees and forms of personal power and control. Thusly, any true adept seeks to master all manners of persuasion.

Now a question: As a practitioner do you believe you access or interact with something basically preternatural? Or maybe a Jungian-esque frame work/philosophy?

I ask because this aspect of the topic, that is to say "what constitutes magick?" is quite a fascinating conversation and one I believe any serious student must grapple with at depth.

Always good to see you here old friend.



posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 07:41 PM
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a reply to: gell1234

NLP is evil stuff, however it's not evil. The people who use and train others in NLP (I know a few) are evil, but the practice however isn't. I HATE people who use it, don't get me wrong. They think that they're allowed to use it as long as all parties are satisfied. In other words, it's okay to brainwash someone through conversation and analysis through using various techniques that TPTB use upon us just to make a quick sale. They don't realize that the quick sale could be someone's last financial cushion that they're taking away and it might take this person months to even realize that it happened, however they usually don't. I've practiced with NLP and it's much like a few techniques I developed but it simply draws the line at being a one way communication system, which is disgusting.

There's a difference between engaging someone and stealing their ability to make a clear decision.




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