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Armenians have lost faith in Russia

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posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 05:05 PM
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Armenians have lost faith in Russia


After more than a week of sustained protests over increasing electricity prices, Armenian activists have demonstrated a new sense of empowerment in the face of an increasingly embattled government. But it is actually the broader implications of this unrest in Armenia that is much more significant, for two distinct reasons.

First, although this wave of protests is clearly rooted in a set of underlying problems reflecting the unique socioeconomic and political conditions of Armenia, the discontent and dissent in Armenia have already reverberated well beyond the borders of this small, landlocked country.

More specifically, the trajectory of the protests have already exceeded the confines of the initial focus of anger over the Armenian government's decision to impose a price rise for electricity.

The fact that it was a price rise that was sought by a Russian-owned energy firm in Armenia sparked a renewed sense of outrage over Russia's general arrogance towards Armenia.

Reliable partner

For years, Armenia stood alone in the South Caucasus as the only reliable partner for Russia in the region. Armenia is the host of the only Russian military base in the region. This partnership also included ceding control of two of Armenia's borders to Russian border guards.

And beyond even that basic infringement on sovereignty, the terms of the Russian military base agreement are rather insulting, as the host government not only forgoes any "rental" payment for the land, but is also required to incur all operating costs of the base itself.


Click link for remainder of article...

Looks like more trouble ahead for Russian leadership in their "alliance".

The increase in electric prices is a direct result of a Russian energy company wanting the price increase.
Russia maintains 2 military bases in the country but the terms requires Armenia to pay for all cost of the bases while also exempting Russia from making rental payments.
Russia controls 2 borders in Armenia with Russian border police deployed instead of Armenian.
Russia refused to allow the Russian conscript who murdered an Armenian family to be tried in Armenia, although that has now changed.
Russia supplies weapons to Azerbaijan who is using those weapons to attack Armenia while at the same time Russia refuses to honor its commitments to defend Armenia from aggression.




posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 05:29 PM
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How long until somebody pops in to explain how this is the U.S.'s fault?

"Not long" would be my bet




posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 06:49 PM
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originally posted by: Shamrock6
How long until somebody pops in to explain how this is the U.S.'s fault?

"Not long" would be my bet



Someone already tried in another thread when they blamed the US for the high energy prices in Armenia.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 06:55 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Of course. Why didn't I realize that?

*eyeroll*



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 07:05 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

If only the almighty BRICS would step in with their economic/military/technological/intellectual/etc superiority. Then all problems would be solved.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 07:30 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Azerbaijan has a deal with Turkey/Europe to supply gas.

توافق آذربایجان و ترکیه برای صادرات گاز "شاه دنیز" به اروپا
Azerbaijan and Turkey agreed to export gas "Shah Deniz" to Europe

آذربایجان و ترکیه برای احداث خط لوله گازی از مسیر آذربایجان، گرجستان برای اتصال به خط لوله گاز اروپا به توافق رسیدند. براساس این توافق آذربایجان به ترکیه سالانه 6 میلیون متر مکعب گاز

Azerbaijan and Turkey to build a pipeline through Azerbaijan, Georgia agreed to connect Europe gas pipeline. Under the agreement, Azerbaijan to Turkey annually 6 million cubic meters of gas

www.ecopetronews.com...

It's scheduled for 2017 it seems. It would be easier all round for big business if it went straight through Armenia.
edit on 5-7-2015 by EA006 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 07:34 PM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Xcathdra

If only the almighty BRICS would step in with their economic/military/technological/intellectual/etc superiority. Then all problems would be solved.


Well apparently there are issues on the BRICS front as well -

ATS Thread - China Intensifies Steps to End $3.2 Trillion Stock Rout
edit on 5-7-2015 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 07:36 PM
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a reply to: EA006


I don't think it has to do with supply but rather price. The same thing just happened to Ukraine this last week as well, with Russia stating they could no longer give Ukraine a discounted price due to the price of oil on the world market.


More specifically, the trajectory of the protests have already exceeded the confines of the initial focus of anger over the Armenian government's decision to impose a price rise for electricity.

The fact that it was a price rise that was sought by a Russian-owned energy firm in Armenia sparked a renewed sense of outrage over Russia's general arrogance towards Armenia.



edit on 5-7-2015 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 07:50 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

dunno what happened.

edit on 5-7-2015 by EA006 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 08:48 PM
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I found this comment in the link .


Google RSC. Look at their about page.
Mr. Giragosian's employment history makes it quite clear where the cash is coming from, and who he's shilling for. His association with RFE/RFL is the least concerning. The rest of RSC's staff isn't much better.

