Finally caught a spirit on camera today!

a reply to: Watrhous

Great first post......

errr....


Got any theory to put forward on your light anomaly?
Otherwise that was just a hit and run.

a reply to: NephraTari

You are most incorrect. Many tribes have and had shamans and the title was given to me by an Elder shaman in my tribe when I was a teen.

I politely disagree. Shamanism comes from the indigenous people of the East, and it was only through an unfortunate bastardization of the Native culture that Shamanism, and the title of 'shaman', found it's way in to the language and practices of the Native Americans. There are some tribes to the north (Alaska) that practiced a form of Shamanism, but they are not considered to be a Native American tribe.

The modern state of shamanism, within the Native American culture, was injected through New Age philosophies and beliefs. The term is also used incorrectly to describe 'healers' or spiritual leaders by those outside of the Native culture (anthropologists) to describe the role these people play in the tribe. You can call them a shaman, but a shaman they are not.

Back to the title of Shaman, it is not a name I gave myself. I am not a new ager that sought out shamanism. I was born a natural shaman. This was explained to me at the time.

Very well. That being the case, it's possible the person who gave you that title and told you that you were a natural shaman was taken in by the new-age shaman bastardization.

Trauma doesn't change reality

Yes it does.Psychological trauma can cause people to believe and act in a way that is not rooted in reality and creates a false world around them in order to cope with the trauma they experienced.

If you don't mind me asking, do you believe that you see UFO's on a consistent basis and have you ever been abducted?

a reply to: introvert

Shamanism was a part of native culture in some areas.
This is from Tlingit culture although the shaman was not called a shaman as they had their own word for it:

Shamanism The shaman is called ixht'.

He was the healer, and the one who foretold the future. He was called upon to heal the sick, drive out those who practiced witchcraft, and tell the future.

It is a mis-nomer to call him "witch doctor" as the practices of the ixht' and the "witch" are completely different and they were at odds with each other. To call one a medicine man is not correct either as "medicine master" is naak'w s'aati, which is the Tlingit term for a witch.

The name of the ixht' and his songs and stories of his visions are the property of the clan he belongs to. He would seek spirit helpers from various animals and after fasting for four days when the animal would 'stand up in front of him' before entering him he would obtain the spirit. The tongue of the animal would be cut out and added to his collection of spirit helpers. This is why he was referred to by some as "the spirit man". Future shamans would be chosen before their birth by the elders of a Tlingit community. The elders knew about people and what they would be before they were born. The boy training to become a shaman would be told how to approach the grave and how to handle the objects.

Touching shaman objects was strictly forbidden except to a shaman and his helpers. In fact, the elders had a word solely for the instance when a child tried to touch or play with a shaman's objects. The word carried a heavy tone and that was all that needed to be said. All shamans are gone from the Tlingit today and their practices will likely never be revived, although shaman spirit songs are still done in their ceremonies, and their stories re-told at those times.

en.wikipedia.org...

So they do and did exist although no longer in my native half's culture,
but perhaps in the genetic coding they are still there...



As to childhood trauma, I would like to hear more, but I also understand that just because a person has a different view due to trauma, it does not necessarily make it untrue. To dismiss someone because they had a rough childhood is a very bad mistake as not everyone goes psychotic, and some do go psychic.
But then, I guess one would have to believe that ESP and the spirit world is possible to begin with.

a reply to: Darkblade71

If you read my previous post, I included a caveat for Alaskan tribes, as they did practice forms of shamanism. They are not considered Native American tribes and no other forms of practice can be found within Native tribes as shamanism was not part of the culture.

The only mention of shamanism is US Native tribes is sourced from anthropologists that cannot find a better term to use, or by the injection of New-Age philosophies in to the tribal culture.

As to childhood trauma, I would like to hear more, but I also understand that just because a person has a different view due to trauma, it does not necessarily make it untrue. To dismiss someone because they had a rough childhood is a very bad mistake as not everyone goes psychotic, and some do go psychic.

It goes well beyond having a different view of the world due to a traumatic event. Sometimes people that have been severely traumatized can build a "false world" around them in which they believe certain things are true or are happening to them in order to rationalize or block-out that traumatic experience.

Within the New-Age/UFO community we can see many instances where the culture one surrounds themselves with provides a convenient source from which to create that "block" they need to continue on with life without addressing the underlying damage done by the traumatic event.

a reply to: introvert

Wow, I must of just blazed over the Alaskan part,
my bad.

