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Jim Webb wants U.S. military to be able to carry weapons aboard installations

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posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:29 AM
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a reply to: Answer

You can not stop the facts of military training.


The Requirements of Military Weapons Training If you can not handle weapons training in the military you will not make it.

Ever since the end of World War Two, there has been a consistent and continual increase in the number of people enrolled in the military. This is especially true with the United States military. One of the main reasons why individuals decide to enter the military service is because it's one of the only places in the world that allows, and teaches, controlled weapon use. Indeed, it is the combination of military weapons training and use, coupled with a structured environment that leads to adventure that makes the service so appealing. The regimen, however, is extremely difficult: most applicants won't make it out of the first round of weapons training.


Does Everyone Have to Participate is Military Weapons Training?


there is an over-arching rule within the US Military that requires, regardless of the group an individual is applying for, the successful completion of basic weapons training. In short, the Military will not allow anyone to become part of the Marines, Army, Air Force, Navy, or Coast Guard if he or she cannot fire a basic weapon.


military.answers.com...




posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:32 AM
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a reply to: swimmer15

My husband received training in both rifle and hand guns during his 22 years of military career and he was just a supply officer until his retirement.

He is still as today 16 years later working for the military as a civilian, rules has not changed for what he has told me.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:41 AM
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a reply to: marg6043

Officers are slightly better trained with pistols than enlisted. At least thats my understanding.. And we all have to show we can use it.. And shoot with a level of proficiency.. Means load, unload shoot at 5,7, 10 yards.. For many it happens once or twice over an enlistment, coupled with use of force, etc...thats not really good training... No scenarios, state side laws etc.
edit on 18-7-2015 by swimmer15 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:44 AM
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a reply to: swimmer15

He was not an officer he was an enlisted, retired as a GySgt, his specialty was amphibian welfare and machine gun, for war purposes, while his was serving, meanwhile he was just a supply officer, lots of paperwork and budgeting.

Now he works in the intelligence field as a civilian.


edit on 18-7-2015 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:46 AM
link   

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Answer

You can not stop the facts of military training.


The Requirements of Military Weapons Training If you can not handle weapons training in the military you will not make it.

Ever since the end of World War Two, there has been a consistent and continual increase in the number of people enrolled in the military. This is especially true with the United States military. One of the main reasons why individuals decide to enter the military service is because it's one of the only places in the world that allows, and teaches, controlled weapon use. Indeed, it is the combination of military weapons training and use, coupled with a structured environment that leads to adventure that makes the service so appealing. The regimen, however, is extremely difficult: most applicants won't make it out of the first round of weapons training.


Does Everyone Have to Participate is Military Weapons Training?


there is an over-arching rule within the US Military that requires, regardless of the group an individual is applying for, the successful completion of basic weapons training. In short, the Military will not allow anyone to become part of the Marines, Army, Air Force, Navy, or Coast Guard if he or she cannot fire a basic weapon.


military.answers.com...





Again, we're talking about handguns. It's a totally different animal.

You're not totally wrong, you're just off-topic and so determined to be right that you don't even understand what you're arguing.

Take a second to understand what's being stated before you jump in with a contradiction.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:47 AM
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a reply to: Answer

Pistols are part of military training also.

Do I have to keep quoting so you get it?




posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:50 AM
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originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Shamrock6

What is the purpose of only allowing MP's to carry weapons, is it something to do with Posse Comitatus? If so, why not increase MP's especially at recruiting stations? If not, I don't see a reason that our military personnel at home can't carry guns to protect themselves with. I mean though each case is horrific, it's still statistically small (attacks on US military at home)... but it is crystal clear that they are targets for extremists. We should be figuring out how better to address this.


Before, all NCO.s and Officers could carry a weapon while on duty at the base commander's discretion. (Although, in all honesty, that was not very often). Bill Clinton changed the law that banned that and now only military police on duty carry on base.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:51 AM
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originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: swimmer15

He was not an officer he was an enlisted, retired as a GySgt, his specialty was amphibian welfare and machine gun, for war purposes, while his was serving, meanwhile he was just a supply officer, lots of paperwork and budgeting.

