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Social Justice, Political Correctness, and My Poor, Poor Exploding Brain

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posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 09:02 PM
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a reply to: Involutionist

"The entire world" is actually a precise statement, even though I never have to leave home to access it. Thanks to the Internet I do have access to all but the most restrictive of Countries - and their opinions - and converse very often from people spanning the globe.

The sentiment behind this thread is very much Internet inspired and based. My real life world is rather small and I prefer it that way. I was once a very social person, but over the past decade I quit drinking, became single, and started realizing that I was getting a bit old to be as wild as I was being. So... I made peace with simpler things and now mostly am a homebody.




posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 09:59 PM
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a reply to: Hefficide



"The entire world" is actually a precise statement, even though I never have to leave home to access it. Thanks to the Internet I do have access to all but the most restrictive of Countries - and their opinions - and converse very often from people spanning the globe.



I understand. Thank you for expounding.




The sentiment behind this thread is very much Internet inspired and based. My real life world is rather small and I prefer it that way. I was once a very social person, but over the past decade I quit drinking, became single, and started realizing that I was getting a bit old to be as wild as I was being. So... I made peace with simpler things and now mostly am a homebody.


I know. I have paid attention to your story you have shared over the past while. Your holiday thread (reaching out to hold another's hand for those who needed it) shows your "light".



I made peace with simpler things and now mostly am a homebody.


...and worldly at the same time.

Have a great weekend.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 10:00 PM
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a reply to: Hefficide


Somehow these videos end up going along this narrative "So... *sob*... today a guy named Mike said he liked my shoes.... and I felt so raped... I felt so objectified and dirty...."



People think I'm being insulting, but this is a serious issue. These people are mentally ill, and instead of being helped to get better, their illnesses are being exacerbated by extreme political correctness.

Look up "otherkin." There are human beings that think they're squirrels, and people are taking them seriously instead of trying to find them help.

It's nuts



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 10:07 PM
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a reply to: SaturnFX


When the socialists are complaining that the social justice warriors are way off, you know there is a problem.


I can find common ground with socialists. Socialists really are just Libertarians with different economic views.

But I cannot find common ground with these SJW's.

When they start calling for crap like gender quotas and for people to be prosecuted for "Fart Rape" and "manspreading," we have reached some serious issues culturally.



posted on Jun, 12 2015 @ 11:53 PM
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originally posted by: JeanPaul
The problem is, the right wing makes it next to impossible for even leftist people to criticize "leftist" tactics because we don't want to give racists/sexists/homophobes any ammo.

This could be the quote of the thread.

Think these days everyone has become a political node and everything is a zero-sum game. I've had everything from being asked questions like 'why would you attack another feminist?' to 'so you think X abhorrent act is okay?' based on my own journey of introspection and interrogating my values and the causes I get behind.

I believe more than ever many people are afraid of telling their various emperors about their lack of clothes or they simply don't even query it. Not sure how many ATS'ers have noticed but these days I tend to start talking to people on my side of the debate first before challenging anyone on the opposite side. The last 18 months have been surprising, enlightening, and unfortunately have lost me some irl friends.

Lot of the time these people don't realize that they're asking you to adhere to a standard. They're telling you to 'stay on message' as if you were a lower tier politician. The irony is that this should be everything that they despise and hate. Conformity, the stream lining and homogenizing of opinions and values via the ever watchful eye of social shame.

I'd like to say I've made some friends on my journey, but honestly I don't think I've made a single one and its made me feel kind of lonely. If anything, I kind of want to take it all back. :/

Social pressure in action I suppose.

As an aside I don't believe it's a particularly 'left' paradigm. Also I don't believe, as some have alluded to, that this phenomenon is about feeling 'oppressed.' I don't consider losing a few handfuls of friends an finding it hard to relate to people 'oppression,' but challenging one's own beliefs these days is tantamount to finding a new friend circle.

a reply to: JeanPaul



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 01:08 AM
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originally posted by: LewsTherinThelamon
a reply to: SaturnFX


When the socialists are complaining that the social justice warriors are way off, you know there is a problem.


I can find common ground with socialists. Socialists really are just Libertarians with different economic views.

But I cannot find common ground with these SJW's.

When they start calling for crap like gender quotas and for people to be prosecuted for "Fart Rape" and "manspreading," we have reached some serious issues culturally.

lets see
manspreading, mansplaining, jazz hands replacing applause, no such thing as "reverse" racism due to white people having power and racism being based on power, artist criticism based on socially insensitive portrayals, "male gaze" theory, hetro-patriarchal normative culture being toxic, "toxic masculinity" being used as anything considered a male norm trait, rape culture, wage gap, etc etc

these people are on a mission to drive every single thinking liberal away to form a cult.