Thanks for the reply,
it explains a little better what angle you are coming from.



I know what you are talking about with the title of Shaman and native culture as not that long ago I read where some natives are taking offense to the claiming of NA shamanism. I cannot speak for either side on that as I was once told I am the 7th reincarnation of a shaman's apprentice from Africa...so I am on a totally different continent lol
although at times I do feel the Tlingit within.

I'll tell you what though, as I deal with paranormal things within my own life somewhat regularly, I can understand and I do wonder what it is NephraTari's family caught on video. If it is a bug, light reflection, spirit, dustball,whatever it is,
I want to know all angles on the images.

It is only a matter of time before people start to get really good evidence, is this it?
With something like this, we may never know because there is no way to prove it is any of these things in such a way as to make everyone accept a real answer.

Everyone will walk away thinking it is something different,
but it is interesting to read the explanations, all of them.

And as a side note, it is great to see how a few people have broken down the images trying to find an explanation.


It is watching these kinds of image breakdowns that helps in learning how to debunk things.

a reply to: Darkblade71

Wow, I must of just blazed over the Alaskan part,
my bad.

Thanks for the reply,
it explains a little better what angle you are coming from.

No worries.

I know what you are talking about with the title of Shaman and native culture as not that long ago I read where some natives are taking offense to the claiming of NA shamanism.

Many take offense to it, as it has become a convenient meme people attach themselves to when trying to pass themselves off as some sort of authority figure within certain groups or cultures. It has "watered-down" the real culture and mystique of the Native Americans and what their beliefs entailed.

I want to know all angles on the images.

So do I, but it does not do any good to automatically believe or jump to certain conclusions based on a preconceived belief or notion that is not rooted on some sort of concrete basis. To do otherwise is akin to a religious belief and the majority of people cannot follow that line of thought.

Ghost hanky.

Looks like a great catch. The paranormal team I am part of has captured similar anomalies using night vision cameras.

Very interesting reading about Shamans, I will plead massive ignorance on the subject, my knowledge restricted to what I saw on Northern Exposure, what a cracking good show that was.

But with that talk, and of trauma it really got me thinking. Mostly of family.

My mum and her sister (my aunt) are in their late 60's now. My mum is a non-religious and very keen business woman who raised us without forcing any type of religion on us at all. She did let us go to Sunday school a few times, but even at that age I thought everyone in the room was nuts.

My aunt however never had children of her own, but in her early 20's moved interstate and became a Jehovah's Witness practically overnight. She also believes she can cure cancer in people by flicking it off with her hands.... Her beliefs caused problems with everyone in the extended family. We would all love to visit her, but sooner or later after a few days one of us would tell her she is talking a load of rubbish and things would kick off from there. The first 20 years of my life knowing her, I remember getting back into a car at midnight after hearing adults fighting and heading back home interstate because my Aunty has a sharp and snappy anger when her beliefs are questioned.

Even her husband knows she has a slightly different take on reality than the rest of us and now we all just look at each other and our eyes say 'what the?' to each other. But we've all learnt to just smile and let her have her say. So this last 20 or so years has been much smoother. We love her dearly and honestly I feel bad at how upset we've all made her on occasion, to her it seems absurd that we don't share her feelings or her wisdom. She frets we are all blind and will suffer, her snapping back and anger is her brain struggling to cope with not being able to make us believe.


But what made her that way?
Perhaps trauma does not only just need to be a physical accident of sorts, but perhaps just having someone explain a subject that resonates so purely with them that it re-wires the brain into a massive new mindset. Obviously children are more susceptible to believing in something beyond this world, but young adults also seem to make major life changes based on something profound. I can imagine being in a church and feeling the entire room say 'amen' and feeling like the odd one out, if I'm at a major point of confusion or crisis in life it seems like a smart thing to do to follow the crowd.


So, while I love my Aunty I concede I'll never fully understand her, and I also love Neph and her input at ATS but can see great chasms of difficulties in resolving this ghost. While to many of us, it is strikingly clear that Neph had her mind made up from the get go (despite what she said) and she has sort of started avoiding questions such as recreating the scene, or showing us a clear photo perhaps of the boys pants.

