Two Questions for Transgender people

a reply to: Annee

You always calm me down. I cracked up after I made an apology and saw that you posted. My subtlety was on the fritz agin.

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: Annee

You always calm me down. I cracked up after I made an apology and saw that you posted. My subtlety was on the fritz agin.

Good to know

Believe me, I've had my times of major drama in life. Only age and wisdom has settled me.

a reply to: EKron

Ok EKron, how about we turn this around for a moment. If a person comes, as I did, to a place of comfort and understanding about themselves at an early age, then what growing have they to do worth a damn in that area? And is it not possible to understand oneself well early, and yet learn OTHER, unconnected things later on? For example, I knew myself very well from a very early age, but I learned many things about everything and everyone else during the period between then and now, and happily, am still learning.

Why must it be the case that someone who sees no reason to question their body, their image, is any less grown than someone who has questioned those things? Furthermore, why is it wrong to want to be with someone who has a similar history to my own where their attitude to body image is concerned? Why is it, that it is being suggested that a female who has never had a major self image problem does not exist or is fantastically rare, or is probably a narcissist, when there is a significant difference between starting out life super comfortable with ones body and mind in unison, and automatically becoming a huge pain in everyone's arse?

I do not understand.

Let me ask the here gathered one more time. Am I a transphobe if my reasons for not wanting to have a relationship with a transgender woman, are the same reasons why I would refuse to have a relationship with a woman who did not have any surgery in order to so be called?

originally posted by: Darth_Prime
Here is a potentially controversial article. i'm sharing it for conversation

www.transadvocate.com...

Thanks, Darth.

Okay, I'll discuss as one of those people that is not out (except here) or "stealth" not helping the "community". I see both sides of the coin but unless you have some high profile position where it might matter, screw the community. I have no obligation to be out and will openly admit my desire to maintain "pseudo cis privilege" in the real world. I've posted volumes on my life and psyche here to promote some awareness and understanding but have no intention of waving any flags in the physical sphere or of being anyone's role model.

a reply to: EKron

I don't know about SolarJetMan, but I am an old/young 56 year old man, who has been married for over 35 years, and I would date JadeStar in a heartbeat. She is simply a beautiful woman on the outside, and based on her posts, a seemingly beautiful woman on the inside. And guess what, that's the part that counts!!

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: JadeStar


Again,you guys with the personal attacks.

It has nothing to do with me or my fears. I have no concern for what you do nor any concern that I will be with a transgender as I'm married and have been married for over 16 years.

You guys are going of on tangents and are trying to make your own arguments that have nothing todo with what I said.

[quote[I'm not saying that society is right to feel like the following but its the reality of the world today. As a matter of fact I have stated the opposite , that it is NOT right that society feels like that.

Well then it's up to you and each of us to change that.

But see what you are asking is the opposite. What you are asking is that the status-quo be upheld. And ultimately if taken to it's extreme what you are asking is tyrannical.

You ask that we willingly and suddenly disclose something deeply personal which may or may not be relevant to a person who is out for some type of casual, momentary contact who has nothing invested emotionally in the person with which they are planning to have the casual, momentary contact and who they probably will never even see again.

You said:

Please note and to clarify, I'm only talking about disclosing the truth if its going to get sexually intimate.

In the context of this conversation that casual, momentary contact has centered around a one night stand scenario but it just as easily could center around something as simple as going on a date, or holding hands, or having a kiss.

Who knows what the threshold would be for your mentally unstable guy? Maybe just a glance from a girl like me if he knew my backstory would set him off?

I guess I should have disclosed before glancing right? Because his mental state is of the utmost importance.

See how ridiculous this is now?

You feel that we should be super concerned for this person's mental state in a contact which we will likely never see them again and they have no plans or concerns for seeing us again. Do you not see then that we are not the problem but rather, their mental state and proclivity to promiscuity would be?

