Your genetically-enhanced, cyborg future.

a reply to: edward777
Well the popularly predicted things will require more time than commonly thought. If you look at history, popular predictions of the future are taking much longer--things like sentient robots and aliens and laser weapons and AI and manned travel to other moons or planets and so on. Consequently, I think my thinking on this is right, given history is my witness.

However, if you were to read science fiction from the late and early 20th century, you'd be lucky to find ANYTHING at all relating to computers, yet computers were such a huge innovation in the mid 20th century. SO we can expect the future to surprise us in the same way it has surprised us in the past. This is not at all to say nobody in the 19th or ealry 20th century predicted computers. In fact, the first recognized prototype design for a general purpose computer was in the early 19th century courtesy of Charles Babbage. He even produced a partial prototype. Back then "computing" was all mechanical, so there were limitations. And the understanding in the general population was terrible. However, it was well understand that mechanical calculators were valuable, and they were commonly used and improved, so in their own way, the people of the 19th century knew what computers were about, just not completely. And to humanity's credit, a programmable mechanical doll was created in the late 18th century which could write a few words. And even the romans understood the general idea when they made a cart which would move based on instructions input via a string and processed via gravity. And of course there were many other examples of insight. So whatever surprises happen in the future, we can expect ourselves to already be partially privy to them

So to sum up my post:
1) Popular ideas of the future will require much more time
2) Surprises will occur, but we at least are partially informed of them--our best minds are in fact presently enabling its reality

What fascinates me most about the future isn't how it will be merely an extension of the present, but how it will change things on a deep level and--hence--make it even harder to predict.

For example, consider how technology has increasingly allowed us to exist in any region of the planet in any season. This has consequently meant living more frequently indoors or within the confines of a structured living area--like a city or minimally a place connected to a superhighway of sorts. Less time spent in the fields means more time reading or listening to lectures or communicating with others. The move away from hard physical labor to social and intellectual tasks is dramatic. How has htis assisted or changed our future? Could our ancestors have foreseen this?

Much of science fiction in the late 19th and early 20th century predicted we would sit idly inside heavily manufactured cities, relying on machines to do life's important duties. We would whither away to nothing yet possibly be saved by a few brave adventurers who would break the routine and dash out into the wilderness, reattaining all of the skills which had been lost.

Will we become more social? More intellectual? Will we lose our muscle? Will we become more pale? Will our eyes change? What will we prefer? What kind of body will we want? What will we want out of life?

Imagine back to the days when working the field or braving the wilderness was more common. Having a strong body and sharp senses was valuable. Must be alert and aware of every sound and visual hint. But if you transport yourself to the present, it seems those traits are not as relevant to the general person. Now, it seems, the capacity to communicate and tolerate many years of schooling are in order. Additionally, the large integration of all cultures and peoples pressures us to intermingle peacefully and while also preventing spread of disease. So much information bombards us too. This isn't a tribe. Its not a country. It's Earth. It's humanity.

a reply to: jonnywhite

Not a big Cyberpunk fan are you?

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: jonnywhite

Not a big Cyberpunk fan are you?

I'm inline with the posters here who say cyborgism already exists and perhaps has existed for as long as people have manipulated their body or otherwise added correctional things to them.

I know it's commonly understoood to be part-man/part-machine and always thought to be in the not-so-distant-future, but I cna't help making comparisons to eyeglasses or prosthetics or pacemakers.

It's a dream to overcome the limitations of our body whetehr it's to fix a broken part or to replace it with something better.

Maybe we'll find something even better someday. Some posters referenced nanobots. But maybe there'e even more far out things waiting for us in the far future. What if we could transmit ourselves and existed as a sort of plasma or energy? If we were not limited to present material systems it might open up the door for many things. We call these things spirit or soul today, but in the future we might have strict technical definitions. Science must master it first. No longer it'll be the realm of the gods.

originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: boohoo

What happens when the soldier leaves service?
Initially a true cyborg would not be able to leave service as none exist outside of it.
So legally. They would own you.
For public safety.
Terminal testing,great life.

