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Men may feel more threatened by female bosses, research finds

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posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:10 PM
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originally posted by: peck420

originally posted by: JadeStar
I didn't even think of the race issue to be honest and i only thought of gender because some of the other women thought that was probably the issue when we talked candidly about it in private.

You screwed up here.

Discussing employee/manager issues (one to one) with other employee's is a recipe for dissent and disaster.

Learn and move on.


Ok. But like i said, it was hard not to because we were all friends and some of us even hung out together socially last year.




i asked them and some of the guys who had no problems if they thought i was doing anything vastly different than our former boss and they told me no and in some ways i was more organized and that helped them do their job better.

The only persons you needed to ask are the persons that are causing issue. Act based on their responses, not on what others have to say about it.


I did ask them and they just kind of didn't have much to say they just sort of justified their actions/question by saying things were different under the old boss so I asked them how but they really didn't have answers. That's why i asked the ones who were not presenting any issues.

I needed to know what I could change to make things better overall for these guys.







Ok, but for how long?

As long as you allow it. You are their manager, are you not?


Yes but that's the 'nuclear option" one which then presents more problems than it might at first glance, solve.

And from the reports from the old manager these guys are competent and good at what they do and overall i know them to be good people. things only changed this year.





It is my view that we all should be striving to eliminate such inequality and unfairness.

Might as well try to make snow on the sun. There are things that you will be able to change and control, and there are things that you will not be able to change or control. Don't waste time on things you can not control.


I don't. What i mean is, rather than feed such things as inequality and unfairness i'd rather feed their alternative by being aware of them so that I don't fall into the same patterns which leads to them.



If you have a person that is not going to play by your office rules, and not going to fit with your team, don't waste time trying to change them. Remove them and search for some on that fits.

Effective teams more than make up for the lost time in creating said effective teams.


Like I said, that's the nuclear option. The hardest thing to do is terminate someone and seeing as how i've only been able to do that for a short period of time and seeing as how these guys were fine with the other boss i'd rather look in the mirror at what i can do differently to help them be more comfortable with me than just drop them.

Finding good people is harder than maintaining a great team.

edit on 14-7-2015 by JadeStar because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:12 PM
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originally posted by: JadeStar
Finding good people is harder than maintaining a great team.


From this manager's perspective that axiom is quite true.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:14 PM
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originally posted by: JadeStar


Finding good people is harder than maintaining a great team.


I've been trying to hire someone for almost a year!

Man, woman, poo-flinging monkey,. . . . I don't care.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:14 PM
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originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
a reply to: JadeStar

I hate Jezebel with every fiber of my being. Third wave feminism sickens me. Doing articles on "stare rape" and "manspreading".

There are REAL issues to tackle, such as the aforementioned pay gap, how we're unfairly given bias in family court, etc.

I could care less if some guy is mentally undressing me. I do it to hot guys all the time. Big freakin' whoop.

I digress, that's my rant on Jezebel.


Oh, i have seen good articles there and bad ones. I try not to paint with a broad brush. Anyone can embed a video on a blog or site so I wouldn't dismiss it because it was on Jezebel.



Men are feeling threatened by the female becoming an actual force in the working world. This is especially true when a woman is promoted rather then men who applied for the same promotion. Rather than self-reflecting on why they weren't chosen, the lay the blame on something they can't control as a coping mechanism.


So like, how do I or any of us help make them feel more secure and comfortable? [Emphasis by Railgun]


Truthfully, that's almost impossible. Any attempt at allaying their fear or discomfort would likely come off as patronizing and trite, especially if you're in a position above them. The best way to combat it is to lead by example. SHOW them you're not something to be threatened by, but also that you're not to be trifled with. It's a difficult balance to strike, and I haven't quite found the magic formula yet.


Wow. It *really* is that daunting. My sister just said "good luck baby sis". Right then I thought to myself: "ok i'm in for it" because usually when she says that I generally am. What you said above underscores that.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:15 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Because you threw out a blanket statement to show you can ride the bandwagon. Big deal you can take orders from a female boss. I just didn't find your statement spectacular. It's the same as saying "I've got black friends"
And?



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:17 PM
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a reply to: JadeStar

Perhaps try shifting the focus from you. A team incentive where all members have to work together as a team for a goal that is assessed individually, by their peers, and as a team with some sort of reward as an incentive can work wonders at getting an out of sync team member back on board and is reflective practice, perhaps tied into CPD and scheduled appraisals. Performance related incentives are good with specific objectives that are measurable.
edit on 14-7-2015 by theabsolutetruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:20 PM
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originally posted by: Lysergic
What if one enjoys being threatened by females?


wheres that research?