Its been exploding online for the past..hmm...really focused in on the last 18ish months or so, but I think they reached a head and now are eating "their own".
Jos Whedon, a self proclamed feminist who has his picture taken with Anita freaking Sarkeesian got ran off twitter from rampant widespread hate by radical progressives for his work in Ultron
Anne Rice is now under attack by the bully brigade for...pointing out the bully tactics of a single radfem.
Ian Miles Cheong, editor in chief for gamerax, who was once leading the charge for social justice warrior nonsense has backed out of it and apologised, admitting it is now a cult..same with many others seeing the extremism become the norm.

Are you beach body ready?....dont get me started.

I always wondered why conservatives rarely slammed their most fringe jerkwads...the people that were religiously..well, religious and wanting to ultimately bring forth some sort of theocratic craze.
I am now equally mystified that soo many liberals aren't checking these social control authoritarians that give liberalism a horrible name.

Being for respecting a trans person is perfectly fine, that does not mean give a pass to people ultimately shaming the "cis white male" for being just that...shame someone for being an intolerant asshat, but not for being simply the "norm" and enjoying their identity.

grr...hot button topic.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 01:18 AM
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originally posted by: Pinke
The last 18 months have been surprising, enlightening, and unfortunately have lost me some irl friends.

Thats kinda weird.
I read the comment above yours and responded before reading this comment, yet we both have hit around the same timeframe of when things started going oddly.
So...
what happened in the early months of 2014 that has suddenly polarized and radicalized soo many...or perhaps not many, but media propping them up as some sort of shining beacon

For me, I can loosely point out some things in that general timeframe. as a avid gamer heavily into the gaming culture, we had (and currently have) the latest incarnation of Jack Thompson making the rounds..this time with many journalist supporters united in pressing the issues, which has caused a heavy pushback (loosely based around gamergate), but its been seeping in many other areas outside gaming...in the subways, in the conversations, you got Emma Watson going up and eloquently requesting men...to support women (heforshe)...?...

I think its time we do a bit of checking out as to what is moving this. I am all for legal equality (achievement unlocked ages ago) and equal opportunity...not for what is going on now..
social equality is a myth..it is a construct that is dangerously impossible..we are not all equal. some people are hard working overachievers, some are lazy who want little..both have a right to be that. Moreover, people genuinely don't want social equality. we enjoy gender roles as the norm..not that the norm is required, but when its condemned, that is an issue. people like identity, and the more its removed, the less...fitting...we find society to be.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 06:50 AM
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a reply to: SaturnFX

Obviously it was gamergate that happened. I mean both sides existed before that but the ugly really seeped out to the mainstream after. Both sides being equally vile.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 01:26 PM
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originally posted by: SaturnFX
what happened in the early months of 2014 that has suddenly polarized and radicalized soo many...or perhaps not many, but media propping them up as some sort of shining beacon

I've been a feminist for a long time.

This part doesn't particularly surprise me. As Kali says, both sides existed long before that. There have always been some different types of feminists, but a major idea or feeling is to support people and listen. So sometimes a person would express some angry feelings, an odd idea, or say something perhaps even stupid but the idea was to allow people to express and to be constructive.

So personally I've heard a lot of it before, but its reached academic levels of complexity for the uninitiated. I won't address my own (or your own) beliefs about equality, but people take serious emotional offense at perceived wrongs and unless you know the culture or language to navigate it (and sometimes even if you do) you're going to get hit by a vicious series of talking points. I run into the same things with heavily one way or the other people sometimes who take me through a process diagram of their talking points and then call me a leftist or whatever ... but getting it back from 'your own' is kind of surprising.

I can show you a bunch of examples if you like on both issues, but yes the debates often jump from a conversation to just stupidly offensive presupposed questions.

My experience in 18 - 20ish months has been from opening up to my friends about how I feel sometimes. I suspect a lot of experiences other people are having are from the sudden shock of being targeted by a type of deconstruction which has been around for a long time. Oddly when it happens to movies or books a lot of people don't blink. Piles of people believe Fight Club is a retrosexist film along with things like the Expendables for example ... no one really cares. When it started seriously targeting games on youtube etc instead of just discussing Lara Croft everyone just went a bit crazy.