There's nothing political or anti-Russian about these protests, there never was, no matter how much the pro-West shills wish reality were different. But that's how it works, doesn't it. You can't peddle lies at home, so take advantage of the language barrier and peddle lies overseas.

I like how there's no mention of the sale of the formerly state-owned Vorotan hydroelectricity Cascade to ContourGlobal, an American company -- in a sale that former president Kocharian has repeatedly condemned as illegal -- or that Contour, out of nowhere raised its operating costs, thus forcing a price hike.

ENA owns the energy grid, not the power generation. ENA has been running at a loss for some time, and ENA's parent company has signaled its willingness to sell -- either to one of a number of Russo-Armenian billionaires, or to the Armenian government.

there's no mention that with the Hydro damns operating costs increased, and the nuclear plant operating with only one turbine and with only enough uranium to last through 2016, Armenia, being a small, resource-starved, landlocked country has to import fuel. Gas is sold in USD, the Dram depreciated from 382:1 vs the dollar to 472:1 over the past year, yeah, it thermal energy is going to be more expensive that it was.

Nice choice of picture, too. Water canons sell the lie much better than the images of singing, dancing, srink-playing and protestor vs police chess and football matches those of us who follow Armenian news have been seeing (yes, the water canons happened on the first day, it's shamelessly dishonest to peddle the false image that this remained the case).

Where the Gyumri military base is concerned, Mr. Giragosian's assessment is quite misleading. It is used by Armenian armed forces as well, and it is what keeps the frozen conflict with Azerbaijan frozen. There's no mention of Armenia's CSTO membership (for the non former-Soviets, that's more or less the post-Soviet space's NATO). War with Armenia is war with Russia, neither Azerbaijan, nor Turkey with its NATO backing will risk that. And this is pretty much the penultimate representation of the relationship between Armenia and Russia, both historically and today.

While it is factually true that Russia guards two of our borders, those are the closed borders with Turkey and Azerbaijan/Nakhichevan.

It was Russia that liberated Armenia from the Persian Empire. It was Armenia's status as a protectorate of the Rossiyskaya Imperiya that spared Eastern Armenians from the fate of their Western Armenian brothers and sisters (extermination and exile by Ottoman hands). It was Sovietization which dragged our 99% agrarian backwater anachronism of a Motherland kicking and screaming into the 20th century, transforming it into a regional industrial powerhouse. It is Russian-built infrastructure and Russian investment which keeps the country going, Russian Migs that protect our skies, and our alliances with our Russian brothers and sisters which guarantees our country's and our people's continued existence.

For better or for worse, Armenia is married to Russia. they are as vital to our security interests as we are to theirs, in providing a buffer space protecting its vulnerable underbelly. The loudest voices calling for Yerevan to distance itself from Moscow come from Baku and Ankara. Armenians know this and won't fall for it, the English speaking world tends not to (never mind understanding the implications), and that's what Mr. Giragosian and friends are counting on.

Inb4 "herpa derp derp Russian troll". I'm Armenian, I love my people, I love my country, and I won't let shills put words in our mouths.

Grnank martavari tsev'ov irar knossil, iraganoutiamp. Yet'e ayn bayman soud khossik, garevor pan me chpouneek essellou.
could be . don't know .



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 09:38 PM
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Armenia has sniffed around the EU and NATO before but, they have one big problem with leaving. Azerbaijan along with its good buddies Turkey and Georgia would crush that Russian backed enclave that both Armenia and Azerbaijan claim. Frankly unless they can settle that they simply can not afford to leave Russia no matter what. Then again being tied to Russia ls like trying to swim across a lake a with rock tied to your leg. So they might bolt and hope for the best. If you Russia your just not in a good place Ukraine, Azerbaijan, Moldova and Georgia have all made it clear they are done with Russia. Belarus is creeping away and Armenia looks to try as well. And in the East Russia has lost it trade dominance and a lot of influence to China who is set to completely take those states away from Russia. The Russia nights must be getting lonely.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 10:01 PM
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originally posted by: MrSpad
Armenia has sniffed around the EU and NATO before but, they have one big problem with leaving. Azerbaijan along with its good buddies Turkey and Georgia would crush that Russian backed enclave that both Armenia and Azerbaijan claim. Frankly unless they can settle that they simply can not afford to leave Russia no matter what. Then again being tied to Russia ls like trying to swim across a lake a with rock tied to your leg. So they might bolt and hope for the best. If you Russia your just not in a good place Ukraine, Azerbaijan, Moldova and Georgia have all made it clear they are done with Russia. Belarus is creeping away and Armenia looks to try as well. And in the East Russia has lost it trade dominance and a lot of influence to China who is set to completely take those states away from Russia. The Russia nights must be getting lonely.


