A Question About The Great Pyramid

The Great Pyramid isn't alone in it's concavity, the pyramid of Menkaure also has a slight concavity, as does the Red Pyramid at Dahshur - making it three pyramids known to have this feature. (Maragioglio and Rinaldi, Miroslav Verner) (source)



As noted, the concavity is too slight to be of any practical structural value - in other words, it does nothing as far as stabilizing the structure. It is either decorative or an artifact of how the pyramids were being laid out by it's engineers.

originally posted by: AKINOFTHEFIRSSTARS

My question is......

Is there any evidence to suggest the outer casing once reflected the interior design, which would be the face of the Great pyramid as we see it today.
Is there any historical reference or any mention of this is in anyone's observation? Or is there anything that would allude to the idea of the outer casing having the "double-per-side".

From my personal research, I would answer yes, although I can provide no Link - I can only explain what I have read and hopefully another member can confirm this -
It's been recorded by the ancients that - the shadow of the pyramid dissappeared into itself.

IMO that is a clear statement that the pyramid's outer polished limestone casings did indeed show the concavity of Giza's Great Pyramid.

We know today that the Great Pyramid uses sunlight to establish solstice/equinox which is simply an amazing feat of architecture, something until GPS surfaced we could not do. This is no accident leaving an inquisitive mind to believe the casings would also display this light coordinated statement, for it is actually one of the fundamental statements Giza is making in terms of astronomy and mathematics. Therefore IMO, the Great Pyramid's eight sides is no accident and intentionally designed to leave a message.

Ancient history has also recorded that the polished limestone outer casings were inscribed with a strange writing and astrological symbols..(Strabos maybe?)
Very interesting when considering how the pyramid makes use of sunlight during solstice/equinox time.

Anyhow - good question OP one I've pondered over many times often thinking if the pyramid did have inscriptions, did a King or priest copy them into a book..and if so - would that book ever surface???

History - that's what makes it fun - so many questions

a reply to: Rosinitiate


Hello- I usually don't answer any of the posts I make, I do read them but hardly ever reply (it has to do with "attachment" and not having to get in that ever important "last word") with that proviso being typed... I'm glad I'm not "imagining things" (AGAIN.. hahahaha)

Did You read the one about ISIS being backed by the U.S.? or that ISIS stands for Israeli Special Investigation Service and that is the reason for the full face covering and keeping their hands covered? (if You've answered "Yes" or nodded in the affirmative- Check out the thread about "Meditation contacting demons" How would You answer that query? And that is why I usually don't answer My posts. In that thread ISIS is raised in a manner, if that person hasn't read the above about ISIS then any reply is seen as a "defense"...)

"Someone" has gone all through the Middle East has destroyed antiquities that go back further than what is "On the books" perhaps this doesn't bode well for their 'agenda'?

ISIS (foe de jour) have plenty of HumVees so this may answer that age old question Can a HumVee™ destroy a pyramid? I'm going to bet "No" due to their sturdy construction add this to the fact that the driver's vision will be skewed looking through that 800 count Egyptian cotton sheet He picked up at the airport...

namaste

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer
The Great Pyramid isn't alone in it's concavity, the pyramid of Menkaure also has a slight concavity, as does the Red Pyramid at Dahshur - making it three pyramids known to have this feature. (Maragioglio and Rinaldi, Miroslav Verner) (source)

As noted, the concavity is too slight to be of any practical structural value - in other words, it does nothing as far as stabilizing the structure. It is either decorative or an artifact of how the pyramids were being laid out by it's engineers.

Good points, but you left out a third possibility - that of counter-perspective (aka forced perspective.)

It might be that such a broad expanse of flatness can look like it bulges up in the middle of the surface - the way columns appear to get thinner in the middle the taller they are.

The Greeks fixed the column illusion by making their columns thicker in the middle, thus rendering them "straight" to the eyes of observers on the ground that are looking up (they did several other little things like that to different aspects of their architecture - read about the architecture of the Parthenon if you don't know what I'm talking about.)

