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OK Supreme Court: Ten Commandments Monument Must Be Removed From Capitol

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posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 10:58 AM
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Did the populous agree to In God We Trust? That is much like saying if Reps or Dems have control of Congress and pass a law, all people agree with it.




posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 10:59 AM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: NavyDoc

That's a good point about the Lady Justice statue... I hadn't thought about that iconography before. I'm going to have to contemplate how I feel about that for awhile now.


The traditional statue has ancient pagan roots.




The origin may be Themis, a Greek mythological goddess. One of the Titans, pre-Hellenic nature deities born to Uranus and Ge, she remained and advised Zeus after his purge of the old pantheon. In depictions of her, she carries the scales of justice in one hand and a sword in the other, her eyes covered. She became an oracle at Delphi, and became known as a goddess of divine justice.

A daughter of Themis and Zeus, Dike, known as a goddess of justice but not divine justice, presided over the apportionment of things among mortals, the protection of individuals and the keeping of social and political order. She carried a sword without a scale of justice. At times Dike is said to be the same (or is she confused with?) Astraea. Astraea is also said to be a daughter of Themis and Zeus and is known as a goddess of justice. Also known as daughter of Eos and Astraeus 1, her head was crowned with ears of grain and for its measure carried a balance or scale. Astraea was the last of the immortals to leave earth after the Golden Age. She has also been called a goddess of purity and innocence. She became the constellation Virgo. Dike left earth when the Race of Bronze was born.

The Egyptians honored Maat, the daughter of the sun god, Ra. She also carried a sword but without a scale of justice.

Justitia, a Roman goddess of justice, wore a blindfold. She had been depicted with sword and scales, but was not always so.

Representations of the Lady of Justice in the Western tradition occur in many places and at many times. She sometimes wears a blindfold, more so in Europe, but more often she appears without one. She usually carries a sword and scales. Almost always draped in flowing robes, mature but not old, no longer commonly known as Themis, she symbolizes the fair and equal administration of the law, without corruption, avarice, prejudice, or favor.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:00 AM
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originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
I pointed out the US is based on Christian legacy, I am correct, all you and a few others did was twisted words, denied it then said the same thing.

As usual arguing for arguments sake.


That is not what you pointed out:


Silly PC nonsense, it will bite them back. I have written plenty about my opinions on Christianity but it is the basis of American laws, and America is a Christian nation.


The US law is based on English Common Law. Thomas Jefferson was pretty clear in his letter mentioning the "wall between church and state" that Christianity is not part and parcel to Common Law (which has its basis in Anglo Saxon legal concepts from a time predating the introduction of Christianity to the Anglo Saxons)



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:00 AM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth

The entire context of the letter is:

Christian pastor: ''Put something Christian on the currency for posterity so in the future people know we weren't heathens and our nation's Christian heritage is known''

Secretary Chase: ''Okay then, here ya go ''IN GOD WE TRUST'' and words like it will be on the currency''

Try some CONTEXT.


Let me see if I grasp your rather simplistic point, God=Christianity, that about right?

Try again.



Well considering that you pointed out the purposeful ambiguity of the term God on federal reserve issues, and in this context certainly, you got some gall trying to rake truth because she/he holds it like every other religion as talking about their God.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:01 AM
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a reply to: Willtell

Looks like the satanists are out and about loud and clear and demanding the right to opinion, to have a statue, to think something etc are removed because they aren't part of the plan.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:01 AM
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a reply to: TheSemiSkeptic

With the nation being made up of 300mil individuals, I had thought it went without saying.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:01 AM
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a reply to: NavyDoc

Yes, I know. That's why I said I wanted to think about it for a while.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:02 AM
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originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: Willtell

Looks like the satanists are out and about loud and clear and demanding the right to opinion, to have a statue, to think something etc are removed because they aren't part of the plan.


Are you calling us Satanists? Because the naive idea that anyone against Christianity is a Satanist is rather juvenile.
edit on 1-7-2015 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:04 AM
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originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: Kromlech

It isn't enforcing belief in anything. There are plenty of things that could be removed from American societies under such rules, like advertising, tv shows, statues.


