We Knew it was coming: NAACP wants Stone Mountain CARVING removed.

I vote we take down the darn alamo . it may upset the immigrants crossing over. Heck take all symbols of history down.

a reply to: stosh64

Nope. No guilt for anyone. All is forgiven when history is purged. That's the deal. You won't be offered a better one. No guilt. No special treatment. No bitching. Everyone thrives or fails on their own merits and ability. Tired of this "born a sinner" with regard to being Caucasian.

originally posted by: SkipperJohn
I vote we take down the darn alamo . it may upset the immigrants crossing over. Heck take all symbols of history down.

Maybe we can ask the authoritarian-progressive element just to rewrite history for us since all we want to do is muddy it up with facts.

a reply to: beezzer

You know we should also destroy all Native American references and relics as they also fought against the Federal Government and lost.

a reply to: Urantia1111

Fast forward in time:

"grandpappypappap, tell me about the time before the Great Cleansing."
"In those time, the black folks actually got to eat with us! And they had JOBS with us, and used the same toilets as us!"
"But why, grandpappypapap?"
"because of the civil rights and such, and them flags and history books that reminded us how things was even before then."
"things was like now even way back before then?"
"Yessup"
"but why"
"because of that danged flag. and how they wanted to take aways that danged flag and monuments, and erase the whole history...So we'd FORGET..."


I swear I read this book once.

originally posted by: Bicent76

originally posted by: pheonix358
How is this any different from ISIS destroying historical sites in the Middle East.

It is the same mind set!

It is a stupid mind set.

P

you do know the confederated had black slaves right? They held that flag up, and that flag represents their dogma right? Part of that dogma, was to dominate another race beating them, raping them, and forcing them to work, oh and not to mention MURDER THEM!!

I think it is about time to grow the hell up in AMERICA....

Despite forcing them at gunpoint to remain in the Union some people still refuse to treat Confederates like Americans, which they are. Yes, even slave owners were welcomed back by those who had fought the bloody war. Who the hell are we to be changing their judgment over how Confederates were to be treated?

The Confederate dead are given the same honors all American soldiers are given.
Therefore their flag neither warrants nor deserves derision of any kind.
Their blood made that flag worth what it is and it demands respect.
Because ALL LIVES MATTER.
Even former Confederate soldiers.

I live in ATL. The Atlanta chapter of the NAACP has a lot bigger concerns that they should be focusing on for their constituents than Stone Mountain, like schools, affordable housing, jobs.

But, they'll probably wreck it or at least put up one of MLK too.

The crazy is catching and it won't stop until the South looks like Sherman marched through again only this time renaming schools and purging historical sites.

originally posted by: SkipperJohn
I vote we take down the darn alamo . it may upset the immigrants crossing over. Heck take all symbols of history down.

Texas will never rewrite U.S. history!

(unless of course it's in a school textbook).

originally posted by: Hushabye
Good. Can we have Mt. Rushmore carvings removed too?

Only if we can remove the statue of MLK. Fair is fair right?


disclaimer: I have a high regard for MLK.

originally posted by: Bicent76

originally posted by: pheonix358
How is this any different from ISIS destroying historical sites in the Middle East.

It is the same mind set!

It is a stupid mind set.

P

you do know the confederated had black slaves right? They held that flag up, and that flag represents their dogma right? Part of that dogma, was to dominate another race beating them, raping them, and forcing them to work, oh and not to mention MURDER THEM!!

I think it is about time to grow the hell up in AMERICA....

Surely. But we should also be laying blame at the feet of Europe, the ME, and the chiefs of the African tribes way back when. Slavery was not invented in America.

originally posted by: jellyrev
LOL. Cry about what the confederate flag means yet we still love that american flag. Native american genocide, imperialism, needless wars killing millions, embargo on Iraq starving 100's of thousands of children. Foreign aid to genocidal dictators, coups by us intelligence in many countries, still tortures, only country to use atom bomb. Etc etc.
The argument is bad and you should feel bad.
Any argument based on what the confederacy did should equally apply to all flags

Lol do you have any blood left in that heart of yours?

originally posted by: kosmicjack
The crazy is catching and it won't stop until the South looks like Sherman marched through again only this time renaming schools and purging historical sites.