Perhaps the AEs put a little indentation in the center to offset an optical illusion.

Harte

originally posted by: AquarianTrumpet

From my personal research, I would answer yes, although I can provide no Link - I can only explain what I have read and hopefully another member can confirm this -
It's been recorded by the ancients that - the shadow of the pyramid dissappeared into itself.

IMO that is a clear statement that the pyramid's outer polished limestone casings did indeed show the concavity of Giza's Great Pyramid.
SNIP
We know today that the Great Pyramid uses sunlight to establish solstice/equinox which is simply an amazing feat of architecture, something until GPS surfaced we could not do.

We know no such thing. If you refer to the fact that the Pyramid "casts no shadow" at noon on the summer solstice, it actually does cast a small shadow (it's about 1 degree too far north to go completely shadowless.) It casts the same shadow at noon on the summer solstice that a pile of camel dung in front of the Great Pyramid casts.
If you think about it, it could be that fact that is referred to in your quote about it's shadow disappearing into itself. During the summer solstice, you could watch the GP's shadow creep eastward until it "disappeared" into the GP (barely a shadow, anyway, at that latitude.)
Of course, you could do the same with that pile of camel dung as well.

Care to explain how the GP marks the equinox?

Harte

originally posted by: Harte

We know no such thing. If you refer to the fact that the Pyramid "casts no shadow" at noon on the summer solstice, it actually does cast a small shadow (it's about 1 degree too far north to go completely shadowless.) It casts the same shadow at noon on the summer solstice that a pile of camel dung in front of the Great Pyramid casts.
If you think about it, it could be that fact that is referred to in your quote about it's shadow disappearing into itself. During the summer solstice, you could watch the GP's shadow creep eastward until it "disappeared" into the GP (barely a shadow, anyway, at that latitude.)
Of course, you could do the same with that pile of camel dung as well.

Care to explain how the GP marks the equinox?

Harte

www.earthmatrix.com...

www.math.nus.edu.sg... s/page03.htm

www.timstouse.com... gfacts.htm

bullet
Marks Spring Equinox: Due to the angle of the sides of the pyramid vs. its latitude, it casts no shadow at noon during the spring equinox.
bullet
Precession of the Equinoxes: The sum of the pyramid's two base diagonals in Pyramid Inches = length of the Precession of the Equinoxes (25,827 years)
bullet
Precession of the Equinoxes: The distance from the ceiling of the King's Chamber to the apex of the pyramid = 4,110.5 Pyramid Inches. Which is the radius of a circle whose circumference = the precession of the equinoxes. [4,110.5 * 2 * Pyramid Inches = 25,827]
bullet
Precession of the Equinoxes: The perimeter of the 35th course of blocks, which is much thicker than any of the other courses, gives a figure for the precession of the equinoxes

I suppose the camel dung could reflect the solstice - if you applied the same exact mathematics and solar mechanics needed to expose this use of light at exactly these specific times of year, but as you would have us believe - this is nothing hard to do..camels squat and do it all the time..

Lol - now that's some funny sh!t right there!

a reply to: Harte

That's actually a very good point, in fact it is the one theory that makes the most sense, as entasis has also been noted in Egyptian obelisks as well. (a cursory glance does show that scholars regard Egyptian pyramids as the first use of entasis in a built environment.)

From Notes of Research on the New York Obelisk

A corresponding curvature or entasis has already been noticed in several Egyptian obelisks. In the northern erect Obelisk of Queen Hatasu at Karnak, a decided convexity of at least one of its faces was observed by Verninac St. Maur. In the Obelisk of Thotmeses III, now in front of the Church of St. Giovanni in Laterano, at Rome, of which the shaft is 105 feet 7 inches in height, the western face is slightly convex, and the pyramidal finish at the top has a small convexity on each of the four sides. But the best known and most marked entasis occurs in the two obelisks of Luxor (of which is now at Paris). In each, the N.W. and S.E. sides are convex, to an extent of 0.030 and 0.035 meter respectively (1-1/2 and 1/1/3 inches), at the middle of the rounding, measured from a straight line across from edge to edge. In regard to the object of this curvature, Wilkinson states: "The faces, particularly those which are opposite to each other, are remarkable for a slight convexity of their centres, which appear to have been introduced to obviate the shadow thrown by the sun, even when on a line with a plane surface. The exterior angle thus formed, by intersecting lines of direction of either side of the face, is about 3 degrees." ...

