It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Why does Religious Conservatism Embrace Ignorance?

page: 1
30
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join
share:
+11 more 
posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:33 PM
link   
Ok so many of you have read the thread title and are probably already extremely mad at me, but bare with me. I have a point here. First off, let me explain why I am writing this thread. Certain people have recently questioned my political affiliations in various threads that brush along political lines, asking me questions like, "Aren't you a Libertarian?" when I post an opinion that doesn't toe the conservative line.

First, let me answer that question before anyone decides to ask it again in this thread. Yes, but I also don't vote strictly along party lines. My ideals can be more described as moderate. I like Libertarianism because I think a smaller government DOES work more efficiently, but I also at times see how private interests abuse this concept to the detriment of others. So I am willing to sacrifice my ideals so that our country can extend its rights to more and more demographics of people.

That being said, I DO want to lean right politically. Believe it or not. It's just that mainstream conservative beliefs have become so ludicrous and dumb that I can't relate to it anymore. For one, why do I have to be religious to be a Conservative? Why do they HAVE to be linked? Naturally, some of you will tell me that they don't have to be, but all evidence shows that the modern conservative movement is intricately linked to religiousism, namely Christianity.

So now you may be wondering where this stupidity and ignorance I'm talking about comes from. Well everywhere really. The entire modern conservative movement, from its roots to its beliefs is based outside of reality, and I plan to explain why. This isn't an opinion, it's straight up facts by the way.

Let's start with a history lesson. Where and when did religious conservatism start? Religious conversatism started with the creation of the "Christian Nation" myth. A myth that was created by big moneyed interests looking to combat Social ism from the New Deal. Ok let's stop for a second here and analyze the word "conservative". Conservative, as defined by Merrim-Webster, as "tending or disposed to maintain existing views, conditions, or institutions". Therefore it reasons that Conservatives want things to go back to older ways. Well here is the FIRST inconsistency we come to. Socialism is an OLDER political idea than this religious political idea.

But here is where the ignorance comes in, Conservatives just rewrite history to say that it was always a Christian nation. This way they can pretend like their ideals are ACTUALLY conservative, when in reality, they are actually Progressive (since they are newer).

This isn't the only example of Conservatives rewriting history because they don't like what it says. I don't care how you slice it, THIS is promoting and embracing ignorance. But this ignorance isn't just isolated to history classes. It shows up in the rhetoric and political ideology as well.

Edit: It just occurred to me that the previous link is an example of Conservatives doing what they always call Progressives out on, nannying the children so that they aren't exposed to dangers.

Do you believe in Evolution? Do you believe in man made Climate Change? If you are a religious Conservative, chances are that the answer to both of those questions is no. This is odd, because science has pretty much determined that these are real things. But again we will see how Conservative ideology utilizes ignorance to express their beliefs. Let's start off with the obvious. The people who don't want you to believe in climate change have teamed up with the people who don't want you to believe in Evolution to express a double whammy of dumb science denialism.

Even Conservative rhetoric is just another example of people being proud to be uninformed and willing to express it loudly. What's the first thing a conservative says about the colleges or school system in this country? They call them liberal indoctrination centers. Do you ever stop to consider how effing stupid that label is? Colleges and schools teach information and facts. Yes there is political slant there, but facts are facts regardless of political affiliation. Just because some teachers and professors may bring their politics into the classroom doesn't mean that they are teaching lies. In fact, why even bastardize learning institutions? Is being smart bad? Do you HONESTLY think that it is due to indoctrination that many people who go to college end up understanding evolution, climate change, the true origins of this nation, etc? Or is it MORE likely that these are just the facts, and you who are decrying the institutions are just extending a war between the dumb and the smart.

To sum up here, I really WOULD like to be conservative, but this unilateral war the right pitches behind the (relatively) new idea of Religious Conservatism against intellectua is just absurd. I'm sorry, but as long as the right embraces ignorance I can't support these things. The right needs to grow up and join the 21st century. Wallowing in ignorance and attacking people smarter than you is just a waste of time. Just go get educated so that we can refocus the political debate to REAL political issues again, instead of this mock battles between facts and lies.
edit on 29-5-2015 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:40 PM
link   
The ignorance comes from just believing that the Christian God is the one true god, implying all others are false. Its hammered into every Churchian. There is no proof of this, just believe it, just profess it, and just convince others to do the same.

Wallah! Exceptionalism, Arrogance, and the need to convert others (or else) becomes the norm.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:47 PM
link   
a reply to: intrptr

You know, I MAY agree with you on that, but something like 75% of Democrats are also Christian. So there has to be more at work here than just because they believe 2000 year old fairy tales.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:49 PM
link   
a reply to: Krazysh0t

By definition, a conservative rejects change. It's highly doubtful anyone will be persuaded or changed by pointing this out. It will evoke standard defense programs.

Given how many times conservatives have fought change and lost, you almost have to choose ignorance to pretend that an arbitrary state in the past is optimum. I'll always be in awe of that.

