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Gee... Thanks For Helping The Telecoms and NSA China... We Appreciate It!

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posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 12:20 AM
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Hello once again ATS!

Given that I've covered similar issues many times over, I'm just going to assume that anyone reading this is already fairly fluent in the language of "cybersecurity" and aware of the realities vs the mind-numbingly obvious and endless attempts that the US Government keeps making to try and "make us safe" on the Internet.

Oh, BTW, you can swap "make us safe on the Internet" and "Control all content, spy freely, and hand out prison sentences that exceed most homicide prosecutions to anyone dumb enough to steal a movie or a few songs". Because that is really what the Government means by "safe". Not "safe" for you and me... but "safe" for Sony's bottom line.

Anyway. Here is the latest shot over the bow - and the latest excuse to try, yet again, against massive popular resistance, to seize control of the Internet on a Federal level.

Oh goodie...

Yup. China ( supposedly and theoretically ) hacked sensitive US Government servers and now the White House is gnawing on the old bone once again. Wanting to up the stakes in Cyberspace.

Read the article carefully and you'll notice that the word "steal" is used in the same context as espionage is implied:


"In some cases, it's non-state actors who are engaging in criminal activity and potential theft,"


While normally verbose - I'm just going to keep this short and sweet. I'm a civilian with limited resources and I can manage to keep my system secure without actually paying a dime to do so. A little knowledge and some basic habits and I sleep very soundly at night. Yes, I have to accept that a plethora of companies keep frighteningly detailed tabs on me and my activities - and that they happily share and sell that information to anyone interested - as does the NSA ( though I am not sure if they are in the "demographics research for profit" business... though it would not surprise me at all if they ( or some off the books shell company they happen to own does ).

The point is this. Uncle Sam's inability to keep a secure system is NOT a valid reason to strip rights and create new laws from whole cloth. It is NOT a valid reason to "clamp down" on Americans. And make no mistake - they are not discussing just getting tough with the packets headed to other nations. They are looking for that Holy Grail of an excuse to pwnbox the whole entire thing.

At this point I am honestly half convinced that somebody in the administration, somewhere, at some time - sat around at a "spitball brainstorm" party and said "Hey, we could always leave a HUGE open door into some really sensitive stuff - basically honeypot it with neon signs - and then FREAK OUT the entire country whenever somebody actually finds the open door...."

When we need Congress to have some ethics and realize that all of the laws that apply to mail and telephone calls HAVE to, inherently, also apply to the Internet - specifically that WARRANTS need to be involved before a single packet is intercepted, analyzed, or considered as evidence - instead we're stuck with a Congress ( and the two other branches - ALL failing in their "checks and balances" roles ) that wants our data, and the right to restrict it, use it, manipulate it, and prosecute us over it - so bad that they're starting to sound like Hitler in a Munich beer hall. All rhetoric, divisive and manipulative speaking, misinformation, and preying upon fear to try and get what they would otherwise NEVER be able to touch.

It's disgusting.

Oh, and the fact that "security" will end up going hand in hand with "pay to play" models of bandwidth access ( Watch for it, you'll see it )... we're left with the truth. All this BS is really about getting less for more from telecoms that DO NOT like "unlimited access". Especially not when they can look at their cellular divisions and see the fortunes rolling in from people paying much higher prices for tiered and metered mobile packages.

Lobbyists from the Telecoms lining the pockets of politicians who freak out over being hacked... The perfect storm to ensure that the NSA gets the power recently lost ( um, yeah, sure ) back AND we end up paying more because, you know, China n stuff.

What's next? Fox News announcing that analysts have discovered that Al Queda is actually based in Beijing? That's pretty much all they've got left to create the perfect BS storm.

Thanks for reading.




posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 12:41 AM
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Meanwhile in America, the NSA spies on the entire world, so does the FBI and the CIA and many other organizations try to penetrate the cyber security of every other nation on the planet.

As you say, this is just the introduction to 'The Government must take over the web.'

The ability of the people to get front row seats has already led to failed wars. The Vietnam War being the first when camera men sent home extremely disturbing images of the plight of civilians.

To continue with warfare, in the face of truth being freely available to the people back home, is to have those people object strongly.

