Programmers...Could it be done in 6 Days if Virtual Reality?

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Which just proves you have no imagination and little actual willpower as well. I think its a reflection on your lack of character that you can't simply accept what I know to be true because it's doesn't jive with your limited logic.

originally posted by: Thorneblood
a reply to: Char-Lee

LOL I could see Lucifer as the jealous and un-imaginative assistant to God during production of Earth: the Reality. Got fired and started his own much maligned version.

Yes with a virus in the program! Makes us feel right at home! Maybe it will not be fixed until all who like the corrupted version are placed elsewhere to run on as they please..kings, bankers, corporate dealers can continue at will in their own version (hell).

a reply to: Thorneblood

there is a massive amount of cognitive dissonance here to be unable to reconcile the difference between having an active imagination and understanding the realistic hurdles involved in a proposed action. The concepts aren't mutually exclusive here. One can have a vivid imagination while also grasping the inherent difficulties or improbabilities.

Being irrational numbers, pi and phi are examples of the infinite, unseeable, being programmed into nature.

originally posted by: Thorneblood
Yes, i could do it quite easily and regularly dream about such things.

Yup. An easy way of simplifying the creation story is asking the question: what came first, spirit or matter? Creation is essentially saying a pure conscious spirit created everything, whereas evolution implies that matter gave rise to consciousness/spirit.

"If the flesh came into being because of spirit, that is a marvel, but if spirit came into being because of the body, that is a marvel of marvels.

Yet I marvel at how this great wealth has come to dwell in this poverty." (Gospel of Thomas 29)

a reply to: Krazysh0t

How exactly does our inability to program past our current knowledge mean it would be impossible for the world to be virtual.

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
Huh, so basically the universe was built in differing versions, according to this. day one, they made light and whatnot. Universe 1.0, and so on to "day" six, which we'll called "Microsoft Universe 6".

....Still, sadly, riddled with bugs. Here are a few examples.


"MOBS called "Human" very inefficient; breathing hole and eating hole are same hole. Looking into this."

Haaaaa... which is likely why eating coincided with the fall of humankind.

I could do it in half the time, lol.

I can't help but notice the pseudo-rational debates going on here, trying to fit "God" into our reality. I understand you're trying to also peak the ET crowds interest, but let's face it, whoever "programmed" this environment IS a God.

First of all, any programming that would be done, would be on the quantum level, which we can't even comprehend right now. Particle physics anyone? That aside, putting "God" in OUR box is an exercise in futility. We don't even have a handle on how Gravity works, let alone how it could be programmed... But our entire reality?

To me that kind of question is in the same league as "Why are we here?" or "What happens after we die?". If you study particle physics and quantum mechanics, you begin to understand that our reality is without a doubt programmed, but... to fathom how, is to fathom a creator, is to fathom that which is inevitably intangible, not only to our physicality, but to our perceptions as well as our imaginations. I would submit that everything we think we know about this reality is woefully lacking any real substance (much like the reality itself).

Just as we think causality governs our lives as much as our own decisions, it is all nothing more than an illusion.

P.S. Of course it could be done in 6 days, because a day is an inordinate amount of time (Biblically speaking). Time also has no meaning outside of this little bubble we live in. We forget how incredibly insignificant our experiences really are, within the scope of a Creator. I submit it could have been done in One day, but a Creator always likes to make a point with purpose, whether it was 6 or 6000 days...

^Actually the bible defines a day by the morning when it gets light, so it is a 24 hour period. If you wish to make assumptions that things outside of our universe can exist or that time is different, or that a creator exists, feel free, but keep in mind that you are speaking pretty "Matter of fact" about something that may not even exist, just as Cooper did with the idea of a spirit. If you wish to suggest any of the above is true, then you need evidence rather than guesses.

originally posted by: Thorneblood
Which just proves you have no imagination and little actual willpower as well. I think its a reflection on your lack of character that you can't simply accept what I know to be true because it's doesn't jive with your limited logic.

What a load of condescending BS. You claim you could program a universe? By all means, explain the coding necessary for consciousness and nuclear fusion. Let's start there as those things would be crucial but only a tiny piece of what is actually needed in the grand scheme of things. Before accusing somebody of not having an imagination, perhaps you should explain these things and others.

You are really downplaying the amount of time and effort that is put into even basic programming which isn't really fair to the programmers out there. Thousands of lines of code are used for something as simple as a 3D face. Games today often take years to develop and program, and that doesn't even touch something like nuclear fusion, abiogenesis or virtual reality.... But I'm sure you could program a universe in 6 days. Please... I have doubts that you could even program a sphere in 6 days, let alone a single planet with a rotating liquid iron core, plate tectonics, evolution, electromagnetism, ozone layer, atmosphere, magnetosphere, volcanoes, tornadoes, other weather patterns, erosion, radioactive decay, dirt, rock, etc etc etc.