So taken to it's extreme, what if a co-worker would go over the edge because he found out "OMG Jadestar used to have a penis"? Should I have had to disclose that to him? Should employers have a "Have you ever had the sex organs of the opposite gender?" question on an application?

After all, you have to look out for the fragile mental state of those guys I'd be working with right?

Now do you see how ridiculous this is?

If taken to an extreme, we would all be required to wear one of these everywhere we go in your world so that you know, everyone ALWAYS KNOWS.



I guess I could get used to that, but it would sure make it a lot easier to target us wouldn't it?

a reply to: blackmetalmist

Grand... That's straight talk, and I appreciate it blackmetalmist, really!

I was kind of worried there for a moment that the world had gone utterly mental, and that I, of all people, might end up being tarred with the same brush as all those bloody WBC nutcases.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Am I a transphobe if my reasons for not wanting to have a relationship with a transgender woman, are the same reasons why I would refuse to have a relationship with a woman who did not have any surgery in order to so be called?

No. You have a preference. If you're not irrationally scared of transgendered people, you're not transphobic. Calling you that is a tactic to make you feel like a bigot and to marginalize your valid opinions in this case.

What they're trying to say is that if you don't consider a transwoman to be the exact same as a woman, you're ignorant/stupid/bigoted and they get away with it by using the word transphobic which puts you on the defensive. It's similar to people that scream racism to shift the conversation so that a person has to waste their energy defending themselves.

You're issue is with people who aren't comfortable in their own bodies, and is actually a bit different than the topic as far as I can tell. It seems like you're equating transgender with not having body acceptance. That's a different subset of being transgender, gender dysphoria, that not all trans* people have according to the DSM. A transgender person can be transgender without surgery or hormones and be content with themselves.

a reply to: Domo1

Fair enough. Its good to know.

Personally speaking, my version of having no self image problem, is that I have a self image and because I do not give a god damn about what it looks like, its everyone else's problem! Glad to know there are people like that in every walk of life!

a reply to: TrueBrit

I have many gay friends and lesbian friends and do not feel at all uncomfortable at any given moment by my lesbian friends. I am secure in my femininity and would never not be friends with them just because it feels "weird". As long as you respect everyone and understand their struggles, it makes a difference.

Like I was telling Jade, hopefully with the transgender issue coming to light, this too will shed a light on the changes that our society is having now

a reply to: blackmetalmist

Well exactly!

I have friends who are of different sexual preferences, different ethnicities, and some who are trans, and they are my friends. I do not fear them, or what their choices might represent. I do not see my trans buddy any differently than I see any other friend of mine. I do not refer to her as "the trans one", I refer to her by the name she chose for her self, because that's what you do when you respect your friends. You support them.

a reply to: TrueBrit

It's a very nice feeling, not giving a flying f what other people think about your appearance. The older I get, the easier it gets. I figure by the time I'm 35 I'll be running around in a kilt and cowboy boots or something.

originally posted by: EKron

originally posted by: Darth_Prime
Here is a potentially controversial article. i'm sharing it for conversation

www.transadvocate.com...

Thanks, Darth.

Okay, I'll discuss as one of those people that is not out (except here) or "stealth" not helping the "community". I see both sides of the coin but unless you have some high profile position where it might matter, screw the community. I have no obligation to be out and will openly admit my desire to maintain "pseudo cis privilege" in the real world. I've posted volumes on my life and psyche here to promote some awareness and understanding but have no intention of waving any flags in the physical sphere or of being anyone's role model.

I agree with you. Not everyone is an activist. Nor should they have to be.

Being honest in your own personal life is all you need. Because, if you don't do that --- it hurts you and those closest to you. I personally think just living a normal life is a testament.

There are people born to be activists. There are straights fighting for equality for LGBTQ. There are whites fighting for equality of non-whites. Some people are just that way. Not all of us are.

a reply to: JadeStar

See how ridiculous this is now?

Yes, because you've shifted it from sexual contact to a glance or working with someone.

Do you not see then that we are not the problem but rather, their mental state and proclivity to promiscuity would be?