But I can totally understand why. Neph presented to us her truth. To her this is a provable fact not unlike explaining how e=mc2 works to a physicist.
While to a large number of us this is an obvious reflection of light causing a lens type flare, Neph actually knows what it is. A small part of me actually wants to know what it feels like to be 'spiritual' like Neph and know her frustrations trying to convince us the un-believers.

originally posted by: NephraTari
My daughter in law was taking video with her phone of my grandsons playing in the living room and a white light came through between the boys very quickly and then went through the floor into the basement.

My husband who is the biggest skeptic of the family, although he has had experiences of his own, has gone over this video with a fine tooth comb and he was left with the comment.. ok that's kinda scary.
I don't find it scary because it is a white light. I have seen other entities that appear red or even black before and have mentioned those experiences here, but white light is usually positive entities, so this doesn't worry me. I welcome our resident experts to look it over.. the first part is the full original video and the last is a slowed down section of the event itself that my husband did for me.

Very interesting video and thanks for sharing.

IMO it is just a glare/reflection of some sort.

a reply to: NephraTari

Good work OP.

I'm glad you were fortunate enough to have a camera ready at the most convenient time. And I'm guessing that that was not a halogen torch that shone that light.

If you can record similar experiences under completely different circumstances then I might just believe you. But I know what a Halogen torch can do. Do you have any other footage? you must realize why people are dubious.

Light reflected off of the Thomas toy? Seems extremely far fetched.

A direct source of light (reflection from the toy) pointed at the camera would be visible. And why are the other light-sources not making similar spots?

What is even the mechanism behind this? Are you saying the that spot is projected onto the camera lens? A really tiny, reflective surface on the toy? If so, then why only one? And why is the spot changing size and shape? This would not be expected, if you consider how a spot of light from a watch looks on your wall, for example.

Yeah, I think it's a ghost... not!

Seems like a tiny insect or, more likely, a dust particle.

It is moving extremely close to the camera, so it appears to move very fast. It is large when it enters from the side but seemingly grows smaller as it moves to the left and away from the camera. It moves fluidly, like a thing carried in the air, not with the jerkiness of a reflection.

Star and flag to the OP, I like these kind of threads, even though we do not agree.

a reply to: Qumulys

Wow aren't you desperate?

For a stale mate on pg 1, you went a little nuts and overboard following that comment.. lol.

The thing about you tootin the horn on Thomas the train; only ONCE does this reflection occur, yet the child is pointing and turning Thomas is all sorts of direction of the light in the room angled at the camera, yet again, just ONE time this light effect happened?

If it were Thomas, it's easy to reproduce the same effect again. It also, would of happened at least one time before the brother touching the younger one...

The light effect you claim, should of occurred a few times, two at least, given how much the boy is turning and moving Thomas toy while the lens is focused on him.

So yea, calling a bluff, no matter how many still shots you take and how many lines and font on paint or whatever you add, it's not connecting IMHO.

@OP - it's a nice video, not sure it's spirit or not, but it's not Thomas the train and his dull grey plastic face reflecting light just once in the lens.

Cool effect whether light or spirit. Good job avoiding stale mate though

a reply to: Elementalist

Nope, not desperate, just trying to solve a mystery. For what it's worth, it is still very much a stale mate and I think it will always be that way especially when putting myself into Nephs mindset like I've said in my above post To her it's a ghost and that's all that really matters in the grand scheme of things. She knows what it is, convinced in fact and I can understand how frustrating that must be to her to get us doubters to believe it. I'm equally convinced it's not a ghost though but maybe that's my lost I guess.


The Thomas theory however fits best for me, but I'm not completely closed off.
In fact, I'm very much interested in the possibility it was something reflecting light from the older boys pants which seems like a wonderful suggestion. For instance like a sewn on plastic jellyfish, or something along those lines, sticky tape, vinyl, safety reflecive material etc. Or even the dust/insect suggestion, however since the light shows up like a classic lens flare (multiple similar shapes due to lens structure) I wonder if that's even possible. I'd expect a more solid singular shaped flash of light in that instance, but it doesn't mean it's not a possibility.