Yeah, it's fun to think about, but imagination doesn't magically make things real. But surely you can explain how to program consciousness and prove us all wrong. There's having confidence, and then there's being completely egotistical.

The OP suggested that you would just need to replicate a pattern, but that is absurd. Anybody can imagine generalized concepts of things, but you really need to look at the level of detail involved and then step back and ask yourself if you could really do it. I don't personally believe that I can jump to the moon from here. Imagining that I can doesn't make it happen.

a reply to: Char-Lee
What a fabulously entertaining theory. I seen this post yesterday and believed it would be an entertaining debate with my programming/coding hubby last night. I was surprised that he had the same limiting view as many other programmers who have responded. I even attempted to get him to think "outside of the box" of what our science has only discovered and applied technologically. It isn't a limited theory on what we know now, but what could we discover and apply in the future.

I believe this theory has as much to offer as any other theory, in an attempt to explain the big questions of how and why. My husband forges games in Halo for our family and friends to enjoy on game night. He can whip out newly created maps quite quickly and establishes the guidelines in our game world, even right down to limitations of some players if necessary. The original creators did all of the background work of coding...he just uses what is there and applies it as needed to re-create.

Certainly, vid games seem a silly comparison at first, but when we play them for entertainment or education. We manipulate our avatars on the screen and immerse ourselves in the game. If you get killed, you even may cry out obscenities,(I do!) because you have to start over again. My main point is that even stories of reincarnations could be explained in a virtual reality Game of Life. Throw in many other unexplained so called paranormal things as possible glitches. As far as consciousness? My avatars on the screen appear to be consciously acting through my conscious being. In such a virtual realty theory...why would it be any different? My consciousness could be outside this illusion and only connected via the act of playing the game.

I don't think suggesting this could be done in 6 days is insulting to programmers. I think it should be seen as a compliment of their intelligent creative skills. Another programmer can apply another 20 lines of code to a previous original project, toss in some looping parameters, etc...and wahlah...a seemingly completely different program evolves in less time than the original creation. As technology advances from future scientific discoveries, technological programming will advance too.

I must say, if this is a virtual reality game, it is the ultimate one. Challenges and all. I obviously have not become bored with it and am hooked!

a reply to: Char-Lee

If the world was a virtual environment for created free willed life forms could it be done in the days stated in ancient texts? Could it be done with a pattern already made?

Here is the scary thing. A virtual world could be created in 7 days, and appear to be millions or even billions of years old.(I am not advocating young earth trolls)You could be created at your current age with memories that never happened, but one thing doesn't change. Virtual worlds rely on the existence of an external mind. I can think of two virtual world that exist: One within a computer or one within the mind. Plenty of data on brain-dead people who come back and have had both visual and auditory experiences with zero brain-function. So in my opinion if the world is virtual there are two options: The world was created by some other being with something similar to a computer or the world was created by an external mind.

a reply to: Char-Lee

at the risk of stating the blisteringly obvious - for any aledged creator that can conjour matter from LITERALLY nothing - the question of " how long it takes " is utterly irrelevant

a reply to: Char-Lee

What do you think, could it be done if in fact it were a virtual environment made by advanced beings?

you know dammed well whats coming next dont you

and the orign of the alledged ` advanced beings ` and the infrastructure required for the existance of them and thier " virtual environment " is ...............................

crickets

a reply to: Barcs

The OP suggested that you would just need to replicate a pattern, but that is absurd. Anybody can imagine generalized concepts of things, but you really need to look at the level of detail involved and then step back and ask yourself if you could really do it.

From the OP...

Elsewhere Philo explained that this invisible world was made on the first day of the creation
.. a beautiful copy would never be produced apart from a beautiful pattern... so when God willed to create this visible world he first fully formed the intelligible (i.e. invisible) world in order that he might have the use of a pattern wholly God-like and incorporeal in producing the material world as a later creation, the very image of the earlier (Creation 16)

I read this and some other areas that suggest that time was spent creating a pattern first, no time limit on creating the "invisible" pattern. I was wondering if a computer programer would see such a pattern as the creation of his game or model universe BEFORE the time it took to actually put it together.

I wanted to see if there could be another way to look at the ancient texts that may not sound abserb after we look with our own new abilities in technology.

Thank you for your response like many here they are all very interesting and thought provoking.

a reply to: CynConcepts

The original creators did all of the background work of coding...he just uses what is there and applies it as needed to re-create.

Certainly, vid games seem a silly comparison at first, but when we play them for entertainment or education.

I am reading a book, it is about a future where mankind begins to create copies in a virtual environment in order to pre test medicines and surgeries on an individual. They become so good at this and as their power and computing abilities grow they are able to replicate a complete brain.