Well they could just remove your military upgrades and you are left with a civvie model. I dont think slavery would fly well.And if cyborg tech becomes prevalent you will see cyber police as well as regular cops keeping cyborgs and regulars in line. AP rounds will become standard issue to when that happens.

You are completely FOOLING yourself, its not going to work that way at all, take the time to read the articles I posted on "indentured servants". Whether you believe it or not that's EXACTLY what this is going to be, perhaps not a "slave" but ABSOLUTELY an "indentured servant". In fact, does the 13th amendment address "indentured servants" in any way? Talk about a constitutional loophole for corporations and government to exploit, bringing back a type of defacto-slavery.

Not sure why there's this belief that the elite will be altruistic enough to share a technology that allows them to potentially maintain control and power indefinitely.

They would certainly use military to test it before taking the risk thenselves but as far as making it available to everybody in some strange act of benevolence that evolves all of humanity; I just find it a bit naive and implausible.

Rupturing The Nanotech Rapture

Biological nanobots could repair and improve the human body, but they'll be more bio than bot
How to usher humanity into an era of transhumanist bliss: first, end scarcity. Second, eradicate death. Third, eliminate the bungled mechanisms that introduce imperfections into the human body. The vehicle for accomplishing all three? Molecular nanotechnology--in essence, the reduction of all material things to the status of software.
spectrum.ieee.org...

If we could just nanosize our technology and integrate it via biochips. . . . .

originally posted by: MagnaCarta2015
Not sure why there's this belief that the elite will be altruistic enough to share a technology that allows them to potentially maintain control and power indefinitely.

They would certainly use military to test it before taking the risk thenselves but as far as making it available to everybody in some strange act of benevolence that evolves all of humanity; I just find it a bit naive and implausible

I completely agree and the early civilian grade cyborg tech, that will be available on the mass market, will CERTAINLY be the kind that binds people to government policy and/or corporate interests.

For example, the first "cyborg tech" that will likely be available to normal people will be the "brain cell phone". Your employer will be able to track you anywhere you are, monitor your behavior (are you smoking, drinking, not exercising, etc), call you in the middle of the night, knowing for sure that you ignored the call and advertisers will be able to directly market to you inside your brain (and I doubt you'll be able to shut it off, just like "Kindle Special Offers").

This tech will be a living nightmare for normal wage slaves and contract employees subbing for big corps. It will not be the transcending "Ghost in the Shell" experience, that EVERYONE seems to be imagining.

originally posted by: boohoo

originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: boohoo

What happens when the soldier leaves service?
Initially a true cyborg would not be able to leave service as none exist outside of it.
So legally. They would own you.
For public safety.
Terminal testing,great life.

Well they could just remove your military upgrades and you are left with a civvie model. I dont think slavery would fly well.And if cyborg tech becomes prevalent you will see cyber police as well as regular cops keeping cyborgs and regulars in line. AP rounds will become standard issue to when that happens.

You are completely FOOLING yourself, its not going to work that way at all, take the time to read the articles I posted on "indentured servants". Whether you believe it or not that's EXACTLY what this is going to be, perhaps not a "slave" but ABSOLUTELY an "indentured servant". In fact, does the 13th amendment address "indentured servants" in any way? Talk about a constitutional loophole for corporations and government to exploit, bringing back a type of defacto-slavery.

So no diferent than it is right now then correct? Its funny you are so scared of this technology ill gladly give up this meatsack if i can instantly change my gender to something fitting of my brain. I woudnt even care if i had to become a whore to do it.

originally posted by: yuppa
So no diferent than it is right now then correct? Its funny you are so scared of this technology ill gladly give up this meatsack if i can instantly change my gender to something fitting of my brain. I woudnt even care if i had to become a whore to do it.

Than you are the enemy, whom is empowering the "Owners of Capital" ability to further put the screws into the general population, controlling their every thought and action. Your beliefs only strengthens Corporatist supported Fascism and neo-feudalistic policy. I'll bet that you are among the USA populace that prefer "having the legal option to form dynasties" based on inherited wealth, as well, even though NONE of those people will EVER acquire enough wealth to take advantage of such a legal situation.