Now he works in the intelligence field as a civilian.



First, he was in the Marine Corps so he was trained as a basic rifleman.

It sounds like he was infantry for a bit until he moved higher up the enlisted ranks and got moved around to a supply position so you're a little confused about his job... but that's understandable for someone who wasn't actually in the military.

He was trained with a handgun because he was a machinegunner.

Since you refuse to believe what we're telling you, ask your husband if every member of every branch is trained with handguns. He will tell you no.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:52 AM
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originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Answer

Pistols are part of military training also.

Do I have to keep quoting so you get it?



No, they aren't.

No matter how many times you say it, you will still be wrong.

Some of us know and you clearly don't. How can you be so confident when you are so wrong? There are now 3 people in this thread with military experience telling you that you're wrong.


edit on 7/18/2015 by Answer because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:54 AM
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It honestly makes no sense that I have to turn in my licensed CCW or leave it at home when entering the front gate.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:55 AM
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a reply to: Answer

I just...

I can't even with this.




posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:56 AM
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originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: swimmer15

He was not an officer he was an enlisted, retired as a GySgt, his specialty was amphibian welfare and machine gun, if war would up while his was serving, meanwhile he was just a supply officer.

Now he works in the intelligence field.


congrats on having a full career and thank you all for your service (if you were by his side you served too :-) )... I was speaking of my own experience and training in general... Just like me with Vessel boarding team training etc.. Special roles, assignments receive different training, even guys not in special forces who work alongside the teams receive special training for the role... But thats not general across the board.. Actually as i was getting out, more people were doing IA assignments, and some of my buddies were telling me of doing really good training, so more people were getting better weapons training.
edit on 18-7-2015 by swimmer15 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 11:56 AM
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originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Answer

Pistols are part of military training also.

Do I have to keep quoting so you get it?



No, they aren't.

No matter how many times you say it, you will still be wrong.

Some of us know and you clearly don't. How can you be so confident when you are so wrong? There are now 3 people in this thread with military experience telling you that you're wrong.



Sorry, 'cause I like Marge a lot, but here's 4. Pistol training and qualification is not routine, although it's really not that hard to get if you want it. In the USMC, pretty everybody wants both rifle and pistol expert badges for promotion points. For the vast majority of units, pistol qualification is really as difficult as signing up and going to shoot.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:01 PM
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a reply to: NavyDoc

That was interesting, I remember when that was truth, I never could understand the reason behind the banning, neither my husband that always had keep weapons at home while we were living in military bases.

As for the military police now, since the Bush years has been transferred to civilian contractors so no too many Military police in bases anymore. Kind of double edge here.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:04 PM
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a reply to: NavyDoc

My husband had the highest qualification in both, he was soo proud of those badges.



I like you too my friend, Is nice to have you around here in ATS.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:05 PM
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originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Answer

Pistols are part of military training also.

Do I have to keep quoting so you get it?



No, they aren't.

No matter how many times you say it, you will still be wrong.

Some of us know and you clearly don't. How can you be so confident when you are so wrong? There are now 3 people in this thread with military experience telling you that you're wrong.



Sorry, 'cause I like Marge a lot, but here's 4. Pistol training and qualification is not routine, although it's really not that hard to get if you want it. In the USMC, pretty everybody wants both rifle and pistol expert badges for promotion points. For the vast majority of units, pistol qualification is really as difficult as signing up and going to shoot.


I'm curious how easy it is in the AF and Navy. My buddy served 4 years in the Navy and never shot anything but the M16 simulator in boot camp.

A lot of civilians don't realize just how many jobs there are in the military that have nothing to do with pulling a trigger.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:06 PM
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originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: NavyDoc

That was interesting, I remember when that was truth, I never could understand the reason behind the banning, neither my husband that always had keep weapons at home while we were living in military bases.