I've stayed out of it for the most part.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 01:42 PM
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originally posted by: Pinke

originally posted by: JeanPaul
The problem is, the right wing makes it next to impossible for even leftist people to criticize "leftist" tactics because we don't want to give racists/sexists/homophobes any ammo.

This could be the quote of the thread.

Think these days everyone has become a political node and everything is a zero-sum game. I've had everything from being asked questions like 'why would you attack another feminist?' to 'so you think X abhorrent act is okay?' based on my own journey of introspection and interrogating my values and the causes I get behind.

I believe more than ever many people are afraid of telling their various emperors about their lack of clothes or they simply don't even query it. Not sure how many ATS'ers have noticed but these days I tend to start talking to people on my side of the debate first before challenging anyone on the opposite side. The last 18 months have been surprising, enlightening, and unfortunately have lost me some irl friends.

Lot of the time these people don't realize that they're asking you to adhere to a standard. They're telling you to 'stay on message' as if you were a lower tier politician. The irony is that this should be everything that they despise and hate. Conformity, the stream lining and homogenizing of opinions and values via the ever watchful eye of social shame.

I'd like to say I've made some friends on my journey, but honestly I don't think I've made a single one and its made me feel kind of lonely. If anything, I kind of want to take it all back. :/

Social pressure in action I suppose.

As an aside I don't believe it's a particularly 'left' paradigm. Also I don't believe, as some have alluded to, that this phenomenon is about feeling 'oppressed.' I don't consider losing a few handfuls of friends an finding it hard to relate to people 'oppression,' but challenging one's own beliefs these days is tantamount to finding a new friend circle.

a reply to: JeanPaul



Privilege theory took off in the 1970's/1980's with a mixture of RadFem ideas, a few "intellectuals" such as Ernesto Laclau, Chantal Mouffe, the feminists Bell Hooks, Kim Crenshaw, Peggy McIntosh etc. "intersectionality", "critical race theory" radical feminism and Maoism of the 1970's.

It started picking up steam when some socialists esentially gave up on socialism and began to focus on changing our society without socialism. People such as Herbert Marcuse. It's not Marxism but they attempt to use that language. As the RadFems have always done.

I've been around this stuff for about ten years. Some people think it is a "new thing" but it really began to take off again durring/after "Occupy Wall St". Before that in various universities.

During "Occypy Wall St" in Oakland two factions broke out. One was "Occypy" and the other "Decolonize". The "Decolonize Oakland" group was made up of Rad Fems and privilege/critical race theorists. It got ugly. It was the first time I saw this brand of political activism mobilized. From that point on I've been a harsh critic. Before that it was mostly academic. I was a passive critic before Occypy.

PT activism is being taught at the university level. Critical race theory, women's studies and in some general sociology classes. The foundation was set in the 1970's but has expanded in the 21st century.

Anyhow, socialists have been arguing over this brand of identity politics for quite some time. Those of us who don't agree with it are branded "vulgar", "rape apologists", racists, sexists "brosocialists" "manarchists" and such. It gets very ugly. Full of "call outs" public shaming, attempts to get people fired from jobs or ostracized...in some cases men have been accused of sexual assault without cause. It. Gets. Ugly.

It has been tearing the "socialist left" apart. Many people won't admit this though. They choose instead to think women are being raped right and left within socialist organizations. That men are oppressing everyone around them even when they're putting in efforts to build an equal society...while living in poverty. Basically, yes, white "cis"/straight males are the enemy. The ultimate "oppressors". No matter their status in society. They're throwing white women into the "oppressor class" now as well.

It positions "oppressor" against "oppressed. Creates two district classes between men and women. Men in the oppressor class and women in the oppressed class. As I said, white women are now being thrown into the "oppressor" class. Heck, its expanding beyond that. It's a very divisive approach to social activism. It seeds discord rather than understanding. Fragmentation rather than unity. Anger rather than peace of mind. There will be guilt. There will be conflict. There will be a reaction to this as it goes mainstream. I think it will further weaken the left. Most people don't want to wallow in a hostile environment full of guilt and shame. Many PT activists get burned out when PT theory gets used against them. And it eventually does because anyone and everyone can be categorized as an "oppressor" or as an "oppressed" person. Thin vs fat. Tall vs short. White vs black. Man vs woman. Attractive against non attractive. Gay vs straight. Bald vs hairy. Mentally ill vs "neurotupucal". Handicap vs able bodied and so on.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 01:47 PM
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Picture a Roman arena full of people oppressing each other. Who can you trust? Who has your back? Each against each in a battle where anything goes. Full of trap doors and various verbal weapons. With an audience used to shame and humiliate. The ultimate weapon. The crowd.
edit on 13-6-2015 by JeanPaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 04:01 PM
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Gamergate was the point where I actually began trying to make sense of this phenomenon. I subscribe to a LOT of tech sites and channels and Gamergate was covered by almost all of them - and from different perspectives. Since no general consensus seemed to be apparent, I began doing my own research and found myself smack in the middle of SJW rhetoric that did not help my understanding one iota.

