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Blair endorses Jeremy Corbyn by warning Labour against Jeremy Corbyn

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posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 05:49 AM
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originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: 321Go
Socialist policies are fine as long as you can afford to implement them – without a decent economic strength there are simply not the available funds to afford such a political system. It is consistently the most expensive form of governance to implement, and is why every socialist system currently or previously in existence has failed, is in deficit, or subjects the vast majority of its population to dire poverty.



With the exeception of Denmark, Sweden, Finland and Norway all of which have some of the worlds highest standards of living and lowest deficits.

These are all coalition governments.




posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 05:49 AM
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originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: alldaylong




Blair stated Labour could not win a GE with Milliband as Leader.
He was correct.

It was hardly a revelation though was it , the seeds of Laour's downfall were already sewn by Blair himself and the subsequent coronation of Brown.
If Labour wants to save itself from the fate suffered by the Lib Dems they must regain their natural territory or risk obscurity.



After the 2010 election, Labour had a chance to realign themselves. Instead they lurched to the left under Milliband. The country doesn't want a left leaning Government.

Labour had the chance and they blew it. They will blow it again if Corbyn is elected leader.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 06:08 AM
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originally posted by: gortex
If Labour wants to save itself from the fate suffered by the Lib Dems they must regain their natural territory or risk obscurity.


What is Labours natural territory? Before Blaire, the Labour party was an ideological mess. Kinnock was a failed Labour leader, but he had the courage and balls to challenge the left. Since Kinnock, the Labour Party has been centre-left. The failure of the Labour Party at the last election was because they were inconsistent, their message was garbled and people don't trust them.




posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 06:37 AM
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originally posted by: 321Go

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: 321Go
Socialist policies are fine as long as you can afford to implement them – without a decent economic strength there are simply not the available funds to afford such a political system. It is consistently the most expensive form of governance to implement, and is why every socialist system currently or previously in existence has failed, is in deficit, or subjects the vast majority of its population to dire poverty.



With the exeception of Denmark, Sweden, Finland and Norway all of which have some of the worlds highest standards of living and lowest deficits.

These are all coalition governments.

Operating an economy with high taxation, high welfare, high workers rights etc. DUH talk about missing the point.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 07:05 AM
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originally posted by: yorkshirelad

originally posted by: 321Go

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: 321Go
Socialist policies are fine as long as you can afford to implement them – without a decent economic strength there are simply not the available funds to afford such a political system. It is consistently the most expensive form of governance to implement, and is why every socialist system currently or previously in existence has failed, is in deficit, or subjects the vast majority of its population to dire poverty.



With the exeception of Denmark, Sweden, Finland and Norway all of which have some of the worlds highest standards of living and lowest deficits.

These are all coalition governments.

Operating an economy with high taxation, high welfare, high workers rights etc. DUH talk about missing the point.

I realise this train of conversation is straying way off topic, but I think you're missing the point in comparing those nations to ours. The population of those four nations combined is only 26.2 million and their GDPs are only 1.6 trillion USD. Their tax levels (except for VAT equivalents) are comparable and are being lowered (in the case of Denmark).

Their welfare rates are lower than our ours in terms of GDP, their income tax levels are marginally higher (1-2%), their worker's rights are exactly in line with those of the rest of Europe, like ours. Their VAT rates are higher because they are not high producers of goods, so their balance of trade is very high, except in the case of Norway.

These are not socialist policies, they are policies of their own economics. To hold these countries of examples of socialist political success is naive and politically unaware.

YOU are missing the point.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 07:47 AM
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a reply to: alldaylong

I think we will see what the nation wants after 5 years of Tory austerity and cuts , given the candidates available I think Corbyn may be Labour's only hope for salvation with the intervention by Blair only serving to remind Labour members what damage the right leaning New Labour did to the party and country.


He attended Adams' Grammar School in Newport, Shropshire.
In an interview in 2014, he described himself as "parsimonious" and added "Well, I don’t spend a lot of money, I lead a very normal life, I ride a bicycle and I don’t have a car". He currently lives in Finsbury Park and before that lived in Harringay.
en.wikipedia.org...


Sounds perfect.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:10 AM
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a reply to: gortex

As Corbyn is a good socialist, he may not spend a lot of his own money, but we can be sure he'll like spending everyone else's!

Corbyn may be the salvation of the unelectable part of Labour, but not for Labour as a positive force in British politics. Labour need a leader who will unify the party, break the link with the Unions, realise that business and industry is the path to success, and control welfare. These are things that would not be done if Labour lurch to the left.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:18 AM
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a reply to: paraphi




As Corbyn is a good socialist, he may not spend a lot of his own money, but we can be sure he'll like spending everyone else's!

How can we be sure of that ?



Corbyn may be the salvation of the unelectable part of Labour, but not for Labour as a positive force in British politics

If elected I believe he will be a more positive force than his recent predecessors , he seems to me to be a person first politician second something missing from the lineup of career politicians we're used to.