WTF is going on with this country?

I don't even recognize it from 30 years ago.

The crazy is spiraling exponentially out of control. I better move down south while I still can.

We have always felt we belonged down there.

originally posted by: fshrrex
a reply to: CriticalStinker

We ALL have been going to Hell in a handbasket from the beginning...but it is not happening today or tomorrow (Google time/date in Australia)...you may need to walk away from this medium for 24 hours and watch a sunrise or sunset before you come back. Don't worry, we will save you a space in the flaming handbasket.

I love the idea and I think that is amazing advice for alot of people but I'm a realist. I don't need to sugar coat the world I live in or get a prescription to cope with it ( not to judge anyone just saying it's not my style) I'd rather understand something than skew it so it's easier for me to accept, no sunsets or rises for this guy. I'll appreciate life's beauty when I see it but I won't kid myself when it comes to human affairs. We have a democracy, I'm sorry, a social responsibility to take part in the way we govern and project ourselves. Bickering over things is what I believe to be the objective of a few. Always have two defined sides and make sure there is a strong divide. The two party system is as much as a joke as race differences. Democrats and Republicans accomplish the same things every time they are in office, they have the same goals. As do races, the topic of this thread, and I argue there is no difference other than the perceived. Whether or not we perceived it on our own our pride can delude. Things can change, ideas are more powerful than any organism this planet has seen. But we have to see things with clear eyes, if the big picture is sought everyone wins. Should we continue the rhetoric over miniscule points/*differences* I assure you we will stay on course. Any intelligent person can tell you the path and evidence for that path is grim.

a reply to: stosh64

I'll pass on living in the south, but I only wish the flag would stay up and every day people talked about it.

A lot went on back then.

Part of it was finally the end to slavery.

To borrow a quote. . .

"Lest we forget".

a reply to: beezzer

I have lived in WNY all my life. It is ok, but when I visit down south it just feels right.

I agree, keep it up and never forget.

Start removing the history and we are bound to repeat it.

This is so absolutely ridiculous. Ok, yea, sure remove the flag if that makes you feel better ( I wasn't against it being removed, I actually didn't even have an opinion on it and I lived in SC for quite a few years).
But you can't completely erase history.
Granted, if they remove history and all depictions or history of slavery, then they won't have anything to bitch about anymore.
But there's always SOMETHING.

They don't realize that there were Irish and Scottish slaves just as much as other slaves. And as someone mentioned earlier, this country was founded on lies, deceit, genocide, and slavery of Native Americans....

Remove All flags from everywhere. nationalism is stupid.

First off you drama queens blabbering about ISIS have less perspective than the President of the ATL chapter of the NAACP.

ISIS tortures, murders, rapes and enslaves people because they believe their God granted them that right and on top of everything else, they're trying to make a nation of their own so they can live out their twisted ideology. Doesn't sound that dissimilar to the antebellum South all things considered but how many of you would dare be conservatively incorrect enough to admit to that?

It's strange that in 4 pages into this thread and there's no real talk about the origins of the carving on the side of Stone Mountain. Doesn't THAT matter? I mean if you're going to equate calling for its removal to terrorists blowing up thousands of year old cultural relics from other peoples' cultures than maybe you might want to read up a bit on what you're so anxiously defending? Hell just take a look at Wikipedia:

The carving was conceived by Mrs. C. Helen Plane, a charter member of the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC). The Venable Brothers, owners of the mountain, deeded the north face of the mountain to the UDC in 1916. The UDC was given 12 years to complete a sizable Civil War monument. Gutzon Borglum was commissioned to do the carving. Borglum abandoned the project in 1925 (and later went on to begin Mount Rushmore). American sculptor Augustus Lukeman continued until 1928, when further work stopped for thirty years. In 1958, at the urging of Governor Marvin Griffin, the Georgia legislature approved a measure to purchase Stone Mountain for $1,125,000. In 1963, Walker Hancock was selected to complete the carving, and work began in 1964. The carving was completed by Roy Faulkner, who later operated a museum (now closed) on nearby Memorial Drive commemorating the carving's history. The carving was considered complete[6] on March 3, 1972.