I am not afraid of technology, I have chosen to fight for my humanity against the tide of people like yourself whom have chosen to "drink the Kool-Aid". If battle lines are ever drawn, I will fight without fear against those like yourself. The reality is that those whom want to rely on this technology and replace their flesh with "corporate controlled products" are the ones whom deep down are truly afraid and what they are afraid of, is "choice".

originally posted by: boohoo

originally posted by: yuppa
So no diferent than it is right now then correct? Its funny you are so scared of this technology ill gladly give up this meatsack if i can instantly change my gender to something fitting of my brain. I woudnt even care if i had to become a whore to do it.

Than you are the enemy, whom is empowering the "Owners of Capital" ability to further put the screws into the general population, controlling their every though and action. Your beliefs only strengthens Corporatist supported Fascism and neo-feudalistic policy. I'll bet that you are among the USA populace that prefer "having the legal option to form dynasties" based on inherited wealth, as well, even though NONE of those people will EVER acquire enough wealth to take advantage of such a legal situation.

I am not afraid of technology, I have chosen to fight for my humanity against the tide of people like yourself whom have chosen to "drink the Kool-Aid". If battle lines are ever drawn, I will fight without fear against those like yourself. The reality is that those whom want to rely on this technology and replace their flesh with "corporate controlled products" are the ones whom deep down are truly afraid and what they are afraid of, is "choice".

Wrong F corporations and gimmie my nanotech, I wants it and I wants it free!

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord
Wrong F corporations and gimmie my nanotech, I wants it and I wants it free!

Who do think will sell and distribute, commercially available, "nanotech"? Yes, its all "corporate controlled products", but the difference between it and the one we consume now, is that the "Owners of Capital" will be able to order your "full cyborg body" to do something against your will or shut down your life sustaining nanotech remotely. Currently you just lose cell service, electricity or internet; in the future your body will just be shut down instead.

What a completely stupid choice people will soon be making. I guess some idiot has to be the first example for others to learn the real consequences.

originally posted by: boohoo

originally posted by: yuppa
So no diferent than it is right now then correct? Its funny you are so scared of this technology ill gladly give up this meatsack if i can instantly change my gender to something fitting of my brain. I woudnt even care if i had to become a whore to do it.

Than you are the enemy, whom is empowering the "Owners of Capital" ability to further put the screws into the general population, controlling their every thought and action. Your beliefs only strengthens Corporatist supported Fascism and neo-feudalistic policy. I'll bet that you are among the USA populace that prefer "having the legal option to form dynasties" based on inherited wealth, as well, even though NONE of those people will EVER acquire enough wealth to take advantage of such a legal situation.

I am not afraid of technology, I have chosen to fight for my humanity against the tide of people like yourself whom have chosen to "drink the Kool-Aid". If battle lines are ever drawn, I will fight without fear against those like yourself. The reality is that those whom want to rely on this technology and replace their flesh with "corporate controlled products" are the ones whom deep down are truly afraid and what they are afraid of, is "choice".

Now who is acting like a enemy here? Its my CHOICE to change myself. I "choose" it so you are flat wrong on me being afraid to make a choice for myself. did I say i want to rely on the corporations? No i didnt actually. And Im sorry but if we ever get into a battle like that ill snipe you from across the street.

You do know The anti machine cultist in Deus ex machina. The evolution of cyber technology(non AI controlled) were also spouting the same rhetoric as well.

Are you are a socialist who despises anything capitalist?? Also how dare you accuse me of being in favor of economic slavery? I like people having choices. IN a true capitalist society there is no bail outs or corporate wellfare. This current one isnt perfect but its a darn sight better than Russias or Chinas.
Your post is borderline TnC violations up and down with your Slanderous accusations as well..

Oh i forgot to add that There will be laws forbidding a remote shut down of a Cyborg body due to it would equal false imprisonment. See for your vision to work th econstitution will have to be gone.

originally posted by: yuppa
did I say i want to rely on the corporations? No i didnt actually.