All countries spy on each other, they always have and always will. It seems to me that China may be better at it. Amazingly, it seems that Russia is not even getting a look in .... ROFL.

The new force ... Cyber Warriors ... one to be cautious of. You do not need college degrees to be good at it, just look at the number of young teenagers that seem to be able to get into most places in cyber space.

Perhaps it is just that the Chinese education system is so much better.

P



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 03:47 AM
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a reply to: Hefficide

S&F with you all the way (from the UK) you make many points especially the one about deliberate compromise in order to get more legislation through. When a government especially in the west decides on a for profit war, people can now coordinate protest and its about time, as some politicians are so bent its unbelievable. Today its a weakness to bring your kids up to tell the truth because it makes them vulnerable to the unscrupulous in positions of power who don't.

Never have governments been faced with such a threat to their seats of power from their own people and its due to communication through the net only - because we now have information and a voice about their dealings, especially when these dealings steal from our taxes and put protestors in prison and people who take a lick at the huge lolly of profit for corporations and the elite who invest in them.



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 06:13 AM
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originally posted by: Hefficide


At this point I am honestly half convinced that somebody in the administration, somewhere, at some time - sat around at a "spitball brainstorm" party and said "Hey, we could always leave a HUGE open door into some really sensitive stuff - basically honeypot it with neon signs - and then FREAK OUT the entire country whenever somebody actually finds the open door...."


I agree with all you said except this. This "open door" would have been found long ago. Hmm, then again, maybe they just recently opened this door (thought that while typing just now).

The net cannot be controlled or shut down by the US government anymore though. it has become a global thing, with entire "off grid" internets available to those that look for them. It's almost alien how much the internet has become now.



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 06:16 AM
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a reply to: Hefficide

The TTIP treaty will have some dire consequences for internet freedom. we've seen nothing yet!


TPP – this so-called trade agreement would bring copyright enforcement provisions that threaten users’ right to free expression, privacy, and unfettered access to knowledge online. You would think the Western media would be covering this world-changing negotiation, as it affects the flow of information over numerous platforms and severely restricts what can be presented without compensation.


Source

Not sure of source is acceptable on ATS but a little Google search will bring the same results!



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 09:26 AM
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a reply to: Vector99

I honestly don't think anyone in the US Government wants to shut down the Internet. Now, "seize total control without appearing to do so"? THAT I believe is their wish and ultimate goal - one the Telecoms and companies like Google will almost certainly go along with - all with a "wink wink, nudge nudge" demeanor.

Nope, bread and circuses. While I haven't yet figured out what they plan for our "bread" to be, the circus most certainly is the one-two punch of cable television and Internet. The whole set-up is mind-blowingly simple. Over a generation or two they've desensitized the population to what is acceptable to pass as "news" and conditioned us all to expect it to be vitriolic, violent, frightening, polarizing, political and divisive. But this is all OK because they also know that, after watching it all, our hearts filled with rage and revolution... we're going to log into the Internet and post Tweets, FB status updates, and come to boards like ATS and jettison all of that anger and frustration on a keyboard.

One minute activism with instant gratification and payoff. Oh, and if you're really into your ego - you can sit and watch the likes, flags, plusses, stars, etc all pile up - proving to you that you are absolutely right!

It's not like the old days where you had to either scream at your TV ( been there done that ) or start knocking on neighborhood doors and ranting until you finally come across somebody who gets that glazed-over "Hell yes!" look in their eyes when you are going at full throttle.

What worries me the most is that once controls are established - and mark my words, the will be - then the PC fever will kick in. Suddenly it will become a "Family values" argument - much like just about everything else in America. By the end one angry letter from some butthurt person in Iowa will be enough to make national news AND get a website shut down forever... you know. For the "greater good"- as based upon one angry person from Iowa...



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 09:30 AM
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a reply to: Hefficide

touché good sir. the words you typed seem fresh out of my mind. (I mean that in a sincere way)
edit on 9-6-2015 by Vector99 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 09:35 AM
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a reply to: Hefficide

after taking a moment, wiping a tear from my eye since someone else gets it, I must ask. Do you think the infiltration has reached the unspeakable nets? I know they are monitored, but they cannot control the content and/or up/downtime of these webs, or can they? Money is powerful when it comes to truth. Do you think the "little webs" are, or can be controlled?