Fetlife?



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:20 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
She said ''hot guys''.

Kidding, I comment not on your level of ''hotness''.


Probably a smart move considering Railgun's yandere tendencies.





posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:20 PM
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originally posted by: beezzer

I've been trying to hire someone for almost a year!

Man, woman, poo-flinging monkey,. . . . I don't care.


There are just not enough grumpy, chain-smoking, scotch-swilling Leporidae to go around.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:21 PM
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I must admit when i have worked under females i have often gotten into heated arguments,i think male and female thinking just doesnt meet in the middle sometimes,resulting in fireworks at times for me



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:22 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: beezzer

I've been trying to hire someone for almost a year!

Man, woman, poo-flinging monkey,. . . . I don't care.


There are just not enough grumpy, chain-smoking, scotch-swilling Leporidae to go around.


I don't want to hire someone like me!

(laughs)

I'm a huge pain in the ass.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:22 PM
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originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: UnBreakable

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: UnBreakable

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: UnBreakable

originally posted by: JadeStar
The more i read the more i realize that masculinity seems to be a fairly fragile thing.

At least this study (and others) would seem to indicate that.


From Science Daily and the Journal of the Society for Personal and Social Psychology

Here's an excerpt...


Men are more threatened by female supervisors and become more assertive in advocating for themselves in negotiation exercises, new social psychology research has found. Self-assertive behavior by men toward female bosses can disrupt the workplace dynamics, stifle team cohesiveness and negatively affect team performance, researchers say.

Men may feel threatened by female supervisors and act more assertively toward them than male bosses, which could disrupt the workplace with struggles over power dynamics, according to new research published by the Society for Personality and Social Psychology.

"The concept of masculinity is becoming more elusive in society as gender roles blur, with more women taking management positions and becoming the major breadwinners for their families," said lead researcher Ekaterina Netchaeva, an assistant professor of management and technology at Bocconi University in Milan, Italy. "Even men who support gender equality may see these advances as a threat to their masculinity, whether they consciously acknowledge it or not."

While women are underrepresented in senior management positions in the United States, they are almost on par with men at middle and lower management levels, according to Labor Department statistics. In three experiments, Netchaeva and her co-authors discovered that men feel more threatened when they answer to female bosses.

In an experiment with 76 college students (52 male, 24 female) at a U.S. university, participants were told they would negotiate their salary at a new job in a computer exercise with a male or female hiring manager. After the negotiation, participants took an implicit threat test where they guessed words that appeared on a computer screen for a fraction of a second. Participants who chose more threat-related words, including "fear" or "risk," were judged to feel more threatened.

Male participants who negotiated with a female manager exhibited more threat and pushed for a higher salary ($49,400 average), compared to men negotiating with a male manager ($42,870 average). The manager's gender didn't affect female participants, who negotiated for a lower salary ($41,346 average), reflecting a common trend where women tend to be less aggressive than men in negotiations, Netchaeva said.

In another experiment, 68 male college students had to decide how to split a $10,000 bonus with a male or female team member or supervisor. Male participants evenly split the money with male or female team members, but men felt more threatened by a female supervisor and tried to keep more money for themselves than with a male supervisor.

In a similar experiment conducted online with 370 adult participants (226 male, 144 female) from the United States, men were more receptive to female supervisors who were described as proactive and direct rather than self-promotive and power-seeking. Specifically, male participants tried to keep a larger share of the $10,000 bonus if the female manager was described as ambitious or power-seeking. Female participants offered roughly the same bonus amount to proactive or ambitious female managers.


More at this link

What do you guys think about this?


As long as my female boss is good looking, I don't mind working extensively underneath her, if you get my drift.


As my mom would say: "Oh no you didn't?!"


That was a valid office workplace joke pre-1985. Nowadays that joke would warrant a trip to HR for sexual harassment, if not worse.


And rightly so.
Is that a complaint?


No, not a complaint. Just an observation how sexism and political correctness has evolved in the office workplace over the last thirty years. I've worked in a corporate environment for the past thirty-three years so I know what to say or not say, even jokingly.


So you understand how that joke would make some people feel uncomfortable right?


It's just a joke. I work with some women who tell off-color jokes and I feel comfortable telling the same type of jokes back. Then there are others who I wouldn't dare tell a G-rated kock-knock joke too. And it's not limited to just the women. There are guys who I work with that would make Howard Stern blush and others who wouldn't even sneeze crooked. It all depends on the person.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:22 PM
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originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: JadeStar

Perhaps try shifting the focus from you. A team incentive where all members have to work together as a team for a goal that is assessed individually, by their peers, and as a team with some sort of reward as an incentive can work wonders at getting an out of sync team member back on board and is reflective practice, perhaps tied into CPD and scheduled appraisals.


