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Why does the EU hate Croatia and other slavic nations

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posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 04:33 PM
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I am so pissed at the EU. They won`t let Croatia in the EU because we won`t hand over general Ante Gotovina. They hate all slavic nations. Apparently a United Europe is only for the Western part of Europe. They piss me off.




posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 04:44 PM
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Look man I don’t know where your idea comes from since I don’t know what “Ante Gotovina” is, but if the EU hates Croatia and other Slavic nations this is the first news that I have.

“They won`t let Croatia in the EU because” Every country applying for the EU must accomplish with very restrictive rules on policy, social being, fiscal, economic and one thousand more details.

You had huge problems not so long time ago. I guess you need some time for recovering and once you accomplish the EU conditions, nobody in the EU will stand against the Croatian and other Slavic states candidature.

You cannot just enter the EU, when all the others 25 members worked and sacrificed themselves hard in order to meet the requirements.

“only for the Western part of Europe” What? What about the new 10 members? What about the candidature of Romania and Bulgaria?

I think you are a little bit misinformed and you are a little bit impatient.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 04:48 PM
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Originally posted by Croat56
I am so pissed at the EU. They won`t let Croatia in the EU because we won`t hand over general Ante Gotovina. They hate all slavic nations. Apparently a United Europe is only for the Western part of Europe. They piss me off.


**emerges from anti-EU box**

Trust me (or not) but the EU isn't all its cracked up to be.

**crawls back into anti-EU box - hopefully without Pelayo and sminkeypinkey noticing**



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 04:53 PM
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Too late Wizard




posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by Pelayo
Too late Wizard



**locks box**



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:02 PM
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Originally posted by Pelayo
Look man I don’t know where your idea comes from since I don’t know what “Ante Gotovina” is, but if the EU hates Croatia and other Slavic nations this is the first news that I have.

“They won`t let Croatia in the EU because” Every country applying for the EU must accomplish with very restrictive rules on policy, social being, fiscal, economic and one thousand more details.

You had huge problems not so long time ago. I guess you need some time for recovering and once you accomplish the EU conditions, nobody in the EU will stand against the Croatian and other Slavic states candidature.

You cannot just enter the EU, when all the others 25 members worked and sacrificed themselves hard in order to meet the requirements.

“only for the Western part of Europe” What? What about the new 10 members? What about the candidature of Romania and Bulgaria?

I think you are a little bit misinformed and you are a little bit impatient.


I know about all that conditions stuff. Ante Gotovina is a general. They want to try him for war crimes because he defended his hometown against the Serbs. We recoverd like a year after it. Theres nothing left to recover from



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:09 PM
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Well scotland doesnt hate you , YOUR OUR OFFICIAL FOOTIE TEAM!



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:12 PM
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UKWizard is right. Be thankful for Ante Gotovina. This is one club you don't want to be in.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by Chris McGee
UKWizard is right. Be thankful for Ante Gotovina. This is one club you don't want to be in.


Why dont we want to be in it. The Euro is worth more then the Kuna. Itd make us richer



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:22 PM
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This pretty much explains my postion on it:


originally posted by Chris McGee

I am not keen on the EU, certainly not in it's present form. I think any union with the French, Germans, Italians and the UK in it is doomed to failure, as illustrated by the wonderful growth and stability pact which the major nations see fit to ignore at will. The way I see it, until there is a sea change at least in the policies of the major EU nations, we will never fit in. Trying to jam these different nations together in one bloc just doesn't make sense to me. Geographically we may be close together but the various outlooks on social, economic, military and foreign policy are just too diverse to be compatible.

I think the structure of the Union is almost totally undemocratic, there is no transparency whatsoever and fraud is rampant (accounts not signed off for how many years now?)

Most of the members of the commission and the MEPs are out for what they can get and are totally partisan on every subject, never doing what's best for the majority, just for their little plot. Countries like France and Spain are quite happy to suck other countries dry to make their farmers a bit richer while resisting any meaningful reform to make the system a bit fairer.