From what I can tell it's rooted in identity politics - the need for people to feel that they have a voice, no matter who they are. But, if so, it's identity politics gone infantile and pedantic... and possibly insane. It's not a quest to have an equal voice - it seems to be a quest to have the only voice. It's the Highlander version of identity politics and, apparently, there can be only one.

The conspiracy theorist within me immediately wants to jump to the conclusion that this is divide and conquer with smart bomb precision; leaving me wondering if there are not agenda driven ( paid ) agitators guiding the narrative.

Then again the more rational and less paranoid part of me looks at our society and seems to think that the trend fits, perfectly, the current state of Western society... shallow, self-absorbed, indoctrinated, short sighted, half-logic that has been taught to stop at 144 characters and to never think any deeper than that.

Could it all just be that the Generation Tweet is incapable of going deeper than a single thought into any given subject?



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 04:21 PM
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a reply to: Hefficide

The SJW's went insane with identity politics that's true but the MRA's went insane also. Seemingly previously rational people suddenly got all into it too. Feminists that previously stuck to equality now screaming that being looked at was rape while men drove full speed ahead into misogyny and threats of violence.

I'm a gamer, I play SW:ToR regularly and have played Wildstar, SWG and tried out various other MMO's... I read up on games too so I frequent gamer sites. Sexism has always been bad in games, most guys assume there's no women around and let fly... whatever, women do it too. But after gamergate holy crap... all women were to be hated by a much bigger percentage of players. The mentality I saw at work through all this wasn't unfamiliar to me at all but was generally relegated to one or two psychos per server.

But again, though it became palpable in the gaming world and oozed out from there onto the internet... in the world at large? Not so much. Men aren't raping more or beating women more than before and women aren't falsely accusing men of such more than before.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 04:21 PM
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originally posted by: Hefficide
Could it all just be that the Generation Tweet is incapable of going deeper than a single thought into any given subject?

JeanPaul hit some nails up above you.

A lot of this stuff has its origins in academia and also in the fact that academic works are often slow to move into public consciousness. Plenty of feminist theorists have written critiques of patriarchy theory, and masculine hegemony theory is a response to some of that ... hegemony theory already has robust critiques too, but the current 'out in the wild' discussions haven't caught up with that yet - they are still knee deep in patriarchy theory. This is only based in my own country though, I've heard some horror stories from other places which go both left and right.

So yes, the things you're talking about I believe are a combination of poorly understood academic theory, humanity's general inclination to trust the information they're given, and people do generally want to help but they also want things to be simple. At the height of my awkward feminist phase I'd have been offended by someone wanting to call themselves humanist. Now I mostly don't care so long as you're not a jerk.

These people actually pay piles and piles of attention. Its why a lot of people like to believe that men need to learn not to be violent etc ... its a broad simplification of the world that allows heroic action so long as we remain ignorant of the complexities and if those complexities arise they are recast to class or race issues etc ... Its an over awareness that paints the world black and white but most of all accessible, legible and with possible calls to action.

I've heard very very intelligent people say either you're a feminist or you're a sexist, there is no in between because in a lot of people's minds you either want to fix the world or you want it to stay the same. I don't believe that any more, but I miss the comfort of it.

Not sure the above applies to all people, but maybe is helpful.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 04:45 PM
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originally posted by: Hefficide
I began doing my own research and found myself smack in the middle of SJW rhetoric that did not help my understanding one iota.


I think it was this video that truely got me over the hump and took a "side".

This amped up my "conspiracy" side bigtime..Not a theory, a theory would require there be no evidence..it is an exposed conspiracy directed at altering media/gaming towards a specific agenda..it is like if there was a video of say, rockerfellers to report specific stories to alter the country towards a position...

Even if I agreed with the end quest, this type of authoritarianism is something that got smashed in the 40s in the west..it must be fought at every instance.