So one scientist decides to make a replication of a person and put them in an virtual environment, most kill themselves after they realize what and where they are, even though everything feels real and tastes real they are in a box and they can't stand it.

skipping ahead... they find dying old rich people who pay to be kept alive virtually and they can actually run their previous life from inside the virtual world although they are slowed down so there is a time lapse communicating to the real world due to power and computing issues. The biggest issue was computing power and energy costs

It made me start thinking, suppose you created such an environment and created "children" for yourself, yes i could love my creation. In the ancient texts it mentions the creator walking with his creation in a garden, and that he will again when the old perfect pattern is used to make a new Earth and Heavens.

This is to like using an avatar to be a part of a game and if we KNEW the created characters in our game were of a certain amount of FREE WILL, would we not love to visit them and help them and watch them create and develop their world?

In a way it feels as though a virtual reality could take away many of our limiting ideas of what could be true and I wondered if the 6 days of creation and many other impossibilities could work if we were virtual.

Also what happens if the virtual reality runs automatically on a energy source needing no maintenance and all of the real people are killed by a disaster and the computer continues to run...will the program grow old and decay?

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
a reply to: Char-Lee

at the risk of stating the blisteringly obvious - for any aledged creator that can conjour matter from LITERALLY nothing - the question of " how long it takes " is utterly irrelevant

Well virtual reality, is it conjured from literally nothing? I really suppose it is it comes from talented artists I guess.

you know dammed well whats coming next dont you

and the orign of the alledged ` advanced beings ` and the infrastructure required for the existance of them and thier " virtual environment " is ...............

Right! has to come to that!:-)

Many of the scriptures refer to beings of light and visiting with them in their own form we needed to change our earthy "clothing" some mention the human becoming as one of them, I am not sure how this could relate to a virtual reality, unless they would meet in a special environment like in the Matrix movie where they could show what they are and let you be as them.
They also talk often about them taking our form for various purposes and how did God walk in the garden with his creation was that in our form...avatars?

In 2 Enoch there is an account of how Enoch was taken to stand before the heavenly throne. Michael was told to remove his earthly clothing, anoint him and give him the garments of glory;

a reply to: ServantOfTheLamb

I can think of two virtual world that exist: One within a computer or one within the mind. Plenty of data on brain-dead people who come back and have had both visual and auditory experiences with zero brain-function. So in my opinion if the world is virtual there are two options: The world was created by some other being with something similar to a computer or the world was created by an external mind.

The Matrix Traveller says that the mind is a part of the processor even though the actual computer is outside our reality. if I understand correctly, he died and came back like what you speak of.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: Aedaeum

Just as we think causality governs our lives as much as our own decisions, it is all nothing more than an illusion.

Some texts suggest that we can have total control over our reality example:

"I tell you the truth, if you have faith and don't doubt, you can do things like this and much more. You can even say to this mountain, 'May you be lifted up and thrown into the sea,' and it will happen.

A hint maybe that we can take the reigns when we can believe in our own control over the system?

originally posted by: Thorneblood
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Which just proves you have no imagination and little actual willpower as well. I think its a reflection on your lack of character that you can't simply accept what I know to be true because it's doesn't jive with your limited logic.

I agree with ThorneBlood, feeling that he and I may be the only ones in this thread who have actually programed virtual realities before. The answer is so simple, and seemingly dismissive, because the question is so vague. The really interesting questions are far more specific.

Where do you hide your mechanism for telling species when to over reproduce and when to under reproduce?
If resurrection is so trivial at design time, why restrict all access to it in the simulation?
At what stage do helper-a.i. 's become an annoyance to the player?
If it is impossible to keep the real world from affecting players in the simulation, how does one insulate the simulation from outside influence?

But an entire galaxy can be loaded, or procedurally generated, in milliseconds not days.


/fireproof on
Mike Grouchy

a reply to: mikegrouchy

But an entire galaxy can be loaded, or procedurally generated, in milliseconds not days.

Wow!

Where do you hide your mechanism for telling species when to over reproduce and when to under reproduce?
If resurrection is so trivial at design time, why restrict all access to it in the simulation?
At what stage do helper-a.i. 's become an annoyance to the player?
If it is impossible to keep the real world from affecting players in the simulation, how does one insulate the simulation from outside influence?

Wish I actually understood any of this.

hide your mechanism

Hide it? We can't see the program right, why and how would it be hidden? Could you not just start and stop any process you desire? If fully automated would it be an if/when/or command situation?

why restrict all access to it in the simulation

Some people die and come back it seems, does that count? Maybe it is a reward only for goal of the "player"?

how does one insulate the simulation from outside influence?

Would you need to if you were the one creating it? it would really only be your influence right? Unless a virus was introduced?

I know how to start and stop my computer that's about it soooo:-)