It goes on a good bit longer, but suffice to say that Egyptians were demonstrably known to use entasis and quite sophisticated in how they used it, and long before the Greeks BTW. (The part I highlighted above would indicate the AEs use of entasis on a pyramidal shape) It would make a great deal of sense that their use of entasis on obelisks and pyramidions would be used for the larger pyramids as well.

To answer the OP's original question, did this feature appear on the outer face of the pyramid, it would be a pretty safe bet it did.

I would agree, and thanks for the word I couldn't remember for the life of me.

Harte

originally posted by: AquarianTrumpet

originally posted by: Harte

We know no such thing. If you refer to the fact that the Pyramid "casts no shadow" at noon on the summer solstice, it actually does cast a small shadow (it's about 1 degree too far north to go completely shadowless.) It casts the same shadow at noon on the summer solstice that a pile of camel dung in front of the Great Pyramid casts.
If you think about it, it could be that fact that is referred to in your quote about it's shadow disappearing into itself. During the summer solstice, you could watch the GP's shadow creep eastward until it "disappeared" into the GP (barely a shadow, anyway, at that latitude.)
Of course, you could do the same with that pile of camel dung as well.

Care to explain how the GP marks the equinox?

Harte

www.earthmatrix.com...

www.math.nus.edu.sg... s/page03.htm

www.timstouse.com... gfacts.htm

bullet
Marks Spring Equinox: Due to the angle of the sides of the pyramid vs. its latitude, it casts no shadow at noon during the spring equinox.
bullet
Precession of the Equinoxes: The sum of the pyramid's two base diagonals in Pyramid Inches = length of the Precession of the Equinoxes (25,827 years)
bullet
Precession of the Equinoxes: The distance from the ceiling of the King's Chamber to the apex of the pyramid = 4,110.5 Pyramid Inches. Which is the radius of a circle whose circumference = the precession of the equinoxes. [4,110.5 * 2 * Pyramid Inches = 25,827]
bullet
Precession of the Equinoxes: The perimeter of the 35th course of blocks, which is much thicker than any of the other courses, gives a figure for the precession of the equinoxes

I suppose the camel dung could reflect the solstice - if you applied the same exact mathematics and solar mechanics needed to expose this use of light at exactly these specific times of year, but as you would have us believe - this is nothing hard to do..camels squat and do it all the time..

Lol - now that's some funny sh!t right there!

Sorry, no.

The point is that it is a fact that anything throwing any shadow at all at that latitude would "mark" the solstice in exactly the same way as the Great Pyramid.

Your quoted claim about the equinox is rubbish, by the way.

The first quote has confused the solstice for the equinox.

The second quote is numerology.

The third quote is the sharpshooter's fallacy - and the 35th course of blocks isn't particularly remarkable, nor is it "much thicker" Than other courses.

There is a pattern in the courses where every 10th to 15th (or so) course is thicker. Add this to the fact that the stones get smaller as you go up.
Table of thicknesses by course number: link

Graphic display of the pattern I mentioned:link2

Note that the 1st course is thicker, and the second course is a mere 0.7 inches less in thickness than the 35th.

Harte

originally posted by: Harte
Sorry, no.

The point is that it is a fact that anything throwing any shadow at all at that latitude would "mark" the solstice in exactly the same way as the Great Pyramid.

Your quoted claim about the equinox is rubbish, by the way.

