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originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Aazadan
Isn't the co-op business platform more a democratic form of business where people take equal responsibility for the successful outcome and therefore accept a more proportional part of the profit ei paid what they are actually worth
originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: nwtrucker
Middle class wages are directly tied to minimum wage. Like opponents of the minimum wage like to point out, if you were to double the minimum wage, what happens to the people making $10/hour right now? Their wage goes up, the same is true of the people making $20/hour. When the minimum wage doesn't increase, other wages also don't increase.
Not true. The oil industry's current boom and the wages being paid has zero to do with minimum wages. It has to do with supply and demand. Market forces. If one decreases the jobs, especially middle class and higher paying jobs, one has downward looking, newly unemployed middle-class level people competing for the lower paying jobs...right down to minimum wage levels. Add in a massive increase of unskilled, newly legalized workers to an already out of balance supply and demand mechanism and the low end wages would remain low. Even the so-called low skill jobs that pay minimum wage in other states are being paid higher than minimums in the boom states like N.D. Texas et al,due to the locals won't work those jobs for low wages. The expectation level is higher due to the supply and demand levels and that has driven up all wages in the region. Supply and demand. NOT legislation...
In fact under capitalism which is all about achieving better, faster, and cheaper through competition wages if left to their own devices will for the majority of society naturally converge to zero.
You can see the effect this has had on middle class workers by looking at purchasing power. The work force is currently higher skilled than it has been at any time in history and it is also more productive than at any time in history yet purchasing power is at it's lowest. Even in colonial times purchasing power was roughly double what it is today. You can even look to the industrial revolution, when purchasing power was at it's lowest in the late 1800's and the introduction of a minimum wage which reversed that trend.
All due to supply and demand. Forcing higher wages decreases the jobs which drives the supply and demand further off kilter.
When it comes to a reduction in employment that only occurs with a large shift, such as you would see if you were to bump it up to $15 or even $10. When the shift is gradual, just a small percentage per year the unemployment effects don't happen because the economy can adjust to changing conditions.
Not true, at all. Many businesses in Seattle are shutting the doors/relocating, mostly restaurants, as a result of the minimum wage increase. They ARE bringing that minimum wage in incrementally as well, by the way. The idea that work force reduction only occurs in 'large shifts' is contradicted by the steady closing of small businesses and many not so small as we speak...with no increase in the minimum wage. That will only speed up those closures. Basic economics, my man, learn them...
Outsourcing has done nothing to minimum wage because minimum wage positions aren't outsourced. Typically what are outsourced are medium paying jobs such as those going to the 30th-60th income percentile workers, effectively the middle class. Jobs such as factory work which used to pay well are outsourced to countries that pay very little. Those jobs are then replaced with low paying service sector jobs. Outsourcing, rather than decreasing the minimum wage propagates it. Outsourcing also increases GDP (this is where statistics diverge from reality) by creating more items at lower cost. However what you'll find with outsourcing is that you make the majority poorer while a few at the top such as upper management reap the benefits.