You're acting as if having a preference is somehow wrong, shifting all the blame to the other party. If you present as female, to the point that you have had gender reassignment surgery, and you are full aware that many people would be bothered by that and at the same time unaware thanks to societal norms and you not being forthcoming with the information, how is this not on you? It's been pointed out a number of times that the surgery is very authentic looking, to the point that no one would question it. People are not yet aware there should be a question if they have a problem. You ARE aware that some people may have a problem, so it's on you. You can't say they don't deserve to know because they don't know to ask.

originally posted by: TrueBrit

Ok EKron, how about we turn this around for a moment. If a person comes, as I did, to a place of comfort and understanding about themselves at an early age, then what growing have they to do worth a damn in that area? And is it not possible to understand oneself well early, and yet learn OTHER, unconnected things later on? For example, I knew myself very well from a very early age, but I learned many things about everything and everyone else during the period between then and now, and happily, am still learning.

Why is this one facet of who we are so darned important or why focus on the physical so much? I am much more than my vagina. I also knew myself well from a very early age and just had a few bumps in the road to take care of then moved on with my life. Trust me, I have learned many things about everything and everyone else during the period between then and now, and happily, am still learning as well.

Why must it be the case that someone who sees no reason to question their body, their image, is any less grown than someone who has questioned those things? Furthermore, why is it wrong to want to be with someone who has a similar history to my own where their attitude to body image is concerned? Why is it, that it is being suggested that a female who has never had a major self image problem does not exist or is fantastically rare, or is probably a narcissist, when there is a significant difference between starting out life super comfortable with ones body and mind in unison, and automatically becoming a huge pain in everyone's arse?

I've never met a woman without some sort of self image issue. These are things that women usually only share or talk about with other women so maybe you're just out of the loop? You can thank television and the media for creating false ideals that we're all supposed to live up to. Tummy too fat, boobs too small, butt too big, hair not luxurious enough, complexion not perfect. Women's appearance is held to much higher standards and I doubt you're ever going to find one that doesn't have something about themselves they'd like to change or be different. Would you consider a woman that had breast augmentation exceeds your selection criteria?

Let me ask the here gathered one more time. Am I a transphobe if my reasons for not wanting to have a relationship with a transgender woman, are the same reasons why I would refuse to have a relationship with a woman who did not have any surgery in order to so be called?

I don't think you're a "transphobe". I think if you met one of us and made a connection on an emotional level, these things you worry about or long for wouldn't matter as much as you think they do.

originally posted by: Domo1 I figure by the time I'm 35 I'll be running around in a kilt and cowboy boots or something.

Promise you'll post a picture of that when you get there!

a reply to: JadeStar

What is so ridiculous about the following statement?

Having sex with someone knowing that you are not revealing something that could adversely effect the other person is wrong, period.

For what is worth, being a straight guy, I will add my 2 cents to the table.

I would probably be hurt too, if I had found out "after" that she was born differently because like OP, I`m wired this way. But the fact is that if she got me up in the first place and everything appeared to be fine with her, both mentally and physically...I honestly woudln`t want to know the truth "after". They don`t say for nothing that "Ignorance is bliss" so why risk hurting? For all I know this has never happened to me but on a second thought how can I be 100% certain? And since I`m not the kind of person worrying over what might be or might not be, it doesn`t affect me at all.

If I was told previously, I would politely decline and would appreciate her being honest about it but if she told me afterwards, that would feel bad, not only because of birth gender thingy but also because of being exploited in such way....even though I would know it was a female in her mind all along. I guess my wiring/subconciousness still can`t fully comperhend the separation of body and mind.

a reply to: EKron

It's a deal! I've also been seriously considering a purse.

originally posted by: Op3nM1nd3d
I guess my wiring/subconciousness still can`t fully comperhend the separation of body and mind.

This is something I don't think anyone can fully comprehend. For those of us that have had extra steps to match these things up, the separation no longer exists.