A small group of countries at the top table seem to feel they have the right to dictate to the rest of the union, stuffing their noses in the trough and leaving the smaller nations to beg for scraps.

They interfere in every part of our lives, grabbing more and more power with each and every treaty with every tiny concession gained paid for with a pound of flesh from our great nation. More and more pointless laws every day, strangling British competitiveness (and only our competitiveness because we are the only ones who obey them) and decimating our 1200 year old legal system.


UKWizard might recognise it
. If the Croats join the EU, don't make the mistake of thinking you'll matter or have any say on things. Just be prepared to receive diktat upon diktat from the Euro-Politburo.

P.S. This thread is not about my views on the EU and hence I will not be drawn into a long, thread trashing debate on them (that means you sminkey
).



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:26 PM
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Originally posted by Chris McGee
This pretty much explains my postion on it:


originally posted by Chris McGee

I am not keen on the EU, certainly not in it's present form. I think any union with the French, Germans, Italians and the UK in it is doomed to failure, as illustrated by the wonderful growth and stability pact which the major nations see fit to ignore at will. The way I see it, until there is a sea change at least in the policies of the major EU nations, we will never fit in. Trying to jam these different nations together in one bloc just doesn't make sense to me. Geographically we may be close together but the various outlooks on social, economic, military and foreign policy are just too diverse to be compatible.

I think the structure of the Union is almost totally undemocratic, there is no transparency whatsoever and fraud is rampant (accounts not signed off for how many years now?)

Most of the members of the commission and the MEPs are out for what they can get and are totally partisan on every subject, never doing what's best for the majority, just for their little plot. Countries like France and Spain are quite happy to suck other countries dry to make their farmers a bit richer while resisting any meaningful reform to make the system a bit fairer.

A small group of countries at the top table seem to feel they have the right to dictate to the rest of the union, stuffing their noses in the trough and leaving the smaller nations to beg for scraps.

They interfere in every part of our lives, grabbing more and more power with each and every treaty with every tiny concession gained paid for with a pound of flesh from our great nation. More and more pointless laws every day, strangling British competitiveness (and only our competitiveness because we are the only ones who obey them) and decimating our 1200 year old legal system.


UKWizard might recognise it
. If the Croats join the EU, don't make the mistake of thinking you'll matter or have any say on things. Just be prepared to receive diktat upon diktat from the Euro-Politburo.

P.S. This thread is not about my views on the EU and hence I will not be drawn into a long, thread trashing debate on them (that means you sminkey
).



We dont matter or have any say on things now. We cant evan get Hercegovina back because of the damn U.N. I hate the U.N.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 05:29 PM
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Hey, you at least have some say on your own affairs, imagine the UN running your country, that's the EU.

edit: forgot to mention you'll be paying for it aswell.

[edit on 27-12-2004 by Chris McGee]



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 06:17 PM
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Why does the EU hate Croatia and other slavic nations


- We don't hate Croatia or any slavic nation; but specifically in this matter there are issues of the recognition of legal jurisdictions in relation to human rights matters.
If you won't agree to this stuff you aren't coming in, it's as simple as that. Those of us in the EU all signed up to these matters and expect all new applicants to do so.

No-one is forcing anything on anyone but the 'club' has rules, abide by the rules and enjoy the benefits of membership or don't, it's your free choice.

I also have to say I find your comments and the responces of the UK anti-EU faction here to them very amusing.
It is quite clear that there are people in the UK who are so blinkered in their views on this matter that they have blinded themselves to any kind of balanced view on the matter and have worked themselves into the utterly perverse situation where they cannot even admit any benefits of EU membership.

Isn't it funny how the guys on the outside can see it yet those 'in' and benefiting refuse to?


I will not be drawn into a long, thread trashing debate on them (that means you sminkey
).


- Wow, I never realised I had the 'power' to 'draw' you into anything Chris.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 06:41 PM
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Look Croat56

As sminkeypinkey told you, being member of the EU is not an obligation. The condition of the EU is that Ante Gotovina must be processed. You don’t want to process Ante Gotovina, so you will not join the EU.