Religion demands operatives follow a set of rules that replace free will. It's non-trivial for a human to do that, so ignorance ends up being one of the meme rules.

So religious conservatives are doubly hardened to new inputs. Orthodoxy is a virtue and regression is progress.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:50 PM
link   
You bring up some very good points and I commend your honesty.

To understand the new conservative ideology, you have to first recognize that they have fallen for their own propaganda. Media sources like Fox News and talk radio have, for many years, churned out lies, disinformation, rhetoric and propaganda that has propagated the ideas that have turned the conservatives/Republicans in to mindless drones.

In their ideology, the only true "american" is a christian, pro-war, pro-israel, anti-gay, anti-choice individual that loves America regardless of the consequences and sells out to big business to the detriment of the people.

In all reality, a comparison can be made between the conservative Right and the population in Nazi Germany. The propaganda works so well that both had/has become a textbook example of jingoism. The Nazis took their extreme nationaism and used it to justify the killing of millions of people. Their enemy being the Jew. In the case of America, we are using our extreme nationalism to kill million as well. Our enemy being the muslim.

We have become the new millennium Nazis. You can thank "conservatism" for that.
edit on 29-5-2015 by introvert because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:54 PM
link   
The way I see it, our entire social structure is based on pointing out flaws in others while never addressing our own.

Once we add in the idea of eternal punishment/reward with a stronger emphasis on what we say (rather than what we do), it manifests in the way that we see a well as a polar opposite.

Conversion attempts ensue, regardless of ideology. However, when what is said appeals to our own bias, it not only appears as unbiased to our perspective, it is perceived as "Truth."

For thousands of years, our approach towards those who think differently is to either convert or destroy. This is bound to manifest in every ideology in existence, with the only exception being the ideologies that specifically assign a value to the diversity. I'm not aware of any 'official' social groups that embrace diversity in belief and ideology.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:55 PM
link   
a reply to: InverseLookingGlass

This is what gets me about that idea. This idea of religious conservatism is literally the newest political ideology in the American landscape. The progressivism born from the Civil Rights movement, is really just rebranded Socialism mixed with a bit of Libertarianism (you know, spreading rights equally and all that). By adhering to it, you AREN'T adhering to the way things used to be, but to a way things NEVER were.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:56 PM
link   
If you could figure out how to get the Rep Party back, I'd be greatful.

I don't really discuss my pokitics on ATS, because they are a bit extreme.

However, there will always be leaders and followers. We need both Liberal and Conservative politicians working together for the whole.

IMO the Christian Right has created the divide. They just want to dictate via ideology control.

"Control the mind -- Control the world".



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:57 PM
link   
a reply to: Krazysh0t


but something like 75% of Democrats are also Christian. So there has to be more at work here than just because they believe 2000 year old fairy tales.

Subjective poll results in that link. Most people don't survey truthfully about their beliefs. They go with the majority or hide their fear of standing out.

Whether they actually believe anything or not. Personally, I think religion is used as a control measure, getting people to believe in something without proof is good practice when it comes to convincing them to fight a "war on terror", for instance.

Its better to just go with the majority, nationalistic pride, our god vs theirs or mob rule, whachamahavyou.

edit on 29-5-2015 by intrptr because: spelling, change



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 12:57 PM
link   
a reply to: Serdgiam

The truth will set you free. The truth doesn't care about your opinion. It just is. Failings of your group or no, as long as you embrace the truth, you HAVE to be on at least SOME sort of right track.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:00 PM
link   
a reply to: intrptr

That's very circumstantial. While the 75% figure may not be entirely accurate, I'd be more than willing to say that it is safe to assume that the number is above 50%. Probably even above 60%. Look at the black community. The black community can be known for being VERY spiritual, but they don't let that spirituality stand in the way of their politics. When was the last time you met a black man going on and on about how absurd it sounds for men to be descended from monkeys?
edit on 29-5-2015 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:02 PM
link   
Because they live a lie. They prey on the ignorant because anyone with any sense would see the fallacies.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:06 PM
link   
a reply to: Annee

I think we need to do away with the parties all together. That would force people to actually look at the positions of politicians instead of blindly following them because of the letter next to their name.

Politics is no different than sports to the vast majority of people. They find a team they like and root for them passionately even when their quarterback blows the big game and loses horribly.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:06 PM
link   
a reply to: Annee

I agree. The return of the REAL Republican party and a return to REAL conservatism will DEFINITELY help get our country back on track.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:12 PM
link   

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Annee

I agree. The return of the REAL Republican party and a return to REAL conservatism will DEFINITELY help get our country back on track.


IMO -- Religion is fear based.

Weaker minds will succumb to it out of fear -- more then they actually agree with it.

I think many vote for the Right Wing not because they agree with the politics, but fear the alternative of Godlessness.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:15 PM
link   
a reply to: Annee

But like I pointed out earlier, the Democratic party isn't godless either. It is majority Christian as well.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:17 PM
link   
a reply to: Krazysh0t



You are either a very brave soul or a fool for starting this thread . "Yes, but I also don't vote strictly along party lines. My ideals can be more described as moderate." nice of you to self define yourself . Does it have a consensus from members or is it your own assessment of how you would like to be defined ?

