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it's been a bad week for the democrats.....

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posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 05:06 PM
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originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Grimpachi

The PP 'thing' isn't fabricated. It's being marginalized/spun by the media. Part of aborted babies were sold. There's even a vid on You Tube of the 'lady' causally commenting on it.

It is disgusting.



They keep liking to say its fabricated, I watched the other 2 hour video, says the same thing......They are full of it......

As to the other stuff, get ready for some heavy excuses!

And put on your fire suit!

Typical left wing and democrat tactic. Lie...say it didn't happen and hope everyone is stupid enough to just believe it. Well...LOOK IT UP! Sure the tape was edited, everything is edited. But the facts are still the facts. And like I said before...if they were haggling over price...there had to be some profit because you can't haggle if you have fixed expenses.




posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 09:10 PM
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originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
Typical left wing and democrat tactic. Lie...say it didn't happen and hope everyone is stupid enough to just believe it.


Stop... the partisan B.S. is out of control. If you can't admit that ALL members of the politico are inclined to stretch the boundaries of truth as opposed to actively stating that whomever you oppose is the guilty party while ignoring the same actions by those you support...YOU, then, are just as much the problem. It's just an intellectually dishonest approach. Even the OP can agree that dishonesty is rampant throughout all of politics. It simply isn't a partisan issue, it's a political issue.



Well...LOOK IT UP! Sure the tape was edited, everything is edited. But the facts are still the facts.


Then why the need for edits in the first place? If the entire video presents a truthful representation there would be no need to make such drastic edits. Would there? It seems to me, rather disingenuous. But hey..."Facts are still facts" right? Unless of course the edits are more endearing to your confirmation biases, which based on your overtly partisan commentary, is definitely the case. The original, unedited version is over 2 1/2 hours long, the released video is only 9 minutes. That's a lot left on the cutting room floor wouldn't you say?

Let's just look at the 3 major edits here, there are several others but the bigger ones are critical to the hit being orchestrated. For background purposes,Planned Parenthood Federation of America's Senior Director of Medical Services Dr. Deborah Nucatola was at a lunch meeting with actors posing as representatives from a human biologics company.


Buyer [ACTOR]: Ok. I'm just trying to brainstorm. Because, I think offering some people, not only, just offsetting their cost in other areas, seeing the potential for that, besides the potential, for the patient, I'm still going down that road, even though I know, I understand what you're saying. This cannot be seen as, "We're doing this for profit."

PP [NUCATOLA]: No. Nothing, no affiliate should be doing anything that's not like, reasonable and customary. This is not- nobody should be "selling" tissue. That's just not the goal here.

Buyer [ACTOR]: Right. And, I never see that as, I don't look at it that way, we're not selling tissue, we're selling the possibility of what the research can offer.


In the Unedited Transcript: "Nobody Should Be 'Selling' Tissue. That's Just Not The Goal Here."

The Center for Medical Progress also released a full transcript and longer version of the video with Dr. Nucatola -- featuring more than 150 minutes of additional footage -- which include crucial portions that were edited out
. In one case, Nucatola says, "no affiliate should be doing anything that's not like, reasonable and customary. This is not- nobody should be 'selling' tissue. That's just not the goal here."


Our 2nd edit is rather crucial as well as it is done to purposely create the illusion of a for profit scheme. Here, the video Jumps Nearly 8 Minutes In The Middle Of The Conversation About Money. In the short version of the video, a confusing exchange takes place misleadingly implying that at one point, Dr. Nucatola discussed the cost of the tissue, but timestamps on the footage reveal nearly eight minutes of conversation was removed:


ACTOR: Okay, so, when you are, or the affiliate is determining what that monetary --

NUCATOLA: Yes.

ACTOR: So that it doesn't raise any question of this is what it's about, this is the main -- what -- what price range would you --

NUCATOLA: You know, I'm -- I could throw a number out that's anywhere from $30 to $100 depending on the facility, and what's involved.

[TIMESTAMPS JUMP FROM 12:24:07 TO 12:32:06, REMOVING NEARLY 8 MINUTES]

ACTOR: The $30 to $100 price range, that's per specimen that we're talking about, right?

NUCATOLA: Per specimen, yes.


But The Unedited Footage Reveals PPFA Official Was Discussing Reimbursement Costs For Legal Donation Process During Those Missing Minutes. The unedited video reveals the full context for Nucatola's cost comments. Right after the video jumps forward, Nucatola specifically references exact "shipping" and other associated costs which could legally be reimbursed, before discussing affiliates' general "bottom line" attempts to "break even"

here's from the unedited version giving the appropriate context:

ACTOR: Okay, so, when you are, or the affiliate is determining what that monetary --

NUCATOLA: Yes.

ACTOR: So that it doesn't raise any question of this is what it's about, this is the main -- what - what price range would you --

NUCATOLA: You know, I'm -- I could throw a number out that's anywhere from $30 to $100 depending on the facility, and what's involved. It just has to do with space issues, are you sending someone there that's going to be doing everything, or is their staff going to be doing it? What exactly are they going to be doing? Is there shipping involved, is somebody coming to pick it up -- so, I think everybody just wants to -- it's really just about if anyone were ever to ask them, well what do you do for this $60, how can you justify that? Or are you basically just doing something completely egregious, that you should be doing for free. So it just needs to be justifiable.

And, look, we have 67 affiliates. They all have different practice environments, very different staff, and so with that number --

ACTOR: Did you say 67?

NUCATOLA: 67.

