Satellite images show clearly that Russia faked its MH17 report

ETA
and exposing YOUR SOURCE'S employer(s) IS on topic dude

a reply to: Danbones

if you read you would have noticed
the source was Al martin

Well seems Al isn't as good a source as you think...

Nothing about it here...

www.theguardian.com...

Or here...but I did find this to be interesting...

Despite his public transformation, he was barred from entering the United States, which he found hypocritical, considering that Yasser Arafat and Gerry Adams, leaders aligned with violent political groups, were embraced by the White House. Partly to blame, he said, was his refusal to work for the CIA with the promise of a seven-figure salary, a home in California and a fresh identity.

www.washingtonpost.com...

So he was hired to work for a government agency that is in a country he is barred from entering...how does that work?

As it was said already...you need a better source than Prison Planet and Alex Jones.

a reply to: Danbones

and exposing YOUR SOURCE'S employer(s) IS on topic dude

Are you really in a place to talk about someones source when you provided a source that was just proven wrong?

originally posted by: greyhat
a reply to: tommyjo

Belarus or Russian Rockets?

Yes Russian military. The heads of state were there at a summit meeting.

May 8 (Reuters) - President Vladimir Putin oversaw test launches of Russian military rockets on Thursday during training exercises held across Russia the day before celebrations of the anniversary of its World War Two victory.

It was announced in November last year," he told journalists at the Defence Ministry, alongside Defence Minister Sergei Shoigu.

"The exercises will involve all branches of the armed forces across the country," he said.

The training exercises, which are due to include ground troops and artillery as well as the air force, were held during a summit of heads of state of a security bloc made up of former Soviet states.

Link

The following is not my research but thanks to Lena who posted on Bellingcat comments. Link at bottom.

9M38M1 being used by Russian forces during 2014. You'll see a mixture of training rounds and live. Yes they are actually firing them at Telemba! You can see the dates on the screens at 2:13 (19th March 2014). Remember the quote from Almaz-Antei ?

"The missile 9M38 (M1) complex "Buk-M1" was discontinued in 1999. Then all of the remaining available missiles of this type have been transferred to foreign customers."

Link



Also available on Russian TV.

Link

9M38M1 in 2015



Russian forces TV

Link

9M38M1s being transported during 2014 Belgorod, Russia.



Bellingcat Link

Yes the Buk-M1 is an old missile, but to claim that it is out of Russian Military service is completely inaccurate. Yes it is being replaced by updated variants but the missile is still in service. The older variants will be favoured for missile tests and training and that is nothing unusual. There is still shelf life left in the inventory. All Almaz-Antei representatives have done is simply dangle a red herring that doesn't actually stand-up to scrutiny by claiming that all M1 missiles have been transferred to foreign customers.

independent digital sleuths eh. if you into rubbish like that to help reinforce your indoctrination of propoganda by our wonderful news service that's fine with me but perhaps others still want to know why a passenger jet was flying relatively low in a known war zone. Guess they had to get MH17 down to 30,000 feet so they could shoot it down to entice rest of world into WW3 with Russia.

A Malaysian Airlines spokesman has already confirmed that, for some unknown reason, Kiev-based Ukrainian Air Traffic Control (ATC) ordered MH17 off of its original flight path along the international air route, known as L980.

As MH17 moved into Ukrainian air space, it was moved by ATC Kiev approximately 200 miles north – putting it on a new course, heading directly into a war zone, a well-known dangerous area by now – one that’s hosted a number of downed military craft over the previous 3 weeks.

Robert Mark, a commercial pilot and editor of Aviation International News Safety magazine, confirmed that most Malaysia Airlines flights from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur would normally travel along a route significantly further south than the route MH17 was diverted onto. Data on all airline flight records can be found here.

The BBC reported on July 17th: “Ukraine’s SBU security service has confiscated recordings of conversations between Ukrainian air traffic control officers and the crew of the doomed airliner, a source in Kiev has told Interfax news agency.

link

a reply to: glend

Low?

