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the peculiar christian reaction to homosexuality .

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posted on Jul, 24 2015 @ 11:43 PM
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a reply to: intrptr

That is not the same thing at all. More correctly, Christian salvation is an act of grace. It's God's decision, not Man's, to make. Belief is necessary but all that exhibitionistic palaver they put people through in born-again churches is just theatrics. No human act or sacrament, not even baptism, guarantees salvation.




posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 07:38 AM
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a reply to: Astyanax


That is not the same thing at all. More correctly, Christian salvation is an act of grace. It's God's decision, not Man's, to make.

"Gods" gift is life. Your mileage may vary.



posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 08:56 AM
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a reply to: intrptr

I am merely explaining what Christians believe. I don't believe in souls or salvation, I'm just giving you the facts.

Whatever your opinion on matters spiritual, you are welcome to it.



posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 11:08 AM
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a reply to: Astyanax


I don't believe in souls or salvation, I'm just giving you the facts.

Thats contrary.



posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 11:49 AM
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Thats contrary.

Why?

You're becoming more and more cryptic.



posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 06:24 PM
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originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: intrptr

That is not the same thing at all. More correctly, Christian salvation is an act of grace. It's God's decision, not Man's, to make. Belief is necessary but all that exhibitionistic palaver they put people through in born-again churches is just theatrics. No human act or sacrament, not even baptism, guarantees salvation.


And that right there is the biggest failing in Christian Dogma. If salvation is only my grace and not based on acts then followers have no responsibility for their actions whatsoever. That makes them dangerous to society in my opinion.

But that is dogma - not gospel. If someone has gospel references that salvation is only through grace, I'd like to hear them. My knowledge is limited and not recalling it doesn't mean it isn't there.



posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 06:51 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd


And that right there is the biggest failing in Christian Dogma. If salvation is only my grace and not based on acts then followers have no responsibility for their actions whatsoever. That makes them dangerous to society in my opinion.

Exactly. American exceptionalism, we can do anything because we are better than everyone else. They couldn't have devised a better substitute for Nazi Master Race ideology than that.



posted on Jul, 26 2015 @ 12:23 AM
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a reply to: FyreByrd


If salvation is only my grace and not based on acts then followers have no responsibility for their actions whatsoever.

No, that's rubbish. Salvation is guaranteed to no-one. The Gospels and Epistles make it perfectly clear that belief in Christ, as well as wanting and trying to make yourself worthy of salvation, are preconditions for receiving it.


If someone has gospel references that salvation is only through grace, I'd like to hear them

Acts 4:12

Ephesians 2:8

Romans 9:14-16

Titus 2:11

Quite a few more where those came from.


edit on 26/7/15 by Astyanax because: of a Bible that is well thumbed but never thumped.



posted on Jul, 26 2015 @ 12:48 AM
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a reply to: ignorant_ape

I am a Christian and not a homosexual, but as I perceive it, we should love one another (with the love of God). That is rule No 2 (rule 1 is to love God first).

I think that the issue Christianity has with homosexuality is more one with promiscuity as the following excerpt from Paul's letter to the Romans identifies:



"...the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and wickedness of men who by their wickedness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse; for although they knew God they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking and their senseless minds were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for images resembling mortal man or birds or animals or reptiles. "Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever! Amen. "For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. Their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural, and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameful acts with men and receiving in their own persons the due penalty for their error. "And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a base mind and to improper conduct. They were filled with all (kinds of) unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, malice. Full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malignity, they are gossips, backbiters, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, foolish, faithless, heartless, implacable, unmerciful. Though they know God's decree that those who do such things deserve to die, they not only do them but approve those who practice them." (Romans 1:18-32)



... and homosexuals are forgiven. There is only one unforgivable sin, the sin of rejecting forgiveness.


edit on 26/7/2015 by chr0naut because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 26 2015 @ 03:31 AM
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originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: FyreByrd


If salvation is only my grace and not based on acts then followers have no responsibility for their actions whatsoever.

No, that's rubbish. Salvation is guaranteed to no-one. The Gospels and Epistles make it perfectly clear that belief in Christ, as well as wanting and trying to make yourself worthy of salvation, are preconditions for receiving it.


If someone has gospel references that salvation is only through grace, I'd like to hear them

Acts 4:12

Ephesians 2:8

Romans 9:14-16

Titus 2:11

Quite a few more where those came from.



Thank you - but I believe those are all books attributed to St. Paul which convey an entirely different tone then the Gospels.
edit on 26-7-2015 by FyreByrd because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 26 2015 @ 04:28 AM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

And why do you privilege the Gospels over the rest of the New Testament?

Christianity wasn't invented by Christ, you know.



posted on Jul, 26 2015 @ 08:17 PM
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originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: FyreByrd

And why do you privilege the Gospels over the rest of the New Testament?

Christianity wasn't invented by Christ, you know.


Because the gospels are the only books that purport to give us Christ's actual teachings.

Personally, and without anything other then tone and 'instruction/direction', I find the other books degrade the teachings and I think Paul was an opportunist.

Not a Christian myself so it doesn't matter really but I do like the teacher Jesus's teachings.



posted on Jul, 26 2015 @ 10:10 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd


Because the gospels are the only books that purport to give us Christ's actual teachings

According to whom?

The whole New Testament 'purportes' to give us Christ's actual teachings. The difference is that some passages in the Gospels are 'purportedly' verbatim, but since all the Gospels are based on earlier, lost textual sources, the authenticity of these 'Jesus quotes' is debatable.

What you choose to believe is up to you. Still, I know of no Christian denomination that rejects the entire Bible save the Gospels. Even the most degenerate of American consumer salvation-cults tend to be fond of the book of Revelations.



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