Why is same-sex marriage wrong?

a reply to: windword

APPLAUSE!

Thank you wrong way windy and your funny little buddies. Just sitting here with some theological friends who wanted to see for themselves the lack of intelligence. It was amusing.

a reply to: Seede



Sigh..Ok

I am upset by any circumstance where the constitution is being trampled regardless of the situation. If the constitution is respected and obeyed then I would accept that authority. I am not saying that I would agree but I would accept. The problem I have is that a population of between 318 million to 319 million people are ruled by five lawyers.

So you accept the Same-Sex ruling than?.. i mean by your words "If the constitution is obeyed" and in this case the 14th was, so you agree?

If you think for a moment that this is a one shot deal then you are very naive. This nation is is now destroyed from its intent.

How, can you and your theological friends explain to me how?

without quoting scriptures or the word of "God" but explain to me how? ... intelligence

Sadly he has lost faith in other people, especially those of his age. My son is not the one who needs to be fixed, it's the people who cannot be decent or at least teach their children to be.

originally posted by: alphastrike101

originally posted by: demondonna
I do not believe he should be fixed. If these differences were gone I feel part of my sons personality would be too. That would devastate me. He's a happy lad most of the time. I would love for him to be a little biut more social but other than that by boy is what he is and i love him regardless.

Of course you do but how do you think he feels? I am sure he would like to be able to do all the things others kids are doing and at their levels.

In any cases it would be up to the parents to decide if defects prevention is is something they want or do not want. Some parents want a 30 years old man child they can coddle their whole life.

a reply to: demondonna

If you want to raise a child that will suffer emotional, adjustment, developmental and social issues, all the power too you.

That is your choice.

My choice would be to prevent such things. I do not blame parents that have different goals for their children. If they want to overcome or prevent things that maybe keep their children from meeting goals they set, all the power to them.

If there is prevention and/or treatment, no one should be able to stop parents from seeking such means.

My girlfriends sister that took her son for stem cell treatment did nothing wrong and was only trying to give him the best life in her opinion. And I agree with her.

originally posted by: Seede
a reply to: windword

APPLAUSE!

Thank you wrong way windy and your funny little buddies. Just sitting here with some theological friends who wanted to see for themselves the lack of intelligence. It was amusing.

You're welcome, Seede of Malcontent.

Glad I could a smile on your curmudgeon face!

originally posted by: alphastrike101
a reply to: demondonna

If you want to raise a child that will suffer emotional, adjustment, developmental and social issues, all the power too you.

That is your choice.

My choice would be to prevent such things. I do not blame parents that have different goals for their children. If they want to overcome or prevent things that maybe keep their children from meeting goals they set, all the power to them.

If there is prevention and/or treatment, no one should be able to stop parents from seeking such means.

My girlfriends sister that took her son for stem cell treatment did nothing wrong and was only trying to give him the best life in her opinion. And I agree with her.

But nobody is...and that's not the subject of the thread...all we've heard (since the overt utube advertisment) is how 'choice' is being taken away - you've rabbitted on about whether homosexuality is a disease or not, and yet others have just said '...because, bible'...

This issue, at all levels, is about choice - a choice formerly denied, being instate/reinstated, it confers more choice, not less...to anyone...

'You' will still be able to practice eugenics on 'your' unborn children, as 'you' wish (that issue has absolutely nothing to do with the thread title) and no-one is challenging 'your' right to practice this - no appeals to government, no christian anti-gay lobbies, no christian no-lifers...no-one...

The thread title is obviously a hate-filled appeal (couched in 'words' of love) to rant about 'what I reckon'...using the obviously, completely love-filled reference, the bible...disingenuous and hypocritical beyond belief...

Å99

originally posted by: Seede
a reply to: windword

APPLAUSE!