Labour need a leader who will unify the party, break the link with the Unions, realise that business and industry is the path to success, and control welfare.

Other than unify the party that sounds like a Tory manifesto.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:21 AM
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a reply to: gortex


Clement Attlee, Harold Wilson Tony Blair. The three greatest Labour Party Leaders.

What did they have in common? They where all " Men Of The People". They took the public along with them. They all achieved landslide election victories.

Corbyn is never going to be a " Man Of The People" He would never take the majority along with his vision. His past political life has to many " Open Goals" for The Tories to put the ball into. He even sides with Argentina over The Falklands issue.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:27 AM
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a reply to: gortex

Hah! Labour have just found their next Michael Foot possibly. I am 100% convinced that any potential leader with principles and ethics will not have a chance in hell at ever being elected Prime Minister. It is a big paradox. Labour keep having to become Tories to get elected. Mr Blair was proof of that. What is the point of electing a Labour government if they are just slightly paler blue than the Tories?

Any party will not stand a chance unless they satisfy the corporations' needs. If they satisfy the needs of corporations they will be forsaking the social needs of the country. The only aspects important to business are profit, low taxes and an easily controlled work force that has no union power. Low taxes means less funds and a tighter social budget. Keep us begging for jobs in a tightly controlled job market where there are always too many people for a limited number of positions. God forbid it that a person has choice in the job market because that empowers them and weakens the employers' stance.

Surely by now we can see that every aspect of our lives are being streamlined for maximum efficiency as a resource for corporations.
edit on 22-7-2015 by Revolution9 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:29 AM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: gortex


Clement Attlee, Harold Wilson Tony Blair. The three greatest Labour Party Leaders.

What did they have in common? They where all " Men Of The People". They took the public along with them. They all achieved landslide election victories.

Corbyn is never going to be a " Man Of The People" He would never take the majority along with his vision. His past political life has to many " Open Goals" for The Tories to put the ball into. He even sides with Argentina over The Falklands issue.



# Tony Blair

# him to the deepest parts of hell.

He is no British Hero or man of the people the bastard is a war criminal!
edit on 22-7-2015 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:41 AM
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The bittersweet irony of being told we need a heart transplant by a man globally known as heartless himself.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: crazyewok


It doesn't matter what your views our " now " on Tony Blair.

Before he won his first election he took the country along with his views. He won for The Labour Party their greatest ever election result. He won 3 GE's on the bounce.

What he turned into is another debate.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 08:46 AM
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a reply to: Revolution9



Labour keep having to become Tories to get elected


Hence this quote from my first post.



The U.K. by nature is a Conservative country.



posted on Jul, 22 2015 @ 11:37 AM
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originally posted by: gortex
How can we be sure of that ?


We cannot be sure of anything, but the Left has a record (in the UK at least) of hiking up taxes to pay for increased unemployment and industrial decline!


If elected I believe he will be a more positive force than his recent predecessors ,


I am sure he will be a positive force, but he won't represent mainstream and because of that the Labour party will continue to decline. He can therefore "promise the earth", but he'll never be able to give it.

I'll offer an alternative view of the world. If Labour turn Left, then the centre-left will be filled by a resurgent Liberal Democrat. UKIP are a flash in the pan, so that "protest" electorate have to go somewhere, and they won't return to Labour if they show signs of shifting to the Left.



Other than unify the party that sounds like a Tory manifesto.


Um, that's the problem with this type of discussion. Any critique of Labour ends with comments like that! Labour will never take business seriously and that's why people don't trust them. They have not quite moved on to appreciate that people hate paying excessive tax and want to work. The Tories have clocked this concept, so why can't Labour. Even the Lib Dems understand it.
edit on 22/7/2015 by paraphi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 23 2015 @ 07:54 AM
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a reply to: gortex

First of all old stick, I think it was very wise indeed to place a warning about the full frontal nature of that lying, soft handed, work shy, effort fearing, entitled lump of animate snot, Blair. Well done, good call, and all that.

Furthermore, the biggest problem we have in this country, when it comes to elections, is that there is no left hand alternative to the centre right, and far right politics which currently dominates the news. There is no representation for the poor, there is no representation for the hardworking, and none the less skint people in the country, who, by the way, are more necessary to the economy than every single suit jockey that has ever, or will ever be born.

The people are begining to wake up to this, and there can be no doubt that the reason voter turnout was so appalling in the last election, is because many people chose not to vote, rather than vote for a Red Tory, or indeed a Blue one, and because the alternative to those was a party who backstabbed the entire nation by forming a government with the Conservatives previously.

I am of the opinion that Mr Corbyn is the only legitimate runner in this leadership race, and may be one of the last few politicains who is not just Labour in name, but Labour in personal values. I want to see him win, and I want to see this nation turn around and face fist the Tories in the next election, by voting him and a REAL Labour Party into government next time it comes up. I have a hell of a lot more faith in Corbyns platform and beliefs, than I have in any of the other front runners, and infinitely more than I have in the beliefs and platform of Harriet Halfwit Harmon. Triple H has no idea, and the other candidates are fooling themselves.