MH17 was only a few thousand feet above the minimum altitude for commercial aircraft before it became restricted airspace. MH17 was NOT the only flight in the area at the time of the shoot down either.

All Commercial aircraft were restricted to be above a certain altitude because of the manpads being used by the rebels to engage military aircraft. Even then the manpads could not reach that altitude. The only thing that could would be SAM's and in this case a BUK brought down MH17.

Secondly the information contained in your post have already been debunked - Like ATC moving MH17 off its course. Secondly anytime there is a disaster involving aircraft the ATC recordings / logs automatically become evidence and are seized. Even here in the states its standard procedure (and we go one step further by securing the individuals present as well).

The operational range of buks is anywhere from 200 feet to 15 miles (79k feet). There would have been no reason to have a flight descend lower.

The rebels claimed responsibility. I think it was accidental.

Rule #1 - Don't engage a target you have not identified.

a reply to: glend

You mention indoctrination by propaganda yet you post old debunked propaganda.

Oh the irony...

The more seasoned pro-russian propagandists have backed off of that theory as one would back off from a Sunni with a bomb vest yelling ala snack bar.

a reply to: alphastrike101

Yes I read that rebels claimed responsibility and I have also read counter propaganda, that Russia has testimony from Ukrainian support crew of a SU25 that returned without its air to air missiles soon after the incident.

I believe neither. The only people that can really tell the truth are the researchers examining the remains of MH17. They have almost been as quiet as US government on the issue. Their silence is deafening.

a reply to: glend

Russia has also backed off the Su-25 theory as well.

The most recent story from Russia is that it was from a buk launcher. Thus the Russian satellite images in question, mentioned in the op.

I know the Russian propaganda is a web of lies and webs of lies are hard to follow.

The US government has not been silent just simply stuck to its story.

originally posted by: glend
a reply to: alphastrike101

Yes I read that rebels claimed responsibility and I have also read counter propaganda, that Russia has testimony from Ukrainian support crew of a SU25 that returned without its air to air missiles soon after the incident.

I believe neither. The only people that can really tell the truth are the researchers examining the remains of MH17. They have almost been as quiet as US government on the issue. Their silence is deafening.

They agreed to keep their findings secret until their final report this summer. Ironically, Cyber-Berkut leaked a document they stole from Ukrainian Intelligence: it was a BUK. (Ironically because they thought it incriminated Kyiv instead of the rebels. I will go into depth about this incident in my upcoming thread.)

a reply to: glend

You do realize that the Russian have signed off on the preliminary MH17 report? The Russians reviewed the report before publication so where are their claims that the flight path or height data is wrong?

The draft preliminary report has been sent to the Accredited Representatives of the States that participate in the investigation, Malaysia, Ukraine, the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom, the Unites States of America and Austrailia for review. All Accredited Representatives have sent a reaction. The Dutch Safety Board assessed the provided suggestion and amended the report where appropriate.

The Russians officially agree with the MH17 flight path.

MH17
report

According to the preliminary report by the Dutch Safety Board, the filed flight plan called for MH17 to fly at flight level 330 (FL330) above Ukraine until the waypoint PEKIT, then climb to flight level 350.

At 12.53 hrs MH17 was asked if it could climb to flight level 350 in accordance with the filed flight plan, but they replied that they were unable to comply and requested to maintain at flight level 330. This change of plan was agreed, and other aircraft in the area were told to climb to flight level 350 to avoid a potential separation conflict with MH17.

The crew of MH17 asked to divert the flight path by 20 nautical miles due to bad weather they could see on their route. MH17 then asked if flight level 340 was available. They were told that it was not available due to the other civilian aircraft being assigned heights in order to deconflict with MH17. That is why MH17 continued on its altitude of 33,000 feet.

Read the preliminary report that even the Russians agree with and signed off on. What next? Will you be bringing up the other myth about the previous 10 flights?

www.metabunk.org...

a reply to: tommyjo

Wouldn't surprise me if they chose the older missile, to keep this very kind of discussion ambiguous..

ETA: Just realised that would imply they intended to down a plane like MH17, so probably not.

As you were!