Thank you wrong way windy and your funny little buddies. Just sitting here with some theological friends who wanted to see for themselves the lack of intelligence. It was amusing.

i find it funny to read this sort of post from someone who appears to be implying their intelligence is superior in comparison. and yet, all evidence suggests that it is for LACK of something intelligent to say that you resort to such unbecoming and, quite frankly, vulgar attacks that have nothing at all to do with the actual topic. but i guess if you gotta do it, do it online. that way no one can put dirt in your eye.

with that said, just imagine the sort of deity who approves of such behavior... *shudder*

a reply to: akushla99

Yes there are many groups trying to prevent medical research that would prevent homosexuality and others birth defects.

The title of the thread was "why is same-sex marriage wrong"

I stated that the premise of the open was wrong.
I also presented numerous peer reviewed papers supporting my points.

Usually the bible thumpers like to say that it is a choice. I was expecting to debate them as well but not takers.
ironically given the facts and a likely way to prevent such birth defects being up to the parents, homosexuality may be very soon in fact be a choice.

Does the parent decide to accepted the risks of out of control androgens levels subsequently causing birthdefects and should sociaty bear the burden of that choice?

When LGBT members spent such time and effort trying to get everyone to believe it is normal only to have science refuted that assertion peoples feelings get hurt.

Should we hide from such facts based on hurting someones feelings?

originally posted by: alphastrike101
a reply to: akushla99

Yes there are many groups trying to prevent medical research that would prevent homosexuality and others birth defects.

The title of the thread was "why is same-sex marriage wrong"

I stated that the premise of the open was wrong.
I also presented numerous peer reviewed papers supporting my points.

Usually the bible thumpers like to say that it is a choice. I was expecting to debate them as well but not takers.
ironically given the facts and a likely way to prevent such birth defects being up to the parents, homosexuality may be very soon in fact be a choice.

Does the parent decide to accepted the risks of out of control androgens levels subsequently causing birthdefects and should sociaty bear the burden of that choice?

When LGBT members spent such time and effort trying to get everyone to believe it is normal only to have science refuted that assertion peoples feelings get hurt.

Should we hide from such facts based on hurting someones feelings?

We're going to have to 'bear the burden' of the research, before...or after birth...it will cost either way, so 'bearing the burden' is a) payed for, either way...and b) correcting hormones in the womb may not address the way things turn out...so, the argument is a moot one, and in relation to the OP, can have nothing to with science, when saying '...but, but, bible'...On the whole, I personally, do not agree that the ethics of eugenics outweigh the fabled utopian society being heralded...that IS my opinion...but others may think differently (which I think is quite ok)...because, opinions are like donkeyfundaments - and everyone's got one...

Å99

a reply to: TzarChasm

i find it funny to read this sort of post from someone who appears to be implying their intelligence is superior in comparison. and yet, all evidence suggests that it is for LACK of something intelligent to say that you resort to such unbecoming and, quite frankly, vulgar attacks that have nothing at all to do with the actual topic. but i guess if you gotta do it, do it online. that way no one can put dirt in your eye.

Thank you Tzar, for your unbiased and off subject remark in finding my post "funny." Apparently you neglected to read the posts that I responded to which were off topic also. That seems to be the fairness of what I have come to see of your intelligence also. You found my post funny but I find your post full of hate and disquietness. As for deity? That also was off topic and a vulgar inference. You may not realize that your post was also off topic. Which is it pot or kettle?

a reply to: Seede

You still haven't answered me yet.. anytime

originally posted by: alphastrike101
a reply to: akushla99

Yes there are many groups trying to prevent medical research that would prevent homosexuality and others birth defects.
..............

The true fact is scientist have zero idea why a person is homosexual it is all conjecture and will always will be just conjecture because it is beyond the physics of the body and in the mind and is not induced by chemicals.You obviously have had zero “real”experience with a real live intersexed person.There is nothing “abnormal” or defective about them they simply can’t be classified as male or female.They can be a genetic woman that has a fully formed functioning penis with healthy viable spermatozoon able to impregnate while also being able to ovulate and be able to conceive and give birth to a viable baby.I know this as a true fact and direct experince not some internet site where I read it and regurgitated BS.