ACTOR: Okay. And so of that number, how much would personality of the personnel in there, would play into it as far as how we're speaking to them --

NUCATOLA: I think for affiliates, at the end of the day, they're a non-profit, they just don't want to -- they want to break even. And if they can do a little better than break even, and do so in a way that seems reasonable, they're happy to do that. Really their bottom line is, they just, they want to break even. Every penny they save is just pennies they give to another patient. To provide a service the patient wouldn't get otherwise.




PPFA Official Repeatedly Referred To "Tissue Donation," Not Sale, In Unedited Transcript. Dr. Nucatola repeatedly refers to "tissue donation"



NUCATOLA: Right now, when they are consenting to tissue donation, they're just consenting to what happens with the tissue after the procedure is done.

[...]

You could do a workshop on tissue donation and what it means. We want to do a little reception at the National Medical Conference or Forum or something.

[...]

I do think feedback is good too. Sure, anyone can come get the tissue donation and send it off. I think affiliates would like to know, we send specimens to research who are working on this and this. I think that kind of positive feedback in the end it will just be a better relationship, it just kind of adds a whole human touch.



posted on Jul, 25 2015 @ 09:11 PM
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a reply to: WeAreAWAKE
Planned Parenthood Statement: Fetal Donations Were Done "Under The Highest Ethical And Legal Standards," And Provide Them "No Financial Benefit." In a July 17 statement, Eric Ferrero, Planned Parenthood's Vice President of Communications, explained that the organization's clinics "help patients who want to donate tissue for scientific research" with "the highest ethical and legal standards." Ferrero noted that the organization received "no financial benefit" from the arrangement aside from reimbursement of "actual costs, such as the cost to transport tissue" -- consistent with industry standards:


"In health care, patients sometimes want to donate tissue to scientific research that can help lead to medical breakthroughs, such as treatments and cures for serious diseases. Women at Planned Parenthood who have abortions are no different. At several of our health centers, we help patients who want to donate tissue for scientific research, and we do this just like every other high-quality health care provider does -- with full, appropriate consent from patients and under the highest ethical and legal standards. There is no financial benefit for tissue donation for either the patient or for Planned Parenthood. In some instances, actual costs, such as the cost to transport tissue to leading research centers, are reimbursed, which is standard across the medical field.

"A well funded group established for the purpose of damaging Planned Parenthood's mission and services has promoted a heavily edited, secretly recorded videotape that falsely portrays Planned Parenthood's participation in tissue donation programs that support lifesaving scientific research. Similar false accusations have been put forth by opponents of abortion services for decades. These groups have been widely discredited and their claims fall apart on closer examination, just as they do in this case." [Planned Parenthood Federation of America, 7/14/15]


Regarding the legality of tissue donations:

Federal Law Does Not Prohibit Donations Of Fetal Tissue With Consent. Federal law regarding the use of human fetal tissue does not prohibit the use of donated materials. [Title 42 U.S. Code § 289g-2]

Health And Human Services Independent Review Board: Providers May Accept Payment "For Reasonable Expenses" With "Informed Consent." The set of standards outlined by the Health And Human Services Independent Review Board guidebook, the industry standard for medical research, explains that payment for fetal tissue may be obtained "for reasonable expenses occasioned by the actual retrieval, storage, preparation, and transportation of the tissues" (emphasis added):


Prohibiting Payments and Other Inducements
◾Payments and other forms of remuneration and compensation associated with the procurement of fetal tissue should be prohibited, except payment for reasonable expenses occasioned by the actual retrieval, storage, preparation, and transportation of the tissues.

Informed Consent
◾Potential recipients of such tissues, as well as research and health care participants, should be properly informed about the source of the tissues in question.
◾The decision and consent to abort must precede discussion of the possible use of the fetal tissue and any request for such consent that might be required for that use.
◾Fetal tissue from induced abortions should not be used in medical research without the prior consent of the pregnant woman. Her decision to donate fetal remains is sufficient for the use of tissue, unless the father objects (except in cases of incest or rape).
◾Consent should be obtained in compliance with state law and with the Uniform Anatomical Gift Act. [Health and Human Services Institutional Review Board Guidebook, Accessed 7/14/15]




And like I said before...if they were haggling over price...there had to be some profit because you can't haggle if you have fixed expenses.


Have you watched the full video? You can't have watched it if you are trying to say truthfully that they were haggling over "price". The only price variance is in shipping costs. Shipping biological materials comes with its own stringent guidelines and very specific requirements to properly ship so that the materials arrive at their destination in a condition conducive to their still being useful for the testing being done. This means that there are price variances determined by what type of material is being sent, how much material is being sent, the weight etc... You're not just showing up at FedEx and dumping some stuff into a cardboard box, writing out the address, choose overnight shipping and hope for the best here. You have to contract with specialized carrier services. Seriously, engage in a little due diligence before hopping on your band wagon of the day and believing everything you read in your right wing blog of choice and running with it.

I get it, your mind is made up on this issue in general regarding abortions and this particular case because it gives in to your preconceived notions and confirmation bias was all you needed to go off running. Understanding the context of the statements and their full weight has no place in your paradigm because you see PP as an evil enterprise despite the fact that abortions aren't even their primary function which is, believe it or not, preventing pregnancy and consequently, abortions as a result of unwanted pregnancies as well as other medical assistance to low income families and prenatal care for women carrying to a pregnancy to term. But hey... let's ignore all of the positive things done at PP's across America because you disagree with women having the CHOICE available to them so that you can further villainize the entire organization in your mind.



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