Harte

My 1st quote used the term sosltice/equinox, and even though the word Solstice appeared 1st in both quotes - I appreciate your need to correct this statement

Thank you for the Links: I will be sure to use them in the future

As for your statement of camel dung and the Great Pyramid sosltice alignment - please explain how the other buildings located around the pyramids don't show this design..after all - camel dung can do it???

originally posted by: AquarianTrumpet
As for your statement of camel dung and the Great Pyramid sosltice alignment - please explain how the other buildings located around the pyramids don't show this design..after all - camel dung can do it???

No explanation needed. As I said, anything at that latitude does this. It would be perfect at 23 degrees. The GP is at approximately 30 degrees, which is why I said there would be a small shadow.

For the GP's shadow to perfectly "disappear," the Pyramid would have to be tilted toward the South at an angle of about 7 degrees.

Harte

Not sure if this answers the OP's question sufficiently ...or Mr Harte's inquires..

belsebuub.com... e-autumn-equinox

At midnight on the autumn equinox in 2,170 BC, the pole star Alpha Draconis/Thuban, the chief star of the constellation Draco, depicted as a dragon and associated with the most deadly monster of Greek mythology called Typhon, shone down the central axis of the descending passage of the Great Pyramid. This was the North Star at the time. It is calculated that at precisely the same instant in 2,170 BC, Alcyone, the star in the Pleiades group which our sun and solar system revolves around, stood exactly on the meridian of the Great Pyramid at that point in the heavens which is at right angles to the downward inclination of the descending passage.

Alpha Draconis also aligned with the descending passage in 3,350 BC. The next alignment was much more recently in AD 2004 with the North Star Polaris, in which its light was said to shine all the way down to the subterranean pit inside the pyramid on the autumn equinox. Polaris in Greek means Satan, which in this case is another name for Lucifer, the light-bringer, who is the tempter that must be overcome in order to attain light.

The Great Pyramid itself functioned as an enormous sundial. Its shadow to the north, and its reflected sunlight to the south, accurately marked the annual dates of both the solstices and the equinoxes. Two of its faces are orientated precisely due east and west, which are the exact points of the rising and setting sun, only only on the spring and autumn equinoxeson the spring and autumn equinoxes.

The Great Pyramids eight sides
A photo taken at the spring equinox that revealed for the first time that the Great Pyramid was eight-sided
The four sides of the Great Pyramid are concave, which actually gives the pyramid eight faces instead of four. This is only perceptible from the air at dawn and sunset on the spring and autumn equinoxes.

Professor Robert Temple believes that just before and after these dates the western vertical halves of the north and south faces would have flashed with the sunlight at dawn, when the Great Pyramid still had its white limestone outer casing. The eastern vertical halves of the same faces would have flashed at sunset. The ceasing of the flash would prove that the equinox had arrived as the sun was briefly absolutely dead-on. This flash of light would have been visible for miles around, and is believed to have even been visible from the moon—from which the pyramid would appear to light up like a star.

originally posted by: AquarianTrumpet
Not sure if this answers the OP's question sufficiently ...or Mr Harte's inquires..

belsebuub.com... e-autumn-equinox

At midnight on the autumn equinox in 2,170 BC, the pole star Alpha Draconis/Thuban, the chief star of the constellation Draco, depicted as a dragon and associated with the most deadly monster of Greek mythology called Typhon, shone down the central axis of the descending passage of the Great Pyramid. This was the North Star at the time.

The descending passage begins on the South side.

How'd the North star shine down it?

Total crap.

Once again.

Harte

originally posted by: AKINOFTHEFIRSSTARSMy question is......

Is there any evidence to suggest the outer casing once reflected the interior design

Not in the Hieroglyphs I could find. That would be cool. To find an Egyptian image of a pyramid, to see how they saw it. Until then...


Mike Grouchy

originally posted by: Harte

At midnight on the autumn equinox in 2,170 BC, the pole star Alpha Draconis/Thuban, the chief star of the constellation Draco, depicted as a dragon and associated with the most deadly monster of Greek mythology called Typhon, shone down the central axis of the descending passage of the Great Pyramid. This was the North Star at the time.

