Grexit : Is the inevitable finally about to happen ?

I couldn't sleep, so I started looking at the news.

money.cnn.com...

Things arn't looking good here.

Greece closing banks for 6 days.

will they be forced to leave the euro?

a reply to: crappiekat

All the signs are that Greece will leave the Euro and probably the European Union , we are in uncharted territory as when the default comes it will be the first time a country has defaulted so no one really knows how it will effect other countries like Spain and Italy who also have problems , although not to the extent of Greece's.

We could be in for an interesting and possibly turbulent summer.

a reply to: gortex

Dang, Just watching how this is effecting the global markets.

Kinda scary

a reply to: crappiekat

It's also effecting bond yields (government debt interest) for Italy, Spain and Portugal , reports that 10 year bonds have risen about 5 percentage points over the weekend.
The fear is that contagion from Greece could pull down other ailing economies , if that happens the brown stuff will really hit the fan as far as the European Union is concerned.

Hold tight the ride could get bumpy.

a reply to: gortex

www.forbes.com...

I ususally don't post in the financial threads, but I find this very interesting.

a reply to: crappiekat

I also find this interesting.

www.sacbee.com...

Would the US help them?

After his visit to Moscow in April I wonder if Alexis Tsipras isn't playing a game here and is expecting a white night to ride in and save the day for Greece.


Although Russia is currently in no state to bail Greece out some help may be forthcoming from their historical friend , it would be a way out for Greece and a poke in the eye for the west from Russia.
I'm not saying that is the plan but I can see it as a viable option for both parties.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
a reply to: gortex
www.bbc.co.uk...

Blimey it does. I swear the Germans love dragging all this out to keep the Euro low and BMW products etc churning out their factories at very competitive prices to non Euro export markets. They love it!

No, "we" (as in ordinary german people) don't love it. Most are really concerned about what is happening, some are even afraid of the uncertainity.

A Greek government source has told the BBC Greece won't pay the bail out payment due tomorrow , unless the EU mount a spectacular climb down the path to Greece's exit seems clear and unavoidable.

a reply to: gortex

I believe that whatever the outcome, the Greek people are right to stick a finger up to the European Central Bank, IMF and other powers external to their nation. Greece's people have put up with an awful lot of crap from outside their nation, and are dealing with financial pressures that they themselves did not create.

These people should be allowed to operate a life without being hassled by forces from outside their nation, and things have been hard there for YEARS. My aunt married a Greek before I was born, and has lived there, relatively close to Athens, for longer than I have been alive. Her husband, Stavros, is a grand fellow, who is currently dying from non hodgkins lymphoma, stage 4 of the disease.

The whole issue of in, or out of Europe, and all this trash talk between parliamentarians and economic ministers does not matter a damn to them, because they are just trying to live the life they have remaining together, until my uncle dies. What right has any government, either national, or supernational, to decide that those remaining months are to be full of fear and confusion about finances? I say none.

Whatever happens with Greece, the European central government and its various appendages, MUST realise that they do not have the right to dicate terms as they have to national governments. It is the people in a nation, whether that nation is in Europe or not, who must have the final say on ALL matters pertaining to the way their lives are capable of being run, the way their lives are financed, and the way they want to be governed. It is not for governments to enforce governance on people, but for people to demand what they need, and order governments to obey their demands, because only then do you have democracy.

The EU needs to learn its damned place.

a reply to: TrueBrit

First off:

originally posted by: TrueBrit
The EU needs to learn its damned place.

Power politically - 100% agreed.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
Whatever happens with Greece, the European central government and its various appendages, MUST realise that they do not have the right to dicate terms as they have to national governments. It is the people in a nation, whether that nation is in Europe or not, who must have the final say on ALL matters pertaining to the way their lives are capable of being run, the way their lives are financed, and the way they want to be governed. It is not for governments to enforce governance on people, but for people to demand what they need, and order governments to obey their demands, because only then do you have democracy.

I'm no fan of the IMF or ECB... BUT they (IMF, ECB and national delegates in the EU parliament from other EU-member states ) DO have the right to dictate terms for loans though.
They (representatives of EU states) have obligations towards their respective nations and people afterall.

People who can't understand this simple mechanic... can call me.
I'd like to negotiate a long-term loan. NO terms though.

a reply to: ColCurious

I think that what you may be missing somewhat, is that the terms of the bailout strategy as they stand at the moment, which are what stands between Greece and the cash flow it needs to sustain growth at all, are as harsh as they are and difficult for the Greeks to swallow, not because they were not written to assist Greece, or stop damage to the European Union, but because they were written to punish.

Merkel has let slip to even the previous leader of Greece, back in 2010, that Greece would be made to suffer if certain things were not achieved. That was back when the only settlements on the table were also vindictive and pointless. Now, forgive me, but the EU seems more like a loan shark at this point, than a genuine lender. They are making an example of Greece, rather than making any genuine effort to negotiate a settlement which will allow Greece some sort of opportunity to grow, while reducing its debts.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
They are making an example of Greece, rather than making any genuine effort to negotiate a settlement which will allow Greece some sort of opportunity to grow, while reducing its debts.

There was a good article in the Wall Street Journal this week on how they speculate that this was the game plan to send Spain, Italy and Portugal a message that they are going to get kicked in the nuts next if they do not shape up.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: ColCurious
I think that what you may be missing somewhat, is that the terms of the bailout strategy as they stand at the moment, which are what stands between Greece and the cash flow it needs to sustain growth at all, are as harsh as they are and difficult for the Greeks to swallow, not because they were not written to assist Greece, or stop damage to the European Union, but because they were written to punish.

Pure speculation and opinion... aside from the fact that there are no "terms as they stand at the moment" anymore.
The last bailout progam and its terms are gone - thanks to Tsipras.

IF what you claim was true though (sources?)... even more reason to end the bailout programs once and for all.
For the sake of Greece and her people, aswell as for the net contributors in the EU.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
Merkel has let slip to even the previous leader of Greece, back in 2010, that Greece would be made to suffer if certain things were not achieved.

Again, source please?

a reply to: ColCurious

The source of the comments I am referring to, is one Professor Steve Keen, an economics professor.

He made the comments which interest me, on the thirtieth of June of this year, on the BBC news channel. Here is the video in which he makes the comment which I am concerned about.



His view on the matter of the forced, and totally unreasonable austerity measures being placed upon Greece in general, are also worth a listen.

a reply to: TrueBrit

I'm sorry, but I can't find the article Professor Keen is talking about.
Nor could I find that alleged statement of Chancellor Merkel anywhere else in english or german language.

Just to be clear: I'm all for a sovereign Greece.
If the people decide they don't want the measures and structural reforms linked to the bailout loans - then by all means... don't take the deal.