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"Let’s make the Confederate flag a hate crime" - College prof calls to criminalize display

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posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 12:20 PM
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originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: FormOfTheLord

And I suppose you think that the Naval Jack never flew at any port, or seaward fortification controlled by the confederate navy, on territories controlled by the Confederate government!

Well thought out argument, well done... Except, of course, fortifications under the auspices of the Confederate Navy would, of course, have flown the Naval Jack, as would any landing parties they might have sent out into Union controlled territory.



The naval jack was rejected by the confederacy for the square battle flag. The naval jack did fly over ships for 2-3 years.

The naval jack only resurfaced when the dixiecrats went protesting laws that forbid whites from lynching African Americans, and to promote a pro segregation agenda. The dixiecrats were a racist political party organized in the summer of 1948 by conservative white southerners committed to states' rights and the maintenance of segregation and opposed to federal intervention into race. So people are waving the naval jack which was made the new confederate flag by the dixiecrats, which was voted against by the actual confederacy and rejected as thier national symbol. It was designed by William Porcher Miles, the chairman of the Flag and Seal committee, a now-popular variant of the Confederate flag was rejected as the national flag in 1861.

It was only after the dixiecrats did thier protest did people start to fly the navy jack confederate flag.
Heres a quote from the dixiecrats who took up the naval jack rectangular confederate flag:


We stand for the segregation of the races and the racial integrity of each race; the constitutional right to choose one's associates; to accept private employment without governmental interference, and to earn one's living in any lawful way. We oppose the elimination of segregation, the repeal of miscegenation statutes, the control of private employment by Federal bureaucrats called for by the misnamed civil rights program. We favor home-rule, local self-government and a minimum interference with individual rights.



Please stop.


The "Confederate flag"
For usage of Confederate symbols in modern society and popular culture, see Modern display of the Confederate flag.
"Rebel flag" redirects here. For the red and black flag commonly used in video games and symbology for unnamed or generic rebel movements, see bisected flag.

A rectangularized variant of the Army of Northern Virginia battle flag, common in modern reproductions. (A similar flag was used during the war by the Army of Tennessee under General Joseph E. Johnston.[31][32])
Designed by William Porcher Miles, the chairman of the Flag and Seal committee, a now-popular variant of the Confederate flag was rejected as the national flag in 1861. It was instead adopted as a battle flag by the Army of Northern Virginia under General Robert E. Lee.[33] Despite never having historically represented the CSA as a country nor officially recognized as one of the national flags, it is commonly referred to as "the Confederate Flag" and has become a widely recognized symbol of the American south.[34] It is also known as the rebel flag, Dixie flag, and Southern cross and is often incorrectly referred to as the "Stars and Bars".[35] (The actual "Stars and Bars" is the first national flag, which used an entirely different design.) The self-declared Confederate exclave of Town Line, New York, lacking a genuine Confederate flag, flew a version of this flag prior to its 1946 vote to ceremonially rejoin the Union.[citation needed] As of the early 21st century, the "rebel flag" has become a highly divisive symbol in the United States.[36]

en.wikipedia.org...

If you want to offer a history lesson to people, at least try to learn the history BEFORE you speak.




posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 12:37 PM
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Now the "NAACP wants removal of Confederate generals from Stone Mountain."



This crap reminds me of what ISIS is doing in the M.E.

Who thought it would stop with the flag at the SC Capital?

Better burn any civil war books to be safe!



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 01:18 PM
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Oh we knew this was coming because the SC government showed weakness.ALso Why didnt they let the SC people vote on this before hand? all they did was ignore their constituents and assumed they wanted it down. If they held a special vote and the majority wanted it down That would had been fine.

I have a compromise. remove all statues and monuments, for and against slavery. its the only fair thing to do. While were at it remove every statue and monument in the entire country since they always offend someone.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:26 PM
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The professor who wrote the article in the OP has since written another article at Salon, saying he was wrong. You guys probably still won't like what he has to say but here it is anyway. I'm glad he saw the error of his thinking.


Frederick Douglass, who often changed his position, was just as often accused of “inconsistency.” In reply, he answered that true consistency “consists not in being of the same opinion now as formerly, but in a fixed principle of honesty, even urging us to the adoption or rejection of that which may seem true or false to us at the ever-present now.”

In that spirit, I now freely admit that my former opinion was wrong about two very important matters.