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 09:40 AM
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a reply to: Vector99

They definitely can be, and are actively monitored. The slew of arrests and the Silk Road founder sitting in prison prove it. The darknet is as compromised as anywhere else. In fact I'd have to look it up, but a few months back it leaked that Google spiders were mapping the darknet fairly effectively.

IMO the way they got to it all was by pwning TOR exit nodes. Owning the exit node ( and the data stream that comes with it ) pretty much makes TOR useless. I don't think they got all of them, not by a longshot. But I do think that the Feds do own several of them and any Onion router doing what it is supposed to do - changing IP's frequently - is bound to hit one sooner or later.



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 09:49 AM
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a reply to: Hefficide

Google did a bang up job of securing the net it seems, I've seen those spiders. Even the off-grid webs I know of still use TOR, and HAVE to at some point connect to the WWW, keeping anonymity low, but not 100%. FML (pardon the expression) bad day for us..



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 03:35 PM
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Great thread! I will tell you that I have a family member that has been deep in the alphabet intel for decades. He was in charge of sigint of the Chinese and Russian Navies at different points. His friend the Capt. aboard the ship in the Gulf of Tonkin incident. There is no signal or system that is safe or not being recorded or intercepted somehow. Back in Vietnam they dropped listening devices on poles all over the country to monitor ground movement. Today instead of telephone pole sized devices, we are talking nano. They actively trace the signals using backpack RF detection equipment in enemy countries, but they overwhelm the effort in sheer numbers of devices dropped.

I haven't checked lately about the status of the new facility in Utah, but they plan on recording everything planet wide. Bottom line is that we are already infiltrated and zipped up. Unless we devise some iron communications protocols, and I do not see how it is possible with having to allow any other person off the net in on it. We know they want us CT's and the like off the web and in prison if possible because we, with our unconventional views and willingness to dig into and reveal things no MSM or most common person would. Heck, the DOD even said the internet is an enemy weapons system. That is how our controllers see it. The problem is getting laws out the door they can start using current capabilities against the masses and prosecuting them for it. I heard once in a security seminar that the average person on the computer commits 4 felonies a day. Not sure where that comes from legally, but when people are prosecuted for deleting browser histories under Sarbanes-Oxley, and the Conspiracy laws that you have to see where they (TPTB and gov) want to take this issue.

The capabilities are beyond what anyone can really imagine without exposure to the real meat of these programs. One thing that has not happened in the past, but will be soon is that the sigint and recorded information of the intel agencies like the NSA are going to be shared with law enforcement. That should scare the bejesus out of anyone. Law Enforcement has been excluded except in federal cases of National Security. Once all the law enforcement can get a subpoena on an individual and everything ever recorded on that individuals use of signals is available, well good luck trying to defend yourself in court. You don't have the money or expertise to do so. Can you see how they will make some major examples out of people and scare the majority into not saying or doing anything that could be construed as conspiratorial, or whatever in any way?

I have caught myself not posting to certain threads, giving out inside information or telling of my experiences because I know what will happen to me if I said or divulged the wrong thing. I have said some general things, but never any detailed information. I know there are others on ATS that are also experienced and very careful about what they say. The threat is there and the capabilities. It is just a matter of a law or international treaty being signed that lawyers have a hard time interpreting that will unleash the restraints currently held on going after individuals. How are you as an individual going to be able to interpret the flavor of law this week? We have a broken and corrupt system, but imho the you will never undo what has been done. We can't hound dog every law and technological ability. Most of the abilities are black or classified anyway. The only thing we can do imho is get seriously personal protection laws passed. Laws that prevent the government or tptb from using this capability to target and prosecute or worse individuals except in cases of extreme National Security breaches. I don't think we are going to be able to stop the system, only get protection from it under our rights already under attack. For example: Free Speech Zones! That is the kind of BS government is capable of.

edit on 9/6/15 by spirit_horse because: typos



posted on Jun, 9 2015 @ 11:38 PM
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a reply to: Hefficide


Lobbyists from the Telecoms lining the pockets of politicians who freak out over being hacked... The perfect storm to ensure that the NSA gets the power recently lost ( um, yeah, sure ) back AND we end up paying more because, you know, China n stuff.