Well, that’s right.

So what’s the problem?


Chris McGee,

I must admit that your vitriol against the EU is the most funny “anti-europeist” staff that I have ever rode/heard. It made me laugh, literally!!



The people who think as you do, should be kept out of the EU for…lets say 30 years. And after this 30 years, the admission should be given under draconian conditions. This would be a benefice for all the EU, because:

On one hand, the molest people would kept away from the EU construction.

On the other hand the EU (mainly the French and Spanish farmers) would become richer thanks to the draconian conditions of re-ingress. The very same ingress for what you would loose the a*s to achieve.




[edit on 27-12-2004 by Pelayo]



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 06:47 PM
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Fine by me, keep me and the 45 million Britons who think the same way out of it.

Why 30 years? Let's make it 500 years.

That'll give the spanish farmers time to think about what they've lost.


That has meant that poorer states with a big agricultural sector have been the main beneficiaries of EU aid. Portugal, Greece, Ireland and Spain all receive more than twice as much as they pay in.


news.bbc.co.uk...

Hey, wonder why you're in favour!


They also point out that for years foreign vessels, especially from Spain, registered in Britain under "flags of convenience" to claim part of the annual quota.


news.bbc.co.uk...

Don't forget the fish, we've got the money, make sure we get the fish aswell.

[edit on 27-12-2004 by Chris McGee]



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 07:02 PM
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Ante Gotovina never did anything wrong. If anything we should be the first ones to be let in for free since ALL of Europe including Briton never did anything to help.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 07:26 PM
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Well, as I am a engineer and not a farmer I think can be impartial at this point

“That has meant that poorer states with a big agricultural sector have been the main beneficiaries of EU aid. Portugal, Greece, Ireland and Spain” You forgot Italy.

This is true in some sense and fake in some other sense. If Spain was USA the EU would not give us a s*it. And we would piss on the EU. That is quite logic, don’t you think so?

“all receive more than twice as much as they pay in.” Well, this is an absolutely fake idea created by the anti-europeists. When Spain joined the EU under very restrictive conditions, we suffered an spectacular industrial re-conversion in order to keep the Brit, French, German, etc. industries making a good business. My city went back 10 years due the industrial re-conversion ordered by the EU. Is this fact taken into account in your reasoning? In fact there appeared a lot of political parties in Spain which claimed that the conditions of the EU accepted by Spain had been abusive, and purposed Spain going out of the EU and re-negotiating the membership. But I don’t care about this. Now we are in 2004.

Finally Spain wined a net benefice, no doubt. But the Brit, German, French, etc economies wined a market of 43 millions of inhabitants and the EU won the 9th economy in the world. The EU won the cooperation of the most important country in Europe from the strategic point of view, and a huge influence in the Latin America. As I claimed, everybody got beneficed.

Which is the price that you give to all this stuff? I have the impression that you give to it 0 Euros. Well, you are very wrong. The benefices for the EU of the Spanish (I will not talk about the French) membership can not be measured with money.

Ignoring all the things that I have told you, we can say that Spain will loose all the economic benefices once the new 10 eastern members joined the EU. But Spain keep being one of the most enthusiastic backers of the EU’s expansion.

Sorry Chris, but I think that your reasons are based in a blind egoism. And this is OK for me, but be aware that the World feels so many flip-flops along the time that maybe one day your country could not mean interest for anybody. And if anybody had something to be pleased towards you, your future could be very dark. Or maybe I am wrong…

“Hey, wonder why you're in favour!” I see. But could you explain to me why now that Spain will loose all the aid for its farms, Spain keeps being one of the main defenders of the expansion?

As I suggested, I am totally agree with the referendums of membership to the EU in all the European countries, and I am totally agree with setting draconian (note that I dont say hard, but draconian) conditions for those countries which will want in a future to re-join the EU.

In the very bottom of our ideologies, Chris, we are agree. But we predict very different consequences of an eventual separation of the UK from the EU.