There are however multiple times when light is reflected of Thomas, not just the once. Keep in mind the toy has many shaped sides, all reflective plastic. The best example I think is not the reflection into the coffee table glass, but when it cast light for a brief second onto the boys chest, it's quick but it is there. Not unlike how a watch reflects light in a very short mall and sharp way. You need to watch very closely in the slow-mo it's only a couple of frames, but I have captured it in the stills. I've also said I wished that the highlight was stronger during the ghost part, hence why I'm interested in the pants theory. The light spot on the plastic is small, but also note it is no longer a flat surface directing light at this stage, rather it's light bouncing off the curved top so it's a very small focal point of light. I also think it was catching off the edge of the lens, not directly into the ccd. It's not a perfect theory by any means, I'm happy to hear what you or others want to suggest instead??

a reply to: introvert
www.mpm.edu... (see the section on religion)

Transgressions of taboos or other incorrect behavior could lead to illness, which then required the services of a shaman. Ho-Chunk Shamans relied on both herbal medicines and spiritual means to bring about cures. Shamans were always elderly and drew upon their years of experience and knowledge. They were also called upon to provide protection to warriors, and men who controlled warrior medicine were highly respected. In other circumstances, shamanistic power could be good or evil. Good power could be used for hunting or war or could also be turned and combined with bad medicines to promote witchcraft where greed and jealousy existed.

This is my tribe, this is my culture. It is a wise person who can admit when they are wrong.

a reply to: NephraTari

This website proves nothing, other than that it uses the same verbiage and misrepresentation of the culture that is prevalent throughout anthropology because the real purpose and word for native "shamans" was lost long ago.

My assertions still stand. Native American tribes did not practice any form of shamanism until the New Age movement and researchers bastardized the culture. The evidence confirms that.

I'd still like for you to answer my question: Do you believe you see UFO's regularly and have you ever been abducted?

a reply to: introvert
It is clear you have no regard for the actual facts here and are set to keep regurgitating what you have read in books when presented with the fact that my tribe defines our religious leaders as shamans. There is no point talking to a brick wall. I find your response to be embracing ignorance and disrespectful. I won't engage further conversation on these terms. Enjoy the limited view you have embraced.

a reply to: NephraTari

It is clear you have no regard for the actual facts here and are set to keep regurgitating what you have read in books when presented with the fact that my tribe defines our religious leaders as shamans.

It goes well beyond what can be found in books. Researchers and historians have not found a tribe in the US that practiced shamanism. Shamanism only made it's way in to the native culture through commercialization and the New Age movement.

I find your response to be embracing ignorance and disrespectful.

Likewise. The evidence and facts prove that shamanism was not practiced by Native tribes. I didn't just make that up. The info is out there and available to all. The only "proof" you have provided is a link to an edu site that explains things about your tribe. They don't even recognize that shamanism was the term applied to such practices because anthropologists couldn't find the actual term for it.....so they just called it shamanism. But shamanism it is not.

What I find disrespectful is a beautiful culture and grand spirituality that was twisted and bastardized to become something it is not. Do a google search on native American shamanism. The first page is full of Native American sites making it very clear that shamanism IS NOT native american spirituality. The rest are frauds pushing new age nonsense.

Apparently your fellow Native Americans find shamanism to be an insult as well.

I won't engage further conversation on these terms. Enjoy the limited view you have embraced.

Can't play the game, so you take your ball and go home? How mature of you. If the facts and evidence were easily accessible to counter my argument, you would have brought it to the debate. Why haven't you?

I've only met one other person in my life that claimed to be a Native shaman, although I'm sure there are many out there, and they were a fraud. He even had a certificate saying that he was a certified shaman. He peddled cheap trinkets, blessings, healings and used his native heritage to validate his ability as a shaman.

It's sad what the new age philosophies have done to a beautiful culture.

Also, why will you not answer my question? Do you believe you see UFO's on a regular basis and have you ever been abducted?

Native American and First Nations cultures have diverse religious beliefs. There was never one universal Native American religion or spiritual system. Though many Native American cultures have traditional healers, ritualists, singers, mystics, lore-keepers and "Medicine People", none of them ever used, or use, the term "shaman" to describe these religious leaders. Rather, like other indigenous cultures the world over, their spiritual functionaries are described by words in their own languages, and in many cases are not taught to outsiders.

Link

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

I don't even know what a hallogen torch is... but I understand your position. my daughter in law was not trying to catch anything.. she was just getting a video of the kids for FB to share with family and friends.. She saw it go by and checked to see if the camera caught it.. it did. I can't offer you anything more than that.. You don't know me. I respect your suspicion.