To say homosexuals or intersexed people are abnormal and defective is bigotry at it’s zenith.Before science understood the intersex phenomena they would mutilate them to fit into “normal” society when the fact is they are “normal” and are not defective.They can have different types of health complications but all people are at risk to health complications.Most of the ill effects are the imposition of a perverted society of "normal people" that thinks and believe they(homosexuals, transgendered, intersexed etc) are abnormal and defective.A human that is both sexes intersexed is what scares the hell out of some of “normal” society because then those miscreants can’t judge and ostracize “it” (which is what many people call the transgendered or intersexed )or anyone who is not “normal” like them.

Science can know what caused the process of intersex to a point however they just can’t know ALL of the ways and reasons why.The fact is life will find a way and more and more it is intersexed people.They are so many forms of being intersexed there is no possible way to “treat”(as a Dr .Mengele would ) them all or a need to.They have no idea what those “womb” treatments really do down the line.

Being intersexed (or homosexual) doesn’t mean there will be anymore medical conditions than any other “normal” people.Intersexed people(and homosexuals etc) are ostracized because of the ignorance of some(many) “normal” people that aren’t normal at all but hateful bigots.The sham of normal people trying to “help” them is a subterfuge of getting rid of those that are abnormal and defective just as you have stated multiple times.The world would be a much better place without that kind of a “normal” person.

a reply to: akushla99

I do not considered medical advancement a burden but an inevitability of progress.

correcting hormones in the womb may not address the way things turn out...so, the argument is a moot one

I and the peer reviewed studies disagree with that statement.

Preventing birthdefects is another inevitability. Unless the world turns into mad max people like Dr. Maria New and Dr. William Rice will continue to fight defects causing anomalies wether you agree with it or not.

Unfortunately ideologues on both sides will illogically oppose both recent scientific findings and subsequent remedial action.

a reply to: Rex282

I sugest you read and try to refuted my posts or peer reviewed studies I posted on the last pages rather thank make hasty generalizations and ad hominem.

If you have a particular point to make with reguard to one of my older posts please do, but I am not going to spam the thread with points I have already made.

originally posted by: alphastrike101
a reply to: akushla99

I do not considered medical advancement a burden but an inevitability of progress.

correcting hormones in the womb may not address the way things turn out...so, the argument is a moot one

I and the peer reviewed studies disagree with that statement.

Preventing birthdefects is another inevitability. Unless the world turns into mad max people like Dr. Maria New and Dr. William Rice will continue to fight defects causing anomalies wether you agree with it or not.

Unfortunately ideologues on both sides will illogically oppose both recent scientific findings and subsequent remedial action.

"I do not consider..." - good for you..."advancement", or not, would be seen decades afterwards, probably not even in our lifetimes...

We have a difference of opinion on the long-term effects of 'treatments', obviously...thalidomide seemed like such a good idea at the time - probably extensively 'peer reviewed' at the time...that went pretty pear-shaped for really ethically positive reasons, with all the most altruistic and pro-active concepts of 'advancements'...

Å99

originally posted by: alphastrike101
a reply to: Rex282

I sugest you read and try to refuted my posts or peer reviewed studies I posted on the last pages rather thank make hasty generalizations and ad hominem.

If you have a particular point to make with reguard to one of my older posts please do, but I am not going to spam the thread with points I have already made.

I have zero obligation to track down your post’s and review your links.If you want me to know what they are post them.I am positive I know(not believe or think I do) more about intersexed people than you will ever know if you studied your articles from here to eternity. However I have read your post and they are filled with 2nd hand(at best) ignorance and propaganda.

I clearly stated I know there is NO positive proof (and many scientist agree ) of the abnormality of homosexuality intersexed etc people .You keep spewing your ignorance about it as if it is fact when you don’t “know”.If that is you take on a ad hominem attack that is your ignorance not mine.