The Blairites should all quit, and promise that for the good of the nation, they will never run again. They are part of the problem, and therefore have no place in its solution.



posted on Jul, 23 2015 @ 08:01 AM
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a reply to: paraphi

I would also like to point out that he, Mr Corbyn, has spent the least on expenses, consistently , of any of the polticians operating in this country, both on a year by year basis, and in total.

I do not believe it is possible to name an MP that has spent less money than he has over the course of their being an MP, even many MPs who have only been MPs for half as long as he has.


edit on 23-7-2015 by TrueBrit because: Added clarity.



posted on Jul, 23 2015 @ 03:32 PM
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Corbyn should be kicked out of politics.

Refusing to investigate and it looks like deliberately ignoring pedophile cases even after reported directly to him by social workers about children's homes in London in the 80's should exclude Corbyn from being an MP.

www.telegraph.co.uk...


Jeremy Corbyn accused of inaction over paedophile scandal

Labour MP John Mann says leadership contender Mr Corbyn "did nothing" about allegations of child abuse in Islington in 1980s

Jeremy Corbyn,the hard-left Labour MP who is tipped to lead the party, has been accused of "doing nothing" over child abuse in his constituency during the 1970s and 1980s.

Dozens of vulnerable children were raped and sexually abused in care homes run by the London borough of Islington.However most of the abusers escaped justice because allegations made at the time by victims were ignored and many files, which contained corroborating evidence, have been lost or shredded.

John Mann, a Labour MP, has sent Mr Corbyn an open letter in which he says that his failure to do more to tackle child abuse means it would be "inappropriate" for him to become Labour leader




In his letter Mr Mann highlights how Liz Davies, a social worker turned whistleblower, visited Mr Corbyn in the early 1990s to raise concerns about paedophiles operating in Islington care homes. Mrs Davies told The Telegraph that she was "heartened" by the meeting, after which Mr Corbyn said he would raise her concerns with Virginia Bottomley, the then Health Secretary.

However she said that while Mr Corbyn has "always treated me very politely" he had not been vocal on the issue.

"There's plenty of scope for apologies and regrets," she said.

Mr Mann also highlighted an official complaint Mr Corbyn made in the Commons about a visit Geoffrey Dickens, a Conservative MP who repeatedly attempted to expose child abuse, made to his constituency.

At the time he called on Mr Dickens to "unreservedly withdraw his allegations of the existence of child brothels in the area and make a public apology".

He also highlighted a recent statement Mr Corbyn made in the Commons when said: "There have been complaints about Islington children's homes in the past and the council has investgated them."

He said that the statement was "extraordinary" as the council has been accused of suppressing allegations of child abuse in the past. Mr Mann said: "Your carefully worded excusing of Islington Council in the House of Commons equally demonstrates why it is inappropriate for you to attempt to lead the Labour party at the critical time of the

Goddard inquiry [into child abuse], as child abuse is the issue that will haunt this Parliament."

"He called for an independent inquiry into child abuse in Islington at the time and has taken this strong line ever since. He has called for the terms of reference of any inquiry to cross local authority and international jurisdiction to ensure as thorough and wide ranging investigation as possible.

"He has commended the Home Secretary’s intention to publish interim reports throughout the process. He has also proposed additional steps such as a standing commission.

"He has supported Islington Council working closely with the Home Office on these issues."


www.theguardian.com...


Jeremy Corbyn, MP for Islington North, said: “If I’m under surveillance, or the late Bernie Grant or any of my friends are under surveillance – [then] whatever meetings we were at, they were presumably there; whatever phone calls we made, they were presumably recording.

“I think we have a right to know about that. We represent constituents. We are in a position of trust with our constituents. That trust is betrayed by this evasion of our privacy.”

May ordered the public inquiry after a string of revelations about the conduct of undercover officers who infiltrated political groups for more than 40 years. Some officers were found to have formed sexual relationships with women they had been sent to spy on. The remit of the inquiry, which is to be led by Lord Justice Pitchford, has yet to be defined.



posted on Jul, 23 2015 @ 05:22 PM
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a reply to: theabsolutetruth

Surely if he raised the issue with Bottomley, then the matter should have been dealt with by her department ?
edit on 23-7-2015 by TrueBrit because: Grammatical error removed.



posted on Jul, 23 2015 @ 05:56 PM
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Jeremy Corbyn is also being endorsed by... Conservative supprters. I believe the hashtag is #ToriesForCorbyn.

There is an ongoing campaign to encourage Conservative voters to join the Labour party in order to be eligible to vote in the leadership elections, then vote for Corbyn.

I'm not sure which is worse for his leadership bid - being slammed by Blair or endorsed by the Tories.



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