But take note that I support at 100% an eventual referendum in the UK in order to deciede the membership of the EU.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 07:51 PM
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“all receive more than twice as much as they pay in.” Well, this is an absolutely fake idea created by the anti-europeists. When Spain joined the EU under very restrictive conditions, we suffered an spectacular industrial re-conversion in order to keep the Brit, French, German, etc. industries making a good business.


From the BBC link you obviously didn't bother to read (why let facts get in the way of nationalistic hyperbole):

Spain's contributin to the EU (£millions): 3,694
Spain's payments FROM the EU (£millioms): 8,554


If Spain was USA the EU would not give us a s*it. And we would piss on the EU. That is quite logic, don’t you think so?


That's possibly the stupidest thing i've ever heard on P@ATS. Yes, if spain were the USA we wouldn't give you anything.


[Finally Spain wined a net benefice, no doubt. But the Brit, German, French, etc economies wined a market of 43 millions of inhabitants and the EU won the 9th economy in the world. The EU won the cooperation of the most important country in Europe from the strategic point of view, and a huge influence in the Latin America. As I claimed, everybody got beneficed


The most important country in europe?


Huge influence in Latin America?


Wow, that's gotta be worth £5 billion.



Which is the price that you give to all this stuff? I have the impression that you give to it 0 Euros. Well, you are very wrong. The benefices for the EU of the Spanish (I will not talk about the French) membership can not be measured with money.


The price I give is $4.86 billion. Membership can't be measured with money if you are getting it all. Very easy to say when you are receiving all the money.


Ignoring all the things that I have told you, we can say that Spain will loose all the economic benefices once the new 10 eastern members joined the EU. But Spain keep being one of the most enthusiastic backers of the EU’s expansion.


Yes, enthusiastic to the tune of $4.86 billion pounds.


Sorry Chris, but I think that your reasons are based in a blind egoism. And this is OK for me, but be aware that the World feels so many flip-flops along the time that maybe one day your country could not mean interest for anybody. And if anybody had something to be pleased towards you, your future could be very dark. Or maybe I am wrong…


Blah, blah, and your reasons are based in the fact we give you £4.86 billion a year. I don't believe that's your personal reason for supporting the EU, please don't try and make my views out to be some kind of ego trip (btw I still don't get that).


In the very bottom of our ideologies, Chris, we are agree. But we predict very different consequences of an eventual separation of the UK from the EU.

But take note that I support at 100% an eventual referendum in the UK in order to deciede the membership of the EU.


I do not support separation of the UK from the EU, I just think we need some serious reform. If we, together, all the nation states of the EU, can build something that is democratic, just and representative, then I say we do it. The current system is rife with corruption and severely flawed.

If we are to build a united europe then let us build it on principles and justice. Transparency and democracy will be our watchwords. We will build a europe our citizens can be proud of, not one that can't sign off on it's accounts year after year.

A europe that stands for truth, prosperity and peace.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 07:55 PM
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Originally posted by Chris McGee
Fine by me, keep me and the 45 million Britons who think the same way out of it.


- 45 million Britons eh!?

45 million Britons want to leave the EU? Really? As claimed by UKIP's polling data no doubt.


I just hope we can come back to this when your side loses the constitution vote (the most recent polls have already been showing this very evenly split......and we haven't even had a campaign talking about the benefits of it yet!) and you really think there is a majority for coming out of the EU in the UK!?

Talk about dellusions of grandeur!

If it comes to a straight 'in' or 'out' referendum vote your 'out' side loses......as many on that side fully understand; which is why so many of them started crying foul when our gov first talked about the coming constitutional vote in those terms.

You're fooling yourself if you really think otherwise.



posted on Dec, 27 2004 @ 08:11 PM
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No, sminkey, I was going by figures of 65% of the British population thinking the EU doesn't work in it's present format. Pelayo suggested a new format and I assented.

Poll Data

ICM's polling data.

Talk about delusions of intelligence.


If it comes to a straight 'in' or 'out' referendum vote your 'out' side loses


Why don't you read the last couple of paragraphs of my reply you reactionist [cough].



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