MrSpad, In your opinion, does Russia know any other way than by force to reverse this tide? It would seem to me (and I dont know anything) but in order for them to function and Putin to live through those lonely nights, they are going to have to stop sanctions becuase as more countries move away and say joint NATO or the EU then that is effectively even more economic sanctions on Russia.

Add to that China taking a slice of the pie Russia seems to be becoming more and more weak.

So the only way to stop sanctions and open the market is either they back down and let these states go and accept they need to be "nice" to play in Europe which would leave them with egg on their face - or they do something else?

I cant see South America being a lucrative partnership and I know many countries investing in South America, Chile for one I am actively involved in.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 11:30 PM
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a reply to: Forensick

Putin wont back down and is going to be a casualty of his own ego.

All the propaganda Russian media has put out makes it look like Putin is fighting Nazis and boogeymen whose goal is to occupy Russia. If Putin takes an "exit ramp" it can be viewed as Putin losing to the boogeyman and the Nazis.

I think this is why Putin has been making the threats. He is hoping it enough for the West to do nothing.

I think the West called his bluff.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 11:37 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Thanks for AlJezira links

I don't consider them worthy of reading.

You posting about electricity price and Armenia sounds very trying.

If you want to bash Russia there are plenty of other ways to do it, Armenia Electricity thing is weak.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 11:38 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 11:43 PM
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a reply to: PredatorCrackling

Here is an idea...

Post info to support what you are saying instead of launching personal attacks. If you are so confident in what you are saying then you should be able to provide us with the sources to read it for ourselves.

I see you recently joined the site.. welcome

edit on 5-7-2015 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 11:54 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

You do realise that Putin has 40 brand new nukes

And here you are writing about Armenia and electrical prices from Russia

If I wanted to bash Russia I would focus on bigger stuff.



posted on Jul, 6 2015 @ 12:21 AM
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originally posted by: Forensick

originally posted by: MrSpad
Armenia has sniffed around the EU and NATO before but, they have one big problem with leaving. Azerbaijan along with its good buddies Turkey and Georgia would crush that Russian backed enclave that both Armenia and Azerbaijan claim. Frankly unless they can settle that they simply can not afford to leave Russia no matter what. Then again being tied to Russia ls like trying to swim across a lake a with rock tied to your leg. So they might bolt and hope for the best. If you Russia your just not in a good place Ukraine, Azerbaijan, Moldova and Georgia have all made it clear they are done with Russia. Belarus is creeping away and Armenia looks to try as well. And in the East Russia has lost it trade dominance and a lot of influence to China who is set to completely take those states away from Russia. The Russia nights must be getting lonely.


MrSpad, In your opinion, does Russia know any other way than by force to reverse this tide? It would seem to me (and I dont know anything) but in order for them to function and Putin to live through those lonely nights, they are going to have to stop sanctions becuase as more countries move away and say joint NATO or the EU then that is effectively even more economic sanctions on Russia.

Add to that China taking a slice of the pie Russia seems to be becoming more and more weak.

So the only way to stop sanctions and open the market is either they back down and let these states go and accept they need to be "nice" to play in Europe which would leave them with egg on their face - or they do something else?

I cant see South America being a lucrative partnership and I know many countries investing in South America, Chile for one I am actively involved in.



I do not know what Russia can do. Ideally it would allow those nations to join the EU so they could grow their economies and improve trade for Russia. However, Russia sees that a losing control of those states. It has nothing to offer them thus the the threats and military actions. It really comes down Russia accepting being just another nation and not a world power. Until that happens even without sanctions Russia is in a bad way long term.



posted on Jul, 6 2015 @ 12:26 AM
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originally posted by: PredatorCrackling
a reply to: MrSpad

Complete bias and propaganda as usual.

Just like when you talk about ISIS and how they created themselves out of nowhere LOLZ


You have that backwards. I can give ISIS long history from its start in Jordan in 1999 until now. You seem to think somebody like the CIA or NATO or lizard people created them out of nowhere. In that and this you bring no facts and nothing to back any of it up. If you think Armenia is happy with the way things are then you have to ignore the words and actions of Armenians and instead go ask the Russians to tell you how Armenia really feels.



posted on Jul, 6 2015 @ 01:08 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



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