And then of course, you see how it has been pushing off since then
This video montage really sums up what is going on there..and amusingly enough using EC words to show how insane things have gone and how reversed these people have become against consumers for a specific political/social control agenda



Rape culture:
careful, bad language, and thunderf00t...but very important to watch


I will stop here.
I am disgusted that many liberals are allowing the radicals to redefine progressive politics to be synonymous with authoritarian corruption, belittling and destroying powerful words like rape, sexism, etc in order to...achieve..something?...

I love Factual Feminist. in my opinion, she is a dying breed of actual feminism seeking out equality.

science, reason, art, expression, and liberty..these are the things we as a society must strive for..what I am seeing is a parody of all these things ebbing their way into mainstream under a title I used to fondly stand behind.
edit on 13-6-2015 by SaturnFX because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 05:12 PM
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a reply to: SaturnFX

"SJW" feminism isn't even talked about in mainstream. These extreme identity politics aren't acknowledged, I don't know how much more rejected you can get than that.



posted on Jun, 13 2015 @ 06:55 PM
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originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: SaturnFX

"SJW" feminism isn't even talked about in mainstream. These extreme identity politics aren't acknowledged, I don't know how much more rejected you can get than that.





*


Jessica Valenti is a columnist and staff writer for Guardian US. She is the author of four books on feminism, politics and culture, and founder of Feministing.com.

Equality...

*
University of Missouri considers banning women from frat parties

*
Logic V emotion:

Overview bias

What isn't shown:


Technical bias

What isnt shown:


Race/hetro baiting:


Diversity officer who banned whites from her 'anti-racism' event at British university wiping away fake tear in front of 'no white men' sign


(she didn't lose her job btw..its ok, its just straight white men she wants to encourage killing..btw, replace straight with gay, white with black, or men with women and tell me what would happen if a "diversity" officer for a university said that)




I could go on but I think you get the point.
Its far from being rejected..its becoming the accepted norm. Its a near given in some areas as real (wage gap) and becoming more the acceptable norm in other areas (cis white men are scum overall)
Its frustrating..I know most thinking libs see the issue, but dismissing its growing hold on liberalism is akin to watching ultra-religious groups start overtaking sensible conservatism..it will paint the ideology harshly should it be left unchecked. A conservative will always pick on a liberal, and a liberal a conservative..nothing ever will change there, but if we, the traditional libs and egalitarians are to have anything left, we gotta police our own.
I am so detatched now that I am truely wondering if the label is gone now. if it is even worth trying to salvage. just call myself a civil libertarian and be done with it. I still think government can be used as a force of good in areas simply too big for any individual to overcome (environmental issues, healthcare structure), but...bah..just frustrating.



posted on Jun, 14 2015 @ 09:05 AM
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a reply to: SaturnFX

Feministing doesn't seem that bad and in a lot of places criticizes third wave feminism or mocks the notion that feminism is dominated by SJWs. Have you read anything she's written?

Academia... well some pretty crappy feminism goes on there, no argument there. It almost seems contrived. Kinda like all echo chambers. It also largely melts away as women graduate and grow up, realizing not every man that looks at them is raping them and hey he's cute I think I'm gonna look back. That's not to say that everything that comes out of academic feminism is horrible, but I wouldn't argue that most is... and it's always been that way. It has always largely ignored that most women want to shave their body hair and love having sex with men, love flirting, love being looked at. Love men. Well except of course for lesbians but a lot them like to shave too.

Do you remember being 18-25ish and finding that thing that made you identify? Generally it's that something we feel we've been lacking and standing on whatever it is makes us feel empowered, grown up. Not everyone goes through this but most of us do. For some women it's feminism, they felt oppressed as females for whatever reason... Dad was too controlling, they were brought up in a religion that taught women were subservient or they were abused physically or sexually.

It wasn't feminism for me, I was raised by my mother and taught always to be me, no overt feminist indoctrination... my mother just told me I was equal to men even if some men didn't agree or even if some women didn't agree... and I believed her. It was something else for me that I won't get into now cuz I'm already getting long winded... but that something was something I felt that had been oppressed by something else and so I wrapped myself in it, wore it like a badge of courage and honor and tried to correct the misconceptions about it when people saw my thing and their eyes widened. I was a warrior, championing for my thing. I was trying to grow up. The problem was that when I did grow up... I realized that this thing didn't have to define me and didn't the thing I was before define me and I didn't want it to.

Just as a lot of women realize that it's just as stupid to let a matriarchal society dictate that you don't shave as it is to let a patriarchal society dictate that you do shave (shaving is just an easy example), if you like being hairless, shave... if you don't then don't.

