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Seattle sees fallout from $15 minimum wage, as other cities follow suit

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posted on Jul, 31 2015 @ 11:53 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: JeanPaul

My "minimal grasp of economics". Ya, OK.


Yeah, since I am still waiting on your stellar grasp of economics to disprove my inflationary economics point.


Entire libraries have been written debunking your claim that inflation is the no 1 reason people aren't making as much money. Income is the issue, not inflation. Your free market mumbo jumbo has been debunked numerous times. Most recently by Piketty but you'll deny the data. You'll try to blame it on the Federal Reserve and going off the gold standard. It's quackery.
edit on 31-7-2015 by JeanPaul because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 12:03 AM
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a reply to: JeanPaul

In the meantime, creeping Capitalism is overtaking the Socialist Failure.

It's a bust-out system that fails all through history.




posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 02:29 AM
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originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: JeanPaul

In the meantime, creeping Capitalism is overtaking the Socialist Failure.

It's a bust-out system that fails all through history.


The undemocratic Leninist model- centralized planning with no actual worker control of production and the absolute refusal to allow any changes beyond party dogma. Ya, the Leninist models failed. Every other attempt was squashed by US/NATO war, subversion and sanctions.

Anyhow, if one advocates a planned economy we can point to the fact today's supercomputers make it possible. Even Hayek admitted some sort of grand computer could perhaps get around the calculation problem. Which is why he so feared the attempt in Chile and supported the fascist Pinochet. The only attempt at a partially planned economy with the use of computers was in Chile in the 1970's. Information gathering and computing power wasn't anywhere near today's level but it didn't matter anyhow because the US funded/supported a fascist general to end the experiment.

Even further the Lange model has never been attempted, largely because the Leninist's wouldn't do it.

China, Mao's China that is, was a Leninist hell hole run by an egomaniacal idiot. Today's China isn't exactly "free market" capitalist anyhow. The "debate" (as if it's even seriously happening) falls down to either a planned economy or market socialism. If you think market socialism will fail then you can't advocate capitalism because that's all it is, capitalism with worker run firms. You can even apply Austrian economic theory to market socialism. Neoclassical theory, it doesn't matter. Only difference is there are no singular owners of large firms.



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 02:33 AM
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originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: JeanPaul

In the meantime, creeping Capitalism is overtaking the Socialist Failure.

It's a bust-out system that fails all through history.


And we're not even talking about socialism here, the guy I quoted thinks working Americans are suffering from the extreme decrease in wealth because inflation. It's absurd. Sure, inflation is a small part of it, income inequality is the lions share. You know, it's all because we went off the gold standard. Na, it has nothing to do with the shift to a low wage service economy along side the rise of neoliberalism. Pfft.
edit on 1-8-2015 by JeanPaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 09:33 AM
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a reply to: JeanPaul

Pfft.

There's not enough "unequal" income to make any difference.

Failures are Failures regardless of what names you drop.

All debt based societies fall apart.

Worker control of production is a *Dream*.




posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 10:32 AM
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originally posted by: JeanPaul

Entire libraries have been written debunking your claim that inflation is the no 1 reason people aren't making as much money.


Well then, since their entire libraries available to you it should not be much of a challenge to post a few experts from them.


Income is the issue, not inflation.


Right. I could earn a trillion dollars an hour and if a trillion dollars had minimal buying power what good is it?


Your free market mumbo jumbo has been debunked numerous times. Most recently by Piketty but you'll deny the data. You'll try to blame it on the Federal Reserve and going off the gold standard. It's quackery.


Tell me, if a $15 an hour minimum wage is the greatest thing since sliced bread why are unions in Los Angles asking to be exempted from adhering to this mandate?



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 11:26 AM
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originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: JeanPaul

Pfft.

There's not enough "unequal" income to make any difference.

Failures are Failures regardless of what names you drop.

All debt based societies fall apart.

Worker control of production is a *Dream*.



Don't be silly:

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 11:27 AM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: JeanPaul

Entire libraries have been written debunking your claim that inflation is the no 1 reason people aren't making as much money.


Well then, since their entire libraries available to you it should not be much of a challenge to post a few experts from them.



I already have, you ignored the data.



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 11:31 AM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus


Tell me, if a $15 an hour minimum wage is the greatest thing since sliced bread why are unions in Los Angles asking to be exempted from adhering to this mandate?


It says right there in the article you posted:

-Union officials argue exemption will allow them to negotiate better contracts
-Minimum wage ordinances that omit unionized workforces are common in US

Of important note:

"Under the proposed clause, the unionized workers would be paid whatever their contracted hourly wage was even if the local minimum wage were raised to higher."

Did you think I wouldn't read your article? You obviously didn't.



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 11:39 AM
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originally posted by: JeanPaul

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: JeanPaul

Entire libraries have been written debunking your claim that inflation is the no 1 reason people aren't making as much money.


Well then, since their entire libraries available to you it should not be much of a challenge to post a few experts from them.




I already have, you ignored the data.


Which will keep happening over and over. You'll never change your mind. You'll go to your grave thinking the Nixon Shock ended millions of Americans ability to accumulate a nest egg. For generations. It's hogwash. I've already explained, in a prior post, the transformation of the US economy began in the 1970's. That's when the surge in offshoring began, it's also when Monetarism won favor and other Neoliberal policies won Washington. China's market reforms in the late 1970's with the rise of the Reagan/Thatcher regimes sealed the deal. It wasn't ending the gold standard.



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 11:47 AM
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a reply to: JeanPaul

And how many of those have gone bankrupt?




posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 03:40 PM
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originally posted by: JeanPaul
I already have, you ignored the data.


What 'data'? You linked a PDF to off-shoring, it did not mention anything disproving inflation did not begin to go up dramatically once the gold standard ended.



posted on Aug, 1 2015 @ 03:41 PM
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a reply to: JeanPaul

And are you that naïve to think that is the actual reason? It allows them to grow union ranks by undercutting the minimum wage.



posted on Aug, 17 2015 @ 06:24 AM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: JourneymanWelder
a reply to: Aliquandro
a reply to: Ultralight
a reply to: criticalhit
a reply to: ~Lucidity
a reply to: notmyrealname
a reply to: EarthPilgrim
a reply to: darkbake
a reply to: ZenTam
a reply to: amicktd
a reply to: Blue_Jay33
a reply to: galadofwarthethird
a reply to: xuenchen
a reply to: JeanPaul

For cryin' out loud people! We can bicker until the cows come home, it will not help our situation here. How do we counteract the declining standard of living many people are encountering? How can we help to provide more prosperity for a larger segment of the population in this country? Solutions, please? Anyone? Anyone? I noticed some of you have taken a brief stab at it, but I thought I should reply to all of you to get your attention and try to reorient the thread toward possible solutions we might pursue.

I think a step away from free global trade might not be a bad idea. Re-instituting import tarrifs, to be specific. While I agree with JeanPaul that outsourcing of labor is part of the problem, I also agree with AugustusMasonicus that inflationary monetary policy is a part of the problem. What do you guys think? Can we get some more proposed solutions in here, please?



posted on Aug, 20 2015 @ 12:17 PM
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a reply to: Sremmos80

That's exactly what I was thinking? Who's saying this, can it be verified that this is actually an issue?



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