I think you are confused between government and private enterprise? People don't appear on American Idle to be subject to justice and perhaps sentenced to death or life in prison? Not yet at least...

We expect government not to discriminate and to care not about what God we do or don't worship. True Christians don't want their religion sullied by government and are staunch proponents of the separation of church and state. Ideologues however believe in "caliphate lite" where they hope to interject their conservative-Christian "beliefs" into government policy.

There are religious statues in court building that have historical context. Hell...there is a sculpture of the Prophet Mohamed on the north wall of the supreme court...along with Moses, Confucius, Napoleon, John Marshall and many other's. The sculptures have been there almost a 100 years and are an architectural feature.

The 10 Commandments, a Christian text, erected for ideological purposes 3 years ago, standing alone on state grounds speaks to a singular agenda of interjecting religion into government.

Ideological fail any way you look at it IMO.
edit on 1-7-2015 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:05 AM
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The language and tactics used in this thread provides excellent examples of why some people ridicule and blast Christianity.

We have a nation of people from all sorts of background, colors, religions, etc; with a government that is designed to protect an individuals right to practice the religion they choose, yet the Christians insist on saying "the country was founded on our faith. IT"S OURS!".

That is completely false, goes against what the constitution was designed to do, and I believe I now understand why the Christians get the blow-back that they do.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:07 AM
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a reply to: introvert

Of course. They bring it on themselves. The gay marriage issue, the abortion issue, the creationism taught in schools issue are all examples of Christians trying to unfairly push themselves and their beliefs onto others then acting all surprised and feigning persecution when they get staunch blow back.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:07 AM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: theabsolutetruth

Well when you try to rewrite history with lies, I'm going to call you on it. The nation isn't a Christian nation. It ISN'T a theocracy no matter how much you believe it to be. Christians have just successfully pushed their religion into government where it doesn't belong in the past. Rulings like the OP are just fixing those mistakes.


The question is was it founded a christian nation......saying yes for the very large part is not a LIE. Anyone one coming here then would describe the culture as christian even if only in form. Thats an historical fact. I have only to point to Alexander de Tocqueville.

See you guys are getting some stiff resistance and the crap adjectives start flying.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:10 AM
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originally posted by: Logarock

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: theabsolutetruth

Well when you try to rewrite history with lies, I'm going to call you on it. The nation isn't a Christian nation. It ISN'T a theocracy no matter how much you believe it to be. Christians have just successfully pushed their religion into government where it doesn't belong in the past. Rulings like the OP are just fixing those mistakes.


The question is was it founded a christian nation......saying yes for the very large part is not a LIE. Anyone one coming here then would describe the culture as christian even if only in form. Thats an historical fact. I have only to point to Alexander de Tocqueville.


No, it wasn't founded as a Christian Nation. It was founded as a Nation of Christians. I already posted links earlier in the thread that went over this.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

By the way, Alexis de Tocqueville was born in 1805 WELL after the founding fathers wrote the Constitution. Democracy in America was written in the 1830's.


See you guys are getting some stiff resistance and the crap adjectives start flying.


That's because you guys aren't listening to any evidence presented to you. You just keep sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "NUH HUH! YOU'RE WRONG!"
edit on 1-7-2015 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:11 AM
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a reply to: introvert

Pat Buchanan is being proved right daily.

The utopia of 'we all live in harmony' is a child's fantasy and simply cannot be achieved without a harmonious culture.

It is impossible to separate the culture that immersed the founding fathers from the ideas they fathered - they are irreversibly bound. To deny that, and to deny the culture that bound the man and their ideas is folly, and the attempt to do so is tearing apart our country.


edit on 1-7-2015 by Seamrog because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:12 AM
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I just want to interject this:

According to this source there are at least 313 religions and denominations in the United States. Each of these has different views on God.

How can we fairly uphold the Establishment Clause of the 1st Amendment that reads in part, Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof... if we promote one sect over another?