What's next? Fox News announcing that analysts have discovered that Al Queda is actually based in Beijing? That's pretty much all they've got left to create the perfect BS storm.

Thanks for reading.


I hear what you are saying. In my view there is an ongoing battle between man & machine, man keeps building them until they take over the world, it's a cyclical relationship.

NSA surveillance and anti-terror technologies are just fronts. Social media is a front. Smart phones, tablets are a front.
A front for what? A r t i f i c i a l I n t e l l i g e n c e and transhumanism,

H+



What I am saying is that you are in the world so you can make a change it's all up to you. Don't wait for Fox News to tell you what the new reality is or will be - we all have to go out there and make that reality in real life.

With regard to telecoms, it is just more fronts for A.I. and DoD. While we work and struggle day to day to survive it's nice to know that there are some people out there thinking about the future of humanity so far in advance that you don't have to worry about that!

DARPA designed the internet and the telecoms built it to spec. That's simple. In the early days it was satellites with TV so you could have the Tokyo Olympics, Apollo moon landings, Nixon's trip to China and the Elvis Aloha TV Special.

Did satellite TV help the starving poor in Africa in the last 50 years? No.
Did satellite TV help the military industrial complex distort our perceptions of reality in the last 50 years? Yes, it did.

There is a lot more at stake than low level graft at the telecoms... just recently there was an incident at the border down in Texas with the helicopter shooting. The telecoms do play a major role in the defense of our country, the USA. The Pentagon depends on telecoms to provide services. Sometimes these telecoms outsourced to off-shore foreign entities.. that means your customs & border patrol defense is now in the hands of some chump from the Philippines or India (no racism intended) who works for $3.50 a day.

Think about it! Look at us (as a human species) just 100 years ago. Telegraphs, telephones, envelops with postage stamps. There is no way we are going back. Unless you want to fantasize about Kevin Costner in "The Postman"

We, humanity will move forward. Moving forward means acceptance of technology not as a simply a tool but as an indispensable fifth appendage, for without technology, we are sub-human, we are animals.



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 08:45 AM
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a reply to: SayonaraJupiter

You sound like a sales person for AI and the PTB lol

"without technology, we are sub-human, we are animals" ----seriously, do you believe all the people who live in subsistence are sub-human? that's millions if not billions of people.

Oh and yes all humans are animals - or what would you categorise us as?

------------

Or have i missed your point and this is to do with 'The Postman' ??



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 10:18 AM
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China have been hacking the West - militarily, commercially, privately... you name it - since the concept was established. Why do you think their J-31 stealth fighter looks near-identical to the J-35s? Coincidence? lelz

China knew a long time ago that the only way to catch up to the West technologically and thereby economically, all while maintaining the Commies' grip their peoples' freedoms, was to steal there way back into the race. After all, the U.S. did it with the Germans (see: B-2 bomber design compared to early Nazi jet-fueled aircraft designs).

So, what better foil to use than China's rampant hacking to institute Sino-like Internet censorship? And what better vehicle to facilitate thus than the Trans-Pacific Partnership!

edit on 10-6-2015 by AlexJowls because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 11:04 AM
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a reply to: AlexJowls

The TPP can be modified to exclude Internet censorship.



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 11:39 AM
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originally posted by: ffx6554
The TPP can be modified to exclude Internet censorship.

I wouldn't know.

Because, not unlike everyone else who isn't a muzzled politician robotically endorsing it or a big business mogul poised to become a beneficiary of the TPP (all of whom are forbade from speaking of the details of the contract, much less releasing it to for public assessment until after the treaty is signed), I do not know the finer details of the TPP.

The only leads 'we' have to go on are the WikiLeak leaks and NAFTA -- both corpus delicti canaries in the coal mine which portent some serious ramifications for how government policies could potentially (read: even more likely) be influenced by corporations. Firstly, due to the latter (cashed up) parties' ability to sue nations directly for legislation that they don't particularly like (case in point: Philip Morris vs. cigarette plain packaging; potential case in point: 'unsanctioned' online media dissemination / acquisition, leading to effective Internet censorship / SOPA), and secondly, the loss of jobs through "free trade agreements" which allow local manufacturing to be moved offshore and the facilitation of foreign worker utilisation by local businesses in domestic workers' stead.