Carving and the Ku Klux Klan

The revival of the Ku Klux Klan was emboldened by the release of D. W. Griffith's Klan-glorifying film The Birth of a Nation,[7] and coincided with the August 1915 lynching of Leo Frank, who was convicted in the murder of Mary Phagan. On November 25 of the same year, a small group, including fifteen robed and hooded "charter members" of the new organization, met at Stone Mountain to create a new iteration of the Klan. They were led by William J. Simmons, and included two elderly members of the original Klan. As part of their ceremony, they burned a crude cross.[8]

Fundraising for the monument resumed in 1923, and in October of that year, Venable granted the Klan easement with perpetual right to hold celebrations as they desired.[9] The influence of the UDC continued, in support of Mrs. Plane's vision of a carving explicitly for the purpose of creating a Confederate memorial. The UDC established the Stone Mountain Confederate Memorial Association (SMCMA) for fundraising and on-site supervision of the project. Venable and Gutzon Borglum, who were both closely associated with the Klan, arranged to pack the SMCMA with Klan members.[10] The SMCMA, along with the United Daughters of the Confederacy continued fundraising efforts. Of the $250,000 raised, part came from the federal government, which in 1924 issued special fifty-cent coins with the soldiers Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson on them, but would not allow the politician Jefferson Davis to be included.[11] When the state completed the purchase in 1960, it condemned the property to remove Venable's agreement to allow the Klan perpetual right to hold meetings on the premises.[10]

Hell, I'm almost as old as the damn thing and it was built with the support of (and for) the friggin Klan. That said, I think it's pretty unreasonable to think that it's going to be blown up or covered up or altered though honestly, it wouldn't be any great cultural loss.

Perhaps a compromise could be worked out by way of an addition to the park. I'm thinking a large statue of MLK in a park at the base of the mountain commemorating the progress we've made toward equality and those who fought in that struggle, a far more nobler cause than fighting to preserve the institution of slavery. The juxtaposition of the two changes the theme and it certainly would give the park less of an appeal to the Klan.

a reply to: stosh64

I was born in Texas, semi raised in New York, finished childhood in Texas, and now reside in Virginia. That being said, the South is rather embracing, ignorance flourishes everywhere in the same density. Rhetoric is present in both with a different approach, the North is brash and has bigotry like anywhere else. That being said the south is welcoming, if you want to say it's ignorant I argue humans are humans and bigotry is in the same density everywhere.

originally posted by: threewhitecandles
This is so absolutely ridiculous. Ok, yea, sure remove the flag if that makes you feel better ( I wasn't against it being removed, I actually didn't even have an opinion on it and I lived in SC for quite a few years).
But you can't completely erase history.
Granted, if they remove history and all depictions or history of slavery, then they won't have anything to bitch about anymore.
But there's always SOMETHING.

They don't realize that there were Irish and Scottish slaves just as much as other slaves. And as someone mentioned earlier, this country was founded on lies, deceit, genocide, and slavery of Native Americans....

Remove All flags from everywhere. nationalism is stupid.

They don't realize it because it's complete bull# based on conflation of indentured servitude and chattel slavery in two books written by non-historians and popularized by apologists. Did you realize that?

Perhaps you should be a little more concerned with people revising history than erasing it?

a reply to: theantediluvian

So people who want to keep history, to keep it relevant are drama queens and the people who want to erase it are. . . . progressive?