Russia again fakes evidence on MH17 crash - Bellingcat experts

Claims by representatives of Russian military concern Almaz-Antey that a Ukrainian missile shot down Malaysian Airlines Flight MH17 in July last year are untrue, according to an analysis of experts from fact-checking project Bellingcat, news Web site Meduza has reported.

Bellingcat founder Eliot Higgins said that the MH17 was destroyed by a Buk missile system that was transported through the territory controlled by the separatists in a truck on July 17 and 18.

"Apparently, the anti-aircraft missile system was equipped with 9M38M1 missiles, so we agree that this report refers to the same [type pf missile]. As for the trajectory of the missile, we rely on our research, according to which the launch site was south of Snizhne, which is different from the place indicated by Almaz-Antey" Higgins said.

"I am convinced that the experts of Almaz-Antey are lying about the launch site. That is why they made a proposal to recreate the crash of the aircraft, realizing that no one would agree to this. After all, who wants to buy an airplane that is just going to be shot down?" the Bellingcat founder added.

Journalists previously noted that the presentation by Almaz-Antey repeated almost verbatim a report leaked by “Russian engineers” to Russian newspaper Novaya Gazeta about a month ago. It included pictures provided by the Russian Defense Ministry indicating that the launch was from the village of Zaroschenske.

Shortly before the press conference of Almaz-Antey, Bellingcat released its own report, which indicated that those pictures were fake.

The pictures were later removed from the Almaz-Antey report.

edit on 9-6-2015 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

a reply to: glend

How about the real truth...

Malaysia's transport minister, Datuk Seri Liow Tiong Lai, told a press conference: "MH17's flight path was a busy major airway, like a highway in the sky. It followed a route which was set out by the international aviation authorities, approved by Eurocontrol, and used by hundreds of other aircraft.

"MH17 flew at an altitude that was set and deemed safe by local air traffic control, and it never strayed into restricted airspace. The flight and its operators followed the rules. But on the ground, the rules of war were broken."

Others, however, had been continuing to use the route, which is one of the "aerial motorways" between northern Europe and south Asia. Malaysia Airlines was one of more than a dozen that flew the route on Thursday. Its flight MH17 was only a few miles from an Air India Boeing 787 and a Singapore Airlines 777 when it was shot down. The only restriction placed on the route by the Ukrainian government was that aircraft must remain above 32,000ft.

www.theguardian.com...

And they were at 33000 ft which is where they were supposed to be.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

I think we have reached a point where if Russia / Russian rebels came out tomorrow and stated they shot it down some people on this site would still claim its a lie.

a reply to: Xcathdra

I think we have reached a point where if Russia / Russian rebels came out tomorrow and stated they shot it down some people on this site would still claim its a lie.

I will almost guarantee that would happen.

a reply to: Xcathdra

think we have reached a point where if Russia / Russian rebels came out tomorrow and stated they shot it down some people on this site would still claim its a lie.

Its not that at all Xcathdra, I have no loyalty to any country because all threaten our God given rights for freedom. But when you see a situation that leads to the introduction of economic sanctions against one of the worlds major powers you really have to scrutiny the situation in today's wars of plunder (aka Wars against Terrorism).

If they had proof Russian forces took down MH17 it would have been continually repeated over media 1000's of times every single day. But we are not seeing that at all. I know Russia isn't responsible by their silence.

a reply to: glend

That would be because in the west we use the rule of law an innocent until proven guilty. Releasing investigative information can have an adverse effect on criminal proceedings.

Russia is the only that continually gives theories and provides falsified information to support those theories.

I stand by my comment that if Russia / Russian rebels were to announce they were behind it you would see people calling it a lie. They continually do it with regards to the black sea agreement. They do it with non insignia troops invading Crimea.

The Dutch investigation will be done around October. Dollars to donuts any conclusions linking Russia or Russian rebels will be dismissed out of hand, regardless of the evidence provided to support the conclusion.

Is GNOSOS going to be the next to be debunked, just like Bellingcat ?
GNOSOS suggests some changes in air defense in Syria. Why ?

I suggest some changes in air defense in Britain!