But above and beyond all that, the most baleful aspect of the TPP is IT IS BEING NEGOTIATED IN SECRET!! Even and idiot can see the looming danger inherent in the latter element of such an invidious pact as this...



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 11:40 AM
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a reply to: Hefficide

It's all about memes these days man, the almighty Facebook meme. If you can't come up with a decent argument, just find an angry meme and post it in the comment section. It works fantastic to shut down people more intelligent than yourself.

They don't even have to be true or factual. They just need to disrupt the intelligent people's train of thought and derail any intelligent conversation that was going on.

Aren't getting your way in an argument over gay rights on Facebook? Post a meme! Aren't getting your way over an argument on minimum wage? Post a meme!

Yep, memes...the bread and butter of the low-brow and socially inept internet commentator:


edit on 10-6-2015 by MystikMushroom because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 06:31 PM
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No one has mentioned the mossad which means no one knows as much as they think they do, haha.
edit on 10-6-2015 by circuitsports because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 08:18 PM
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What's next you ask?
Headlines like these:

Free Syrian Army hacks US banks, steals billion$ of your hard-earned money
Anonymous Hackers take down Northeastern US Power Grid


What? You need more headlines before you'll give us control?



posted on Jun, 10 2015 @ 11:02 PM
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originally posted by: johnb
a reply to: SayonaraJupiter

You sound like a sales person for AI and the PTB lol

"without technology, we are sub-human, we are animals" ----seriously, do you believe all the people who live in subsistence are sub-human? that's millions if not billions of people.

Oh and yes all humans are animals - or what would you categorise us as?

------------

Or have i missed your point and this is to do with 'The Postman' ??



Well, the OP's subject matter is pretty deep and the relationship between man & machine has been studied for a long time by economists, philosophers and scientists... George Orwell, Edward G. Ballard, Norbert Wiener, Karl Marx, Bill Gates


I'm not an expert on it (the relationship between man & machine) but I have done enough reading on the subject to be comfortable in saying that man is always in a relationship with technology.

But since the subject matter is indeed "deep" that kind of puts the pressure on me to start defining specific terms like tool, mankind, technology and relationship. I don't wanna dig that deeply in this thread because my response to the OP was just a casual post.

The exchange of technology between US & China is another link in the chain that binds mankind together with machines.

For example, it was President Nixon which opened up China in 1972 and in the last 43 years China has really upgraded their relationship with technology. We must remember that Wal-Mart is in China and has been for several years and it is important to remember that Wal-Mart has the 2nd largest logistics operation n the world, 2nd only to the Pentagon.

corporate.walmart.com...

And to clarify my remark about sub-humans, well, I have to again start defining terms which I really don't wanna do. Suffice to say, your definition of subsistence might be different than mine. I don't mean to say that garbage pit diggers in the slums of Brazil are sub-humans because they are not, by my definition, sub-humans, because they have access to all kinds of technology that comes out of the land fill.

A sub-human, is an animal, who subsists in nature without the benefit of technology. Technology is the tool which allows the sub-human to achieve an advantage over nature. The sub-human is elevated to humanity by this process of accumulating technologies over time.

An orangutang might fashion a spear out of a stick to get fish. A beaver might use it's teeth cut trees and tree limbs to build a damn to get fish. What does mankind do? Mankind fashions nets and hooks out of other resources available to him in nature and in doing this his escalation of power in the "wild kingdom" continues... until today... where we have unmanned drones dropping bombs and 100% of our internet is under surveillance.

It's kind of a Catch-22. What is more important, mankind? or technology? We have the power to answer that question every day and a lot of those who have decision making power are saying "technology is the answer" which means more surveillance, more drones, more RoboCops, more Terminators, more Agents of the Matrix.

Ultimately, there is no way to stop this escalating relationship between mankind & machines. The confrontation cannot be avoided, there will be trans-human cyborgs probably within our lifetime.

But personally, you have to take your own stance and decide how much technology is too much or not enough. Like the example of satellite TV... millions of Africans died of starvation. The satellites didn't give a damn about human life.




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