The answer to this is to remove all religions from the government. The government must be made impartial for it to function in a fair way to all.

Allowing the 10 Commandments to be placed violates the Establishment Clause twice. First, it gives preference and establishes precedent/law to Christians. Secondly, it discriminates and establishes precedent and law against those who would place an anti-10 Commandment type of statue.

The founding fathers did not want a theocracy like they had in England (with the Church of England). We were never meant to have religion intertwined with our government.

Of course the Christians are having a fit, they're used to having their way in this country. For to long the people have allowed the Christians to infiltrate and influence the US Government in ways it was never designed for. Now, we are finally approaching a separation of church/state that was envisioned and they're scared. The Christians are scared because they are loosing political power that used to exclusively belong to them.

The government isn't beholden to ANY religion -- it's impartial to give everyone equal protection under the law. The same government that lets you handle snakes is the same religion that allows for members to smoke cannabis. Once we start giving preferential treatment to one religion, we're all sullied by favoritism, and open the door to the religious oppression of others.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:15 AM
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originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Of course the Christians are having a fit, they're used to having their way in this country. For to long the people have allowed the Christians to infiltrate and influence the US Government in ways it was never designed for. Now, we are finally approaching a separation of church/state that was envisioned and they're scared. The Christians are scared because they are loosing political power that used to exclusively belong to them.


This is SOOOO true it's scary. No one likes to lose power they've held for any length of time and will fight tooth and nail to retain it. Even invent facts to support their case.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:15 AM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: introvert

Of course. They bring it on themselves. The gay marriage issue, the abortion issue, the creationism taught in schools issue are all examples of Christians trying to unfairly push themselves and their beliefs onto others then acting all surprised and feigning persecution when they get staunch blow back.



Yea man cause wow everybody knows all these things should be promoted by the state, paid for by the sate ect. Doesn't sound like blow back but like the nit wits are in firm control. Christians don't have to adjust their there tone on these issues. Whats wrong with you? "Unfairly push" What? Looks like a bunch that can only promote themselves on the government dime for the large part. My tax money pays for these culturally elevated positions! And now they want to tax the church.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:15 AM
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You guys do realize that some of us aren't Christian. I'm an atheist, not an anti-theist and, for the most part, other than not being able to get a Bloody Mary until 12 noon on a Sunday, Christians don't really negatively affect me.

Traditional iconography--and yes, like it or not, the primary tradition in the US is Judeo-Christian--is not offensive to me. Christmas decorations are pretty and traditional. Menorahs are lovely when lit at night. Crosses are traditional icons for memorials and gravestones. Why would a reasonable person get offended?



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:16 AM
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originally posted by: Logarock

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: introvert

Of course. They bring it on themselves. The gay marriage issue, the abortion issue, the creationism taught in schools issue are all examples of Christians trying to unfairly push themselves and their beliefs onto others then acting all surprised and feigning persecution when they get staunch blow back.



Yea man cause wow everybody knows all these things should be promoted by the state, paid for by the sate ect. Doesn't sound like blow back but like the nit wits are in firm control. Christians don't have to adjust their there tone on these issues. Whats wrong with you? "Unfairly push" What? Looks like a bunch that can only promote themselves on the government dime for the large part. My tax money pays for these culturally elevated positions! And now they want to tax the church.


Thanks for proving my point by purposely misunderstanding my meaning.



posted on Jul, 1 2015 @ 11:17 AM
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a reply to: Seamrog

Who's trying to make this some sort of "utopia"?

I just want to live my life the way I see fit, allow others to do the same, and deny those that want to push their agendas and beliefs on to me.

We have an incredible document that DOES separate culture from governance in that the rights we are guaranteed give us all an equal footing and the right to immerse ourselves in whatever culture we desire.

That's the genius of the constitution. The FF's did not agree on matters of faith and constructed a document that would protect INDIVIDUALS, not recognize any religion whatsoever.

So I would say that your opinion is contrary to the spirit of the constitution and contradicts the intent the FF's had.




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