First, although hate is indeed the key issue here, I was entirely wrong to assert that display of the flag should be “considered a hate crime and punished as such.” That goes against my own belief in free speech as protected by the Constitution. More important, it also goes against Frederick Douglass’ beliefs. As he once famously wrote: “To suppress free speech is a double wrong. It violates the rights of the hearer as well as those of the speaker.”

Second, if hate is the key issue (as I still believe it is), then throwing a rock into a hornet’s nest is not the way to diminish it. To judge by many of the comments the piece sparked, my piece was more successful at producing hate than defeating it.


Salon



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:28 PM
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a reply to: Kali74

At least he can admit when he is wrong, a quality that is lacking in many partisan discussions.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:35 PM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I have a battle flag that one of my ancestors took into battle, it's from the 30th MS regiment. It is the same flag.

You are confusing the three official government flags, with the battle standard.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:39 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Absolutely. It's scary how rare it is.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:43 PM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord

I would say he does.

For me, I am a Japanese-American, expat Southerner, living in Switzerland. That flag only represents my umpteen ancestors that died to protect their lands from what they saw as invaders. 19th century America was a lot larger place, given that only a few generations had passed since the Revolutionary War..Washington might as well be England.

I am glad I moved to Switzerland. I don't think my heart could take what I have seen happened to the states lately.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:49 PM
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Would it not be racist to assume you know why a person would decide to fly this flag simply by the color of their skin? All I hear are people talking about white people flying this flag, and many immediately assume they are racists, bigots, or full of hate, seems racist in itself.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:56 PM
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a reply to: Kali74

Good I can accept his retraction, now hopefully the naacp will follow his lead but I doubt the folks going after stone Mountain are as intelligent.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 03:57 PM
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a reply to: Kali74

There is a good book by James McPhereson, researching the letters of civil war soldiers. It is called "What they fought for," slavery is never mentioned. Southerners were protecting their families, and/or fighting for what they thought was a second war of independence. Northerners were fighting to preserve the Union.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 04:10 PM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord

The battle flag was used in parades, Confederate Veteran reunions, monuments, and SCV (created in 1896) events from nearly the end of the Civil War until today. Not sure where you get your information from.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 04:23 PM
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a reply to: Kali74

Thanks for posting that. It was refreshing.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 05:44 PM
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originally posted by: stosh64
a reply to: Kali74

Thanks for posting that. It was refreshing.



Indeed. Must have been some instant pressure on him to retract that statement.
I still believe his overall premise of FOS though.
We of this generation can never truly know what that flag represented to those who fought under it.
No doubt the reasons were as varied as the people fighting.
The entire drama is still an attempt to smear all Southern Whites with the stain of slavery.
Might as well blame all of us here for what wall street does.
I suspect Salon has some regrets over publishing it though I'm sure it didn't hurt their website counter hits.
edit on 14-7-2015 by Asktheanimals because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 06:27 PM
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Lets talk about things that matter.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 06:50 PM
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a reply to: Asktheanimals



The entire drama is still an attempt to smear all Southern Whites with the stain of slavery.


I don't believe that for a second. To what end? For the lulz?



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 07:18 PM
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It kills me that everyone is now offended by the confederate flag. I got one that will never come down. It's crazy cause I have black friends that still come to my house. Insane right. If you want to change something put a uniform on and go work for it. My friends and I are all veterans and agree that we are proud to be from the south.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 08:28 PM
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This war and every war is fought for greed and protection of the system, just like today. It's no different.

And it wouldn't surprise me in the least if those conscripted thought and believed they were fighting for freedom and whatever else patriot fervor used to enlist.

However, all wars are bankers wars. And as usual, those who directly profited and used the unwitting to protect they're system under the guise and gallantry of patriotism are still here today, profiting; doing the same thing elsewhere.

Same game...and yet not one peep about this from the media.

Source

herefore it comes as no surprise that most of the major corporations that were founded by Western European and American merchants prior to roughly 100 years ago, benefited directly from slavery.










edit on 14-7-2015 by Daedal because: edit

edit on 14-7-2015 by Daedal because: fixed link



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 08:31 PM
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originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Asktheanimals



The entire drama is still an attempt to smear all Southern Whites with the stain of slavery.


I don't believe that for a second. To what end? For the lulz?


FOR THE VOTES,and the lulz.



posted on Jul, 14 2015 @ 08:43 PM
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a reply to: yuppa

How does that work for gaining votes? It's not like the GOP didn't have that label before all this happened.



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