The equal pay thing... needs it's own thread lol.

The arrested for manspreading thing... I just had this argument with someone else, so I'm going to be lazy and summarize...

The actual offense (and it's ludicrous, overpolicing, targeting minorities etc) is taking up more than one seat on the MTA, it's been in their (the MTA) rules of conduct since 1985, long before tumblr, twitter and SJWs. The two men arrested were taking up more than one seat by "manspreading" it was the taking up more than one seat that is illegal (only when the train bus is crowded which the cop seemed to ignore and it's dumb anyway for it to be illegal), not the act of manspreading.

The SJW's didn't get the MTA to launch a campaign against manspreading either. The MTA asked for suggestions for a PSA campaign. Manspreading made the list and it was a list of about ten things not to do on the MTA.





posted on Jun, 15 2015 @ 03:00 AM
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a reply to: Kali74

I gotcha, and see what you're saying
I guess its just a different age. sure..back in the 90s, during my late teen/early 20 years I was also angst ridden and such and was finding ways to be edgy and trendy.
Didn't have social media amping up my foolishness to national levels though (thank god).
I think for me, its about how many areas are catering to this general extremism moreso than it needs to.

I think its good to find a cause to make the world a better place, but not by condemning the structures most people feel comfortable in just for the hell of it with no research to back it up. cis white men is now a social media curse verses an accepted norm. a woman in shape is now "fat shaming", a woman in love with her husband and liking being..well..dominated in a way, is now something actively shamed for her letting a man "rule" her, etc.

but I understand what you mean.

About manspreading:
perhaps the law of taking more than one seat was in place, but it became this social media, and therefore msm, firebrand due to these man---ing types crusading to stop all things masculine...I mean, stopping at a stoplight is the law, but if they call running a redlight, "manstopping"...suddenly there is an issue.

As far as if I read anything from feministing..no, I skimmed some articles at the front page, none of which interested me. it seemed all about finding some cause to fight..seemingly a lot about either not having kids, or trans issues.
as a man, I can say...not my problem. let people do and be who they want. it doesn't effect me.

One thing I will say though
about the trans stuff going on....
We need more science. I want to know if there are actual differences in the brain of a trans person vs cis person. its important, because if so, then ok, no more..but if not, if it truely is just a decision verses actual programmed differences, then there can be an issue raised..such as, why can someone decide they feel like a woman, but not feel black, white, walrus, etc.
if trans-sexual can be a thing, why can't trans-racial, trans-species, etc. I am asking not out of being an ass, but a genuine curiousity.
anthropomorphicism isn't a good trait to have, your car cannot have human emotions, and you dont know the mind of a cat, or a god, but isn't this the same thing..suggesting me, a guy, knows how a woman thinks is just me saying I think I know what they think, or reflect what I think they would think..which is potentially true, but probably horsecrap.
lots of questions here..probably needs a thread in itself actually.

I think you understand though in general how frustrating this is becoming for guys out there. My biggest wish is for moderate sane libs to speak out to show that liberalism isn't just some tween angst nonsense.
but
maybe it is time for both sides to be painted with the extreme voices only...push everyone into the center and find common ground in disgust for both radical sides.
might be a good thing in the long run.



posted on Jun, 15 2015 @ 06:38 AM
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a reply to: SaturnFX

In my opinion the moderate approach is always the best way. It's funny to me that, in our real lives ( speaking in general about humanity and not you, myself, or ATS members in general ) we are constantly put into situations to make concessions and, for the most part, we do so without any residual angst or being left feeling violated.

Spouse wants to make a purchase that we don't agree with? We state our case, they state theirs. In the end, if the purchase is not something that is going to break the bank or cause short or long term poverty? We usually cave in and say "Fine, get your thing."

We make concessions when dealing with coworkers on a regular basis - accepting that they are going to do whatever it is that irks us because, well, that is what they do. If we complain and our complaint doesn't pan out? We simply learn to live with things.

But then politics comes into play ( on any level ) and suddenly we ( again generally speaking ) become absolutists. I am left dumbfounded that we are still waging the Roe V Wade war some fifty-ish years past the decision. I'm stymied that race, gender, and even sexual orientation are openly attacked by our leaders on a fairly regular basis.

I'm also offended that SJW's seek to take large issues, subjectively process them, and spit them out as half-baked, overly reactionary distortions.

It's like we, as a culture, have one set of standards for our personal and real lives and an entirely different set for the public arena. We don't burn our real lives down around us - but give us a platform - and out come the gas and matches.




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