As for the military police now, since the Bush years has been transferred to civilian contractors so no too many Military police in bases anymore. Kind of double edge here.

Like I said. I'm an O-6 (okay, retired now, but I was until very recently) combat vet with both CAR from the USMC and a Combat Medical badge from when I deployed with the army, I am trusted by several states to carry a firearm and licensed to do so, I am trusted by several states and the federal government to open you up from stem to stern and close you back up again and licensed to do so, but I am so untrustworthy that I must disarm every time I come onboard a base or other federal installation. How the heck does that make any sense?



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:09 PM
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originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Answer

Pistols are part of military training also.

Do I have to keep quoting so you get it?



No, they aren't.

No matter how many times you say it, you will still be wrong.

Some of us know and you clearly don't. How can you be so confident when you are so wrong? There are now 3 people in this thread with military experience telling you that you're wrong.



Sorry, 'cause I like Marge a lot, but here's 4. Pistol training and qualification is not routine, although it's really not that hard to get if you want it. In the USMC, pretty everybody wants both rifle and pistol expert badges for promotion points. For the vast majority of units, pistol qualification is really as difficult as signing up and going to shoot.


I'm curious how easy it is in the AF and Navy. My buddy served 4 years in the Navy and never shot anything but the M16 simulator in boot camp.

A lot of civilians don't realize just how many jobs there are in the military that have nothing to do with pulling a trigger.
I can't address Navy boot camp as I never went.

When I was enlisted in the USMC, at Parris Island (boot camp) we were trained and qualified on the rifle and just familiarized with the service pistol. At SOI (school of infantry) we trained on everything.

At the Naval Academy we qualified with both rifle and pistol.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:11 PM
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originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: NavyDoc

That was interesting, I remember when that was truth, I never could understand the reason behind the banning, neither my husband that always had keep weapons at home while we were living in military bases.

As for the military police now, since the Bush years has been transferred to civilian contractors so no too many Military police in bases anymore. Kind of double edge here.

Like I said. I'm an O-6 (okay, retired now, but I was until very recently) combat vet with both CAR from the USMC and a Combat Medical badge from when I deployed with the army, I am trusted by several states to carry a firearm and licensed to do so, I am trusted by several states and the federal government to open you up from stem to stern and close you back up again and licensed to do so, but I am so untrustworthy that I must disarm every time I come onboard a base or other federal installation. How the heck does that make any sense?


Some bad apples ruined it for everyone.

I'm sure the regulation stems from an incident long-ago involving alcohol and a personally-owned firearm.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 12:17 PM
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originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Answer

Pistols are part of military training also.

Do I have to keep quoting so you get it?



No, they aren't.

No matter how many times you say it, you will still be wrong.

Some of us know and you clearly don't. How can you be so confident when you are so wrong? There are now 3 people in this thread with military experience telling you that you're wrong.



Sorry, 'cause I like Marge a lot, but here's 4. Pistol training and qualification is not routine, although it's really not that hard to get if you want it. In the USMC, pretty everybody wants both rifle and pistol expert badges for promotion points. For the vast majority of units, pistol qualification is really as difficult as signing up and going to shoot.


I'm curious how easy it is in the AF and Navy. My buddy served 4 years in the Navy and never shot anything but the M16 simulator in boot camp.

A lot of civilians don't realize just how many jobs there are in the military that have nothing to do with pulling a trigger.
I can't address Navy boot camp as I never went.

When I was enlisted in the USMC, at Parris Island (boot camp) we were trained and qualified on the rifle and just familiarized with the service pistol. At SOI (school of infantry) we trained on everything.

At the Naval Academy we qualified with both rifle and pistol.


The AF used to shoot the M9 in basic training but they don't anymore.

The USMC doesn't teach anything about the M9 in boot camp anymore. Unless you're in an infantry MOS (I was), they weren't training on the M9 when I was at SOI in 2002.

I don't know what the Army is doing now. I know my uncle wasn't trained on it in 2004 until he specifically requested it. He was a combat photojournalist.



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