The points have been made....you have no idea what you are talking about.You are miming something you read that reflects your personal agenda…nothing more.I am positive you are neither a doctor of any kind or a scientist.I am simply denying your great ignorance.It doesn’t matter one bit how you are not a believer in God as many of the homosexual bigots are …..you are still propagating something you are completely ignorant of with your perverted demeaning taunts of “abnormal” and defective people.

You have been told over and over by reasonable people here at ATS(and reason itself) how ignorant of this subject you are yet you can’t hear.It is not my job or anyone elses to educate you on something you think you can read an article or two(hundred ..doesn’t matter) on the internet and then make obtuse “factual” claims about.If you want to make such claims then you better have clear proof of them however the fact is your claims cannot EVER be proven as fact because there is incalculable factors involved that scientist will never know of….and any honest scientist knows that as fact.

However the crux is more importantly there is no reason to search for a “cure” for homosexuals and intersexed people because there is nothing WRONG or abnormal or defective with homosexuals and intersexed people to “fix”..That is the source of your complete ignorance and blindness on the subject of homosexuality and intersexed.

It is you that have hijacked and trolled this thread and made it into your personal agenda that has no basis in truth.The thread is ….Why is same sex marriage wrong???..it isn’t.In relationship to your trolling remarks of intersexed people.The fact is intersexed people are both sexes.If they marry there is no possible way they can ever not be married to someone of the opposite sex.To call them abnormal and defective as you have numerous times is supreme ignorance and I am denying it.

a reply to: akushla99

There is already ongoing clinical trials with the use of dexamethasone to prevent such congenital disfunctions. With positive results from previous studies by Dr. New.

So it will and is currently in out life time.

Thalidomide issued over the counter as a cure all over half a century ago is a non sequitur.

originally posted by: alphastrike101
a reply to: akushla99

There is already ongoing clinical trials with the use of dexamethasone to prevent such congenital disfunctions. With positive results from previous studies by Dr. New.

So it will and is currently in out life time.

Thalidomide issued over the counter as a cure all over half a century ago is a non sequitur.
It in fact is still used to treat a number of sicknesses to this day including sarcoidosis ,graft-versus-host disease, rheumatoid arthritis and others.

'Peer reviewed', 'extensive trials'...is a non sequitor?...you either accept that the reviews were wrong, or the 'full' effex of a harmless pain relief medication on an unborn child, was not known, at the time...similarly, the long-term effect of 'hormone-correction' on an unborn child through to adulthood cannot be known, and if there were psychological or chemical side-effex, the lag-time between administration and long-term effex, serve to distance the cause from the effect...luckily, the effex of Thalidomide were picked up, and corrected - but (and I have not looked, if indeed they still exist) the reviews and trials could be read today to come to the same conclusion that contradicts what we know, after the fact...how trusting would you be in a wheelchair of 'peer-reviewed' whatever, while charging the batteries of your mobility?

Å99

a reply to: akushla99

1959, considering the US was mostly spared that outcome because Dr. Kelsey of the FDA refused to authorize the medication.

Dexamethasone has been approved for clinical trials.

There maybe be risks. Even advil has risks and can cause death if not used correctly.

You make it sound as if they are just throwing drugs at women just to see what happens and that is simply not the cases.

Dr. alice dranger tried to make the cases that dex was harmeful but her cases was refuted and the second round of clinical trials of dex was permitted to proceed.

You can looks up her sutdy titled " preventing homosexuality (and uppity women)" and read exactly how and why it was refuted.

a reply to: alphastrike101

I'm saying...I have no reason to believe it could not happen again - and specifically in relation to the OP question...I'm sure testing and review is rigourous, I have problems with the extrapolation from specific to general, as if trials/accidents are any representation of population holus bolus...any 'cure' could be handled this way, depending on how convincing the argument for it's 'treatment' was...that's what Mengele was allowed to do...

Glad you have reached a somewhat understand of my position.

Cheers

Å99