" So I am willing to sacrifice my ideals so that our country can extend its rights to more and more demographics of people." how nice of you to be so consolatory towards people you know nothing about . Seeing ,you are parking your own ideals to allow others to make that decision for you ,you might be considered , patriotic .Is it to a flag ?

"For one, why do I have to be religious to be a Conservative? Why do they HAVE to be linked? Naturally, some of you will tell me that they don't have to be, but all evidence shows that the modern conservative movement is intricately linked to religiousism, namely Christianity. " Are you saying that you have to be Christian based to be Conservative ? Or are you saying you have to be spiritual ? Or are you asking why do people who claim a spiritual connection are Conservative ? Your answer to that question would be answered spiritually . Just like in the sciences ,you have to go to other fields to get a answer to a question not available from within . ie. don't look for metaphysical answers from the physical sciences .

Your thread turned from a question you didn't answer to one where you are going to give the answer .I guess it's the Atheist Gospel and the rest is a sermon . The more I read into your post the more imagination I had to juggle in my mind . I can only assume that rather then having a clearer picture of life that I am trying to have ,I would have to go back to a time of confusion I have been trying to escape all my life .Or if I am to consider what you are saying to be factual .

In leaving I will say that if you think you need to be conservative to accept spirituality then you are in a real pickle . I would suggest that people who except spirituality will become conservative . And also that there are actually are some conservatives who are not spiritual . They seem to set on the fence though .



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:18 PM
link   
a reply to: Krazysh0t


Look at the black community. The black community can be known for being VERY spiritual, but they don't let that spirituality stand in the way of their politics. When was the last time you met a black man going on and on about how absurd it sounds for men to be descended from monkeys?

Whaaa--?

That aside, I was focusing on your question about the exceptionalism and arrogance "Churchians" have for other races, cultures and religions.

I agree with you, partly stems from religious indoctrination.

Most people don't 'practice' only going to church on Easter or state they are "Protestant or Catholic", for instance. So when it comes down to getting people to all "march as to war" all the beliefs are relied upon to make a decision to go along or not. Most people go along.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:36 PM
link   

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: Krazysh0t
You are either a very brave soul or a fool for starting this thread . "Yes, but I also don't vote strictly along party lines. My ideals can be more described as moderate." nice of you to self define yourself . Does it have a consensus from members or is it your own assessment of how you would like to be defined ?


Why do I need a consensus from other members as to where my political affiliations lie? Isn't that my business?


" So I am willing to sacrifice my ideals so that our country can extend its rights to more and more demographics of people." how nice of you to be so consolatory towards people you know nothing about . Seeing ,you are parking your own ideals to allow others to make that decision for you ,you might be considered , patriotic .Is it to a flag ?


No, I am trying to point out that pure Libertarianism can be overly idealistic. The point is that true freedom isn't obtained through pure Libertarianism. For me, I like the Libertarian approach first, but if moneyed interests prove to be irresponsible without government oversight, then it may be necessary.


"For one, why do I have to be religious to be a Conservative? Why do they HAVE to be linked? Naturally, some of you will tell me that they don't have to be, but all evidence shows that the modern conservative movement is intricately linked to religiousism, namely Christianity. " Are you saying that you have to be Christian based to be Conservative ? Or are you saying you have to be spiritual ? Or are you asking why do people who claim a spiritual connection are Conservative ? Your answer to that question would be answered spiritually . Just like in the sciences ,you have to go to other fields to get a answer to a question not available from within . ie. don't look for metaphysical answers from the physical sciences .


No, I'm asking why conservatism has become intrinsically linked to Christianity.


Your thread turned from a question you didn't answer to one where you are going to give the answer .I guess it's the Atheist Gospel and the rest is a sermon . The more I read into your post the more imagination I had to juggle in my mind . I can only assume that rather then having a clearer picture of life that I am trying to have ,I would have to go back to a time of confusion I have been trying to escape all my life .Or if I am to consider what you are saying to be factual .


I didn't answer the question in the thread title because it was a rhetorical question. Though, none of what you just said refuted anything I said in the OP


In leaving I will say that if you think you need to be conservative to accept spirituality then you are in a real pickle . I would suggest that people who except spirituality will become conservative . And also that there are actually are some conservatives who are not spiritual . They seem to set on the fence though .


It's funny how you quoted this line from the OP: "Naturally, some of you will tell me that they don't have to be..." then go on to tell me EXACTLY that without addressing anything else in the OP.



posted on May, 29 2015 @ 01:41 PM
link   
a reply to: intrptr

I totally see your point about indoctrination and how you are alluding to group think as well. They certainly are valid points. It's just really baffling to me that intelligence is insulted and looked down upon in the conservative world. I mean how arrogant can you be to assume that you know more than a scientist does on a subject the scientist has been studying his whole career? How can you continue to embrace proven inaccuracies and lies when they are proven to be so?




top topics



 
30
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join