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Greece votes 'no' to EU bail out - GREXIT?

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posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 02:58 PM
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a reply to: theabsolutetruth

The Greeks caused the problem themselves.

They now have to live with the consequences.




posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 02:59 PM
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originally posted by: ColCurious

Greece had their 50% debt haircut and debt buy-backs from private holders of Greek gov. bonds too.
Just saying.

Also, the claim brought up by Theodoros Pangalos about the stolen Greek gold has long been rebutted.
Investigations showed that the gold was in fact brought to the island of Crete first, in the spring of 1941, and then to Alexandria in Egypt... from there it was taken to Pretoria and then to London where the Bank of England kept it for the Greeks. After the war, the gold was returned to Athens.
Just saying.



Wrong the gold they took was a forced loan from occupied Greece.


How much has Germany paid?
Berlin paid 115m Deutschmarks to Athens in 1960 in compensation. It was a fraction of the Greek demand but was made with the agreement there would be no more claims. Greece says the 1960 deal did not cover key demands, including payments for damaged infrastructure, war crimes and the return of a forced loan exacted from occupied Greece. Germany insists the issue of compensation was settled in 1990 legally and politically before Germany reunified and has questioned why Greece did not negotiate when it entered the eurozone.
How much does Greece still want?
The new figure of €278.7bn was given by Greek Deputy Finance Minister Dimitris Mardas on 6 April. It was based on calculations by Greece's General Accounting Office. That total includes €10.3bn that Greece wants as compensation for the forced loan that the Nazis extorted from the Bank of Greece. An earlier estimate of the Greek compensation demand, based on a leak, was different. It estimated the claim at up to €162bn: that is, €108bn for destroyed infrastructure and €54bn for the forced loan.
How could the money be reclaimed?
The Supreme Court ruling in 2000 allowed for German-owned property to be seized as compensation, though it was never acted on by the then Justice Minister Michalis Stathopoulos. Among possible assets are property belonging to Germany's archaeological school and the Goethe Institute, a cultural association.
www.bbc.com...

Of course corrupted politicians of the past made sure not to touch the subject or make the previous light agreements with Germany at the expense of their own country with personal consideration for their service to the banksters

The point is European Union was created after World War 2 to prevent it happening again,
It was made protect the European people, and not the Banks, and the private organization's interests.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:06 PM
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originally posted by: SubTruth

Germany is nothing more than a proxy for the real power........The banks.


Totally agree. Many if not most Germans are actually opposite to their governments actions, and sympathize with Greece

The debt is used as a weapon in this case to occupy countries without wars.
Occupied Not by other Nations, but by private organizations!



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:06 PM
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originally posted by: GBP/JPY
yep, I'm an expert on this from a currency war viewpoint....agreed....they should run like basturds.....make a new democracy with Iclandic banking rules of conduct....with several public watchdogs

one chance at it here...leave out the central money anything.....small government is natural and more cost effective





Iceland is doing the right things keeping banking in check and out of the government........BUT. It is much easier for them because the country has such a low population with little diversity.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:09 PM
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originally posted by: Dr1Akula

originally posted by: SubTruth

Germany is nothing more than a proxy for the real power........The banks.


Totally agree. Many if not most Germans are actually opposite to their governments actions, and sympathize with Greece

The debt is used as a weapon in this case to occupy countries without wars.
Occupied Not by other Nations, but by private organizations!





TPTB use debt based systems and fiat currencies for control and enslavement. Many do not want to hear this but it is also the the truth.......TPTB also push progressive ideals in schools and the media because it creates a population that becomes dependent on the host for existence. The masses will win out and this leads down a slippery slope into outright tyranny.
edit on 5-7-2015 by SubTruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:13 PM
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There won't be an immediate exit if at all, there is no constitutional basis for it, so this buys them time.

Germany and Greece need to negotiate the removal of harsh debt relief, wiping out the repayment until 40 years away, just as Greece allowed Germany to do in 46. Austerity is the worst idea any country can agree to, then finally they need restructure the growth infrastructures, bridges and roads etc, put people to work, government projects full steam ahead if private enterprise has flown Greece.

Germany is kinda implying Greeks are lazy and useless children who need to get their shizz together, all whilst putting their steel boot to their neck saying "we are doing this for you."

Clear the debt for 40 years. Greece is in MORE debt than when they went into recession.

Germany needs to remember when they were decimated after doing you know invasions and genocide, Greece cleared their debt.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:18 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: theabsolutetruth

The Greeks caused the problem themselves.

They now have to live with the consequences.


This is like accusing a rape victim, of provoking his rapist!

Don't be offended when the IMF comes to your door to make make you and your family slaves, and someone else tells you the same.

Goldman Sacks helped Greece to Enter the Euro with Fake statistics,
They used corrupted politicians to give them loans that went to bailout the banks and only 11% went to social benefits that very few Greeks benefited, just to gain voters. 3 of those politicians are already in Jail, The number punished is small because the Justice System is also corrupted and worked close with the previous governments. Just do a research about how big corruption is in Greek parliament and the scandals provoked by Siemens, and German weapons industry and then tell me if Greeks caused their problems themselves!



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:26 PM
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a reply to: Dr1Akula

Let me see if I understand, the vast majority of Greek politicians are corrupt according to you, but the financial crisis is not the Greek's fault.

Whose fault is it that their politicians are corrupt, Zimbabwe's?