Great idea! We already have team bonuses but they come down from on high and there has not been one with me in this role yet. I can ask my boss if we can implement a new one.

Thanks SO MUCH for your answer!

edit on 14-7-2015 by JadeStar because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:24 PM
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originally posted by: Thelongversion
I must admit when i have worked under females i have often gotten into heated arguments,i think male and female thinking just doesnt meet in the middle sometimes,resulting in fireworks at times for me


What has been the spark?



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:26 PM
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originally posted by: JadeStar
Ok. But like i said, it was hard not to because we were all friends and some of us even hung out together socially last year.

Were you expecting it to be easy?


I did ask them and they just kind of didn't have much to say they just sort of justified their actions/question by saying things were different under (old boss) so I asked them how but they really didn't have answers. That's why i asked the ones who were not presenting any issues.

So...are you not capable of being manager?

Their responses would have been enough to make a satisfactory decision. Employees that can not be honest with me, and me with them, have no spot in my business. I don't need to consult with my friends for that.


Yes but that's the 'nuclear option" one which then presents more problems than it might at first glance, solve.

What 'nuclear' option? You are allowing this by your uncertainty as the manager.


And from the reports from the old manager these guys are competent and good at what they do and overall i know them to be good people. things only changed this year.

Change is the only constant in life. The situation has changed, and their performance has changed. Act based on the now, not on the has been.


I don't. What i mean is, rather than feed such things as inequality and unfairness i'd rather feed their alternative by being aware of them so that I don't fall into the same patterns which leads to them.

You are not responsible for how people act. They are. If they choose to act in a manner that is unfitting of your office and team, remove them before it becomes cancerous to the whole.



Like I said, that's the nuclear option. The hardest thing to do is terminate someone and seeing as how i've only been able to do that for a short period of time and seeing as how these guys were fine with the other boss i'd rather look in the mirror at what i can do differently to help them be more comfortable with me than just drop them.

So you are going to spend more time psycho analyzing yourself than you will on the performance of you and the team under you?

Being the manager is not easy, and is never going to be. Don't make it harder than it has to be.


Finding good people is harder than maintaining a great team.

And preventing bad people from having an affect on a great teams is even harder.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:27 PM
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a reply to: JadeStar




Finding good people is harder than maintaining a great team.


FWIW , careful with a rotten apple as it can quickly spread.

Depending on that individual attitude and dynamic within the group, it can be cancerous. I have seen it time and time again.

There are rotten apples that nobody listens to and everyone in the team just ignores the gripe they spew or laugh it off , these tend to be less harmless .

Than there are those rotten apples that impact others besides management. If the rest of the team is effected by his negativity or dynamic , it will eventually bring down your whole team. Once employees try to schedule work around that employee or complain they have the same shift , it might be time to use the nuclear option.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:29 PM
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a reply to: FlySolo

Well sorry I'm not able to WOW you every time I type a post. Next time, how about I check with you when I'm about to post in a thread to see if it is acceptable enough of a post to impress you?



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:32 PM
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a reply to: JadeStar

I guess I have been fortunate...have had some good women bosses...what I notice is that women have a hard time working for female bosses. I also notice that at times some bosses may get mad at your for talking to other employees they may not like...but I guess some of that is human nature...



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:33 PM
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a reply to: JadeStar

Wasn't intended specifically at you but overall to the women posting in agreement with you as well. It just seemed like a "rah rah go women" type of thread and wasn't very receptive of any other views. I respect your deferment for more experienced women to chime in, but ultimately you brought the discussion to us so I figured I would make that point. Personally I can see some of what you say...but I also have seen it go the other way too.

Full disclosure I am male but my girlfriend of 4 years is in management in a predominantly male drive industry (Alcohol) and I hear a lot from her angle as well...so no bias here.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:40 PM
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originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: JadeStar

Perhaps try shifting the focus from you. A team incentive where all members have to work together as a team for a goal that is assessed individually, by their peers, and as a team with some sort of reward as an incentive can work wonders at getting an out of sync team member back on board and is reflective practice, perhaps tied into CPD and scheduled appraisals.


Great idea! We already have team bonuses but they come down from on high and there has not been one with me in this role yet. I can ask my boss if we can implement a new one.

Thanks SO MUCH for your answer!


One of he worse mistakes a new manager makes, especially if he was promoted within, is trying to be buddies with the staff. You can't be their buddy and their boss at the same time--it rarely works out. Set boundaries that define you as the boss immediately. This can be done without being obnoxious.




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