The descending passage begins on the South side.

How'd the North star shine down it?

Total crap.

Once again.

Harte

Lol Harte - great sense of humor!!!

The article is telling you THE STARS MOVE!

You knew that.. ..didn't you???

Oh, you didn't?

Okay - well..the pyramid is stationary - and the stars appear to revolve in the night sky due to Earth's tilted axis...
Therefore the article is saying during that particular epoch, as the Heavens revolved, the then North Star (Alpha Draconis) for a brief period shone down through the Pyramids entrance onward to the Subterranean Chamber. (in reality - the Earth revolving aligned the Pyramid entrance with the Northern Star)

It isn't rocket science - you just have to read what is written.

a reply to: AquarianTrumpet


This may have evolved out of the need for a simple way to square the masonry surfaces using light and shadow.
As previously explained Camel dung torches at night would provide plenty of shadow to reveal places below the plane.

Could the concavity observed at the solstice have been the deliberate message "a little more than four"?

It would be easier to prove it was just an artifact, a result of the building technique eg (ramped corners).

originally posted by: AquarianTrumpet

originally posted by: Harte

At midnight on the autumn equinox in 2,170 BC, the pole star Alpha Draconis/Thuban, the chief star of the constellation Draco, depicted as a dragon and associated with the most deadly monster of Greek mythology called Typhon, shone down the central axis of the descending passage of the Great Pyramid. This was the North Star at the time.

The descending passage begins on the South side.

How'd the North star shine down it?

Total crap.

Once again.

Harte

Lol Harte - great sense of humor!!!

The article is telling you THE STARS MOVE!

You knew that.. ..didn't you???

Oh, you didn't?

Okay - well..the pyramid is stationary - and the stars appear to revolve in the night sky due to Earth's tilted axis...
Therefore the article is saying during that particular epoch, as the Heavens revolved, the then North Star (Alpha Draconis) for a brief period shone down through the Pyramids entrance onward to the Subterranean Chamber. (in reality - the Earth revolving aligned the Pyramid entrance with the Northern Star)

It isn't rocket science - you just have to read what is written.

Impossible unless the authors think at some point the earth flipped. So apparently these guys need to learn science because no that theory is far from rocket science well any science for that matter.

Now as for the shadow the pyramid casts the same shadow as any other building or street lamp or camel dung. The suns position is 1 degree off to cast no shadow. This has to do with the earth not the pyramid can't believe this is even being discussed.

Impossible astronomy aside, the shafts come to an end around 20 feet before reaching the exterior (and they aren't straight), so no stars have ever "shone down" them.

The shaft issue aside, the pyramid astronomy bit has got me curious.

Google produced this:
www.nytimes.com...

Does anyone have more (up to date) information?

originally posted by: AquarianTrumpet

originally posted by: Harte

At midnight on the autumn equinox in 2,170 BC, the pole star Alpha Draconis/Thuban, the chief star of the constellation Draco, depicted as a dragon and associated with the most deadly monster of Greek mythology called Typhon, shone down the central axis of the descending passage of the Great Pyramid. This was the North Star at the time.

The descending passage begins on the South side.

How'd the North star shine down it?

Total crap.

Once again.

Harte

Lol Harte - great sense of humor!!!

The article is telling you THE STARS MOVE!

You knew that.. ..didn't you???

Oh, you didn't?

Okay - well..the pyramid is stationary - and the stars appear to revolve in the night sky due to Earth's tilted axis...
Therefore the article is saying during that particular epoch, as the Heavens revolved, the then North Star (Alpha Draconis) for a brief period shone down through the Pyramids entrance onward to the Subterranean Chamber. (in reality - the Earth revolving aligned the Pyramid entrance with the Northern Star)

It isn't rocket science - you just have to read what is written.

I apologize for saying South when I mean East.

However, did your quote not state that the star in question was the North star at the time?

Do any of the small collection of circumpolar stars that take turns being the North star over eons ever shine from the East?

You really need to get a grip.

Harte