House Defeats TPP Fast Track

a reply to: Kali74

You may be willing to 'bend the knee' to corporate overlords but I'm not.

How's that ?

I fight corporate welfare called social engineering.

We shouldn't be dealing with China,

I actually agree with that, and Cuba for the same reasons COMMUNIST STATES.

Instead you think it's a good idea to turn the entire world into China?

Feel free to quote where that was said.

That's what the TPP and all these massive trade bills would do.

It is going to do the same thing NAFTA did.

NAFTA at 20: One Million U.S. Jobs Lost, Higher Income Inequality

The only way to compete with China is to adopt their labor and environmental policies which is what we'll get if these deals go through.

China is going to do what ever it wants regardless of 'deals'.

This is a good thing in your opinion?

No Kali I don't like TPP, but for differing reasoning.

The only way it's a corporate 'winfall' is more people will be put out of work, and on government programs. So they can go buy 'more' stuff.

And the possible migration from Asia that we saw in the after math of NAFTA from South, and Central America during the CLinton era.

Any politico that supports this monstrosity needs to be measured for a pine box.

Each yes vote is roughly equivalent to a large steaming turd shat squarly upon the constitution, declaration, the federalist papers, and hell, even the magna carta.

They got away with "we've got to pass it t see what's in it," now they're going for "we gotta pass it and not even talk about it for four years..."

New epic levels of BS with this garbage.

a reply to: Kali74

My point was that China has no labor or environmental laws protecting it's own people. Zero regulations for businesses, for manufacturing because that limits profits. That's what will happen to us via tribunals.

I understand what you're saying and I agree.

But what I'm saying is even China is going to fall victim to this corporate takeover. Albeit they have a lot less further to fall than we do, but fall they will.


As an example for clarity of what I'm saying:

Let's say a corporation in Afghanistan wants to chop down all the forests in China, right now as it stands the Chinese dictatorial government still has say whether or not they want to allow this Afghan corporation to do so.

With the TPP agreement, they won't have a say anymore for fear of getting sued to the tune of billions of dollars... No country on the planet can afford to fork out billions of dollars to corporations every year in lawsuits. No amount of tax revenue increases could cover the costs of losing these lawsuits.

That means even a communist country like China is going to have to bow to the demands of these corporate overlords.

So to say that we're are going to become like China is skewing the bigger picture, because even China will no longer look like China anymore.

a reply to: CranialSponge

True enough.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: CranialSponge

My point was that China has no labor or environmental laws protecting it's own people. Zero regulations for businesses, for manufacturing because that limits profits. That's what will happen to us via tribunals.

Here's a different view.
from 2003 however....

China’s Labor Standards:Myths and Realities

YAY!!!!

Kali!!
High five, you!!!!

a reply to: Kali74

Anything Nancy Pelosi is for, I am against. Period.

That woman cannot read. She has to pass a bill to see what's in it.

a reply to: xuenchen

Okay so very weak labor laws... not seeing much at your link to refute my premise. Maximum minimum wage in China is 13 Yuan. That's about 2 dollars an hour. A quart of milk is 19 Yuan. While most Chinese cities have a lower cost of living than most of the west, it's completely unobtainable for minimum wage workers. That's why most factories have dorms, unheated with no hot water or means to cook. Minimum wage jobs make up about 40% of local salaries in all of China.

That is a nightmare.

a reply to: Ultralight

Anything Nancy Pelosi is for, I am against. Period.

That woman cannot read. She has to pass a bill to see what's in it.

Wow.

And - so....then.....

you are against anything that ANYONE who is not all about your preferred flavor of conservativism says? Like, for example, if someone stands for social justice, and re-enfranchisement of the millions of people who are DISenfranchised ------ and they aren't right-wingers.......well, shut them up and cut them off at the knees, belittle and shame them - make them realize how superior you are in every way. After all, I mean -- They can't read! Right?


Pfft. *eyeroll*

Somehow, at this juncture, Ultralight, finding out that is your attitude doesn't surprise me in the least. In fact, it's rather what I suspected.

I have trouble feeling good about this. The TPP is going to be shoved down our throats no matter what.

Wooooohoooo!!! All the people calling this program out have helped stop it! Now we just need to push on and make sure this devil deal is buried for good.

Just out of curiosity, I'd still like to know what in the hell was in the bill.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I am a native Californian and Pelosi rose to her power in my state. There are many reasons for my statement, based on her history here and as a woman who was once a Madame Speaker.

I did not say ANYONE...I was specific to PELOSI.

So there!

originally posted by: Ultralight
a reply to: Kali74

Anything Nancy Pelosi is for, I am against. Period.

That woman cannot read. She has to pass a bill to see what's in it.

You may want to apply the same measuring stick to Paul Ryan, who said essentially the same thing regarding this bill. I believe it was something along the line of "Once the bill is passed, it will no longer be classified."

And don't take this as any kind of defense of Nancy Pelosi (I despise her); take it as a condemnation of ALL politicians. In the United States, the two party knife cuts on both sides.

originally posted by: beezzer
Just out of curiosity, I'd still like to know what in the hell was in the bill.

I have a sinking feeling that we're going to find out the hard way. This bill is not dead.

a reply to: ProfessorChaos

Congress is openly treasonous with this thing.

It'll be a game-changer for the American people.

Haha sweet! Could you (or someone) by chance find said video? I need a good laugh today
a reply to: seeker1963

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: ProfessorChaos

Congress is openly treasonous with this thing.

It'll be a game-changer for the American people.

I have to agree with you on that. How else could just about EVERYONE that isn't in an elected office be against something, and those that are in office, are supporting it anyhow.

Something needs to be done to rein these people in.

a reply to: beezzer

You can read parts of the draft but you have to go to wikileaks or find someplace that has posted what wikileaks leaked. ATS doesn't allow links to wikileaks, understandably. For an inkling...

This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.

NERMEEN SHAIKH: House Republicans are set to push for a vote as soon as Friday on approving a measure to give President Obama fast-track authority to negotiate the Trans-Pacific Partnership deal. The secretive TPP deal involves 12 countries and nearly 40 percent of the global economy. On Wednesday, WikiLeaks released a leaked draft of another chapter of the secret negotiating text, this time the TPP’s so-called Healthcare Annex. Newly revealed details of the draft show the TPP would give major pharmaceutical companies more power over public access to medicine and weaken public healthcare programs. The leaked draft also suggests the TPP would prevent Congress from passing reforms to lower drug costs. One of the practices that would be allowed is known as "evergreening." It lets drug companies extend the life of a patent by slightly modifying their product and then getting a new patent. This is a video explaining the practice, produced by Doctors Without Borders.

Democracy Now!

Notice the "suggests the TPP would prevent Congress from passing reforms to lower drug costs."?

And:

Legal analyses of previous leaks

a reply to: Kali74

TPP sounds like an omnibus-bill.

Something that would lock in control and power with no way of reigning it in.

Now I'm no scholar, but perhaps something like this might be construed as highly unconstitutional.