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:30 PM
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a reply to: Dr1Akula

Tax evasion is a national sport in Greece.





Tax evasion and corruption is a problem in Greece.[1][2] Tax evasion has been described by Greek politicians as "a national sport"—with up to €30 billion per year going uncollected.[3]


en.wikipedia.org...

I will say it again.

The Greeks caused the problem themselves. No one else is to blame.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:33 PM
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originally posted by: zazzafrazz
There won't be an immediate exit if at all, there is no constitutional basis for it, so this buys them time.

Germany and Greece need to negotiate the removal of harsh debt relief, wiping out the repayment until 40 years away, just as Greece allowed Germany to do in 46. Austerity is the worst idea any country can agree to, then finally they need restructure the growth infrastructures, bridges and roads etc, put people to work, government projects full steam ahead if private enterprise has flown Greece.

Germany is kinda implying Greeks are lazy and useless children who need to get their shizz together, all whilst putting their steel boot to their neck saying "we are doing this for you."

Clear the debt for 40 years. Greece is in MORE debt than when they went into recession.

Germany needs to remember when they were decimated after doing you know invasions and genocide, Greece cleared their debt.






Did I miss the war or something.......Greece is not decimated and does not need to be rebuilt. What they need to do is re-write the constitution and have it revolved around individual rights. This should be a clear wake call for progressive voters........These ideals fail and will continue to do so in the future. If you put the rights of the masses first the country will eventually fail under it's own weight.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:33 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

By this logic Hitler's actions, was the the German people's fault



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:34 PM
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originally posted by: Dr1Akula
By this logic Hitler's actions, was the the German people's fault.


You are damn right it was their fault.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:37 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Dr1Akula

Tax evasion is a national sport in Greece.





Tax evasion and corruption is a problem in Greece.[1][2] Tax evasion has been described by Greek politicians as "a national sport"—with up to €30 billion per year going uncollected.[3]


en.wikipedia.org...

I will say it again.

The Greeks caused the problem themselves. No one else is to blame.


The ~ 300+ billions of debt wasn't created by tax evasion. Fact

I am not saying there are not corrupted Greek people of course there are
These evidence come out as late as the debt made public, coincidence? I don't think so...



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:42 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Dr1Akula

Tax evasion is a national sport in Greece.





Tax evasion and corruption is a problem in Greece.[1][2] Tax evasion has been described by Greek politicians as "a national sport"—with up to €30 billion per year going uncollected.[3]



en.wikipedia.org...



I will say it again.

The Greeks caused the problem themselves. No one else is to blame.


If Tax avoidance is now being classed as a sport the UK would be World Champions on a regular basis. Everyone avoids as much tax as possible. Lets not point the finger here.
UK Tax avoidance estimate for 2013/14 £119bn and rising

edit on 5-7-2015 by Soloprotocol because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:43 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: theabsolutetruth

The Greeks caused the problem themselves.

They now have to live with the consequences.





The cost of immigration did for Greece, just as much as the welfare and taxation systems did. However, this is hardly ever mentioned in the MSM. Greece is a gateway to Europe from the M.E and North Africa, they really struggled to financially support the numbers coming in. The E.U did very little to support them with the swelling numbers and are using Greece as an example to other countries on the precipice, so they focus on the Welfare and taxation systems of Greece.

The articles posted as sources in the O.P are nothing but propaganda on behalf of TPTB who do not want the Euro to collapse, let alone the entire E.U. I expect we will see an awful lot more scaremongering between now and our own referendum on membership of the E.U.

Fair play to the Greek people, bring back the Drachma and re-open those closed Tavernas in the previously packed resorts. The Rusiians are coming and they have plenty of money with them.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:43 PM
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a reply to: SubTruth

No it isn't decimated (other than financially) but public works needs to be a focus to generate employment and internal spend for goods and services.

How do you think they can rewrite their constitution around individual rights when they bankrupt. They still have to pay back the debt. The debt needs to be cleared or pushed off 40 years, until then they can write all the constitutional words they want, but that won't stop creditors stranglehold on them



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:43 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Ok yes I agree... and mine and your governments possible detestable abhorrence actions that we don't know about yet are also our fault.

The big questions is do you call this morally justifiable?

Then again morality isn't the main priority of our economy... right?



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:46 PM
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a reply to: Dr1Akula

I will repeat it yet again. The Greeks caused their own problems




The International Monetary Fund and Greece’s other creditors have argued for years that the country’s debt crisis could be largely resolved if the government just cracked down on tax evasion.


www.wsj.com...



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:48 PM
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originally posted by: zazzafrazz
a reply to: SubTruth

No it isn't decimated (other than financially) but public works needs to be a focus to generate employment and internal spend for goods and services.

How do you think they can rewrite their constitution around individual rights when they bankrupt. They still have to pay back the debt. The debt needs to be cleared or pushed off 40 years, until then they can write all the constitutional words they want, but that won't stop creditors stranglehold on them





Actually they could default on the debt give a big middle finger to the banks re-write the constitution and focus it around individual rights.


What do you think happened during the American revolution.......Big middle finger about past debts and taxes.......Re-write the constitution focused around individual rights.



posted on Jul, 5 2015 @ 03:50 PM
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a reply to: Soloprotocol

Yes tax evasions happens in all countries to different degrees.

However Britain in not running to The European Central Bank for loans, is it?

Greece is.




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