Your post is borderline TnC violations up and down with your Slanderous accusations as well..

Oh i forgot to add that There will be laws forbidding a remote shut down of a Cyborg body due to it would equal false imprisonment. See for your vision to work th econstitution will have to be gone.

So somehow you are going to be designing and manufacturing your own nanotech and prosthesis? Who is going to do your surgery to install it, your neighbor? Make no mistake, you are ABSOLUTELY going to be relying on corporations if you go through this kind of "transformation".

People chose to support the Fascists in Italy and Germany as well, just because the American version is typically a corporate CEO, doesn't change the fact that you are supporting your own demise by purchasing and relying on this technology to replace your flesh with "corporate controlled products". You and your kind are no different than the "Association of German Industrialists" that donated $3 million Reichsmarks to the Nazi Party in 1933.

As I said, your defacto enthusiasm for this tech makes you an enemy of freedom because lining the pockets of the "Owners of Capital" in this fashion only hastens your "indentured servitude" and eventually forces others to buy it as well, when it becomes a base job requirement.

Do you know ANYTHING about the law in regards to "Durable medical equipment" because that's EXACTLY how "full cyborg" is going to be classified under the law? E-constitution? You are in dreamland, the "owners of capital" will never allow such a thing to evolve. Also as I suspected you are among those that prefer "having the legal option to form dynasties" based on inherited wealth, even though NONE of your kind will EVER acquire enough wealth to take advantage of such a legal situation.

a reply to: boohoo

This is potentially the begining of the end of humanity, not just as we know it but the actual end of us as a species forever; there can't be any turning back once we go down that path. I don't think people realise the gravity of it at all.

Kurzweil is a lunatic and quite possibly the most dangerous human being that ever walked the earth.

I am just going to leave these two links here for people who are interested in joining an organization I belong to which advocates for some of the technologies talked about in this thread:

humanityplus.org...
hplusmagazine.com...

a reply to: TrueBrit

The day is not coming. For all intents and purposes, it has arrived.

And it came much faster then we anticipated.

I saw a documentary when I was in school where a scientist talked about a 'quickening' where in the future technology advances so quickly we could not keep up with the latest developments. I can't recall the mans name or profession but he his prediction was eerily precise.

Utopian vision: Everyone gets to participate in the upgrades, both biological and mechanical.

Dystopian path 1: Only people deemed desirable get to participate, the rest are targeted for soft-kill (kind of like people are today).

Dystopian path 2: Everyone but the elite are done away with through release of a weaponized pathogen.

Does not necessarily look good for the Walmart feeding masses in either dystopian possibility.

originally posted by: JadeStar
I am just going to leave these two links here for people who are interested in joining an organization I belong to which advocates for some of the technologies talked about in this thread:

humanityplus.org...
hplusmagazine.com...

Ill join these groups lets make a free transhumanist future for those who want it F the haters!

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

originally posted by: JadeStar
I am just going to leave these two links here for people who are interested in joining an organization I belong to which advocates for some of the technologies talked about in this thread:

humanityplus.org...
hplusmagazine.com...

Ill join these groups lets make a free transhumanist future for those who want it F the haters!

I really have been shy about posting transhumanist things on ATS or even telling anyone I am a transhumanist. Because in my experience transhumanism is so misunderstood that it's really scary to a lot of people. The aim of organizations like Humanity+ and the Long Now Foundation, etc is to educate people about things such as the positive impact of such potentially disruptive technology.

Every new technology has had a positive and negative side but people have a fear of the unknown which has evolved over many millennia. So I understand the negative reactions. I just would hope fear turns into curiosity, and curiosity turns into inquiry and inquiry educates more people about the benefits of a common future where the organic and the synthetic can co-exist and thrive.

It's just a hard subject to talk with people about because they automatically have been pre-programmed by a lot of sci-fi dystopian futures like Blade Runner, Terminator, Elysium, etc. I wish they would make more positive sci-fi which incorporates transhumanist ideals. Oh well, perhaps in the future?

FYI: I've had more negativity thrown my way from telling a person I was a transhumanist than telling them I was transsexual.