It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

What was the Motive of Christianity?

page: 8
18
<< 5  6  7    9  10  11 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 27 2015 @ 06:24 AM
link   

originally posted by: Ove38
I would say 90% of the words are his.




First you have to consider facts that outside of bible we don't have any evidence he ever lived.

If you even prove he lived, there is about 200 years gap between his life and those writing miraculous stories about him and what they believed someone has said... Yet, all those stories somehow are very similar to stories about someone else - Krishna. *

www.religioustolerance.org...




posted on May, 27 2015 @ 06:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: 2012newstart
a reply to: Verum1quaere
...Some groups within the Catholic church however, want to sacrifice the faithful in the so built model of Christ, contrary to any logic or teaching of a Good God who sent His Son to die Instead of us...


You got this a bit wrong, read carefully:

Matthew 16:24 "Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. For whoever wants to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will find it."

What does Jesus want? He wants you to die with him on the cross!

That's why Paul says:

Galatians 2:20 "I am crucified with Christ"



posted on May, 27 2015 @ 09:45 AM
link   

originally posted by: TheCretinHop
The motive of Christianity was pure. Then once the 1st century Christians grew old and withered away, corrupt money and power hungry people seeped into the early congregations and exploited them. The biggest exploiter and truth hider was the Vatican. They wanted power and wealth so they kept what the Bible really teaches away from the masses. They also slaughtered thousands of people based off of their own traditions and human principles that were completely unfounded in the scriptures. When Jesus was on earth, his preaching theme was about 'God's Kingdom.' One that would destroy the current world system humans live under and bring a restoration to the earth and restore the original purpose which was laid out in the Garden of Eden. It's not about heaven and hell. People are meant to live on earth.


You got it.

I don't think most people know the difference between Christianity and catholicism (or other organized sects).
edit on 27-5-2015 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 27 2015 @ 11:45 AM
link   
a reply to: cooperton

Don't forget, the religion itself wasn't created during the time of Jesus, it was created decades after he died, so what Jesus may have done during his life is irrelevant. Just because Jesus himself promoted peace and empathy, doesn't mean that other folks didn't use the belief system to control folks. Even today, it is extremely rare to find a Christian that actually follows Jesus' example. Every single president the US has ever had has been Christian, yet how many wars have we participated in, despite Jesus teaching "turn the other cheek"? It's pure hypocrisy, especially when a so called Christian supports a war based on revenge. The bottom line is that Jesus' philosophy is not realistic and the world STILL isn't ready for it. It would be nice, but money / power / security is simply more important to the average Christian in power than following Jesus' example.


1) It is a lie fabricated for no purpose whatsoever by the most despicable group of trolls of all time.

2) Jesus' teachings are true and it is the word of God.

In my humble opinion, I don't think martyrs would die for option #1


There are way more options than that. Folks have died for plenty of false religions in the past, how would this one be any different?

edit on 27-5-2015 by Barcs because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 27 2015 @ 04:06 PM
link   

originally posted by: Barcs
a reply to: cooperton

Don't forget, the religion itself wasn't created during the time of Jesus, it was created decades after he died, so what Jesus may have done during his life is irrelevant. Just because Jesus himself promoted peace and empathy, doesn't mean that other folks didn't use the belief system to control folks.


Christianity was created when the ideals of Christ were put into word in his lifetime. the "religion" (Catholicism) you refer to is the man-made response to his works (Christianity), and fail to reflect the actual teachings of Jesus. People used the belief system (Catholicism) to control folks, but Christanity itself is pure. The OP asked, 'what is the motive of Christianity', not Catholicism, nor any organized religion based off of Christianity.



There are way more options than that. Folks have died for plenty of false religions in the past, how would this one be any different?


Because he subsequently rose from the dead. Which goes back to the two options proposed in the OP. Either this has been the greatest deception perpetuated by a conspiracy of trolls, or this actually did happen.


Even today, it is extremely rare to find a Christian that actually follows Jesus' example.


Tell me about it. My parents, who raised me Catholic (Followed by me becoming atheist, then agnostic, then returning to Christian ideals), are devastated that I want to follow the life of Christ (fulfilling Matthew 10:35-37). Once you read the gospels after you establish a basic understanding of Spiritual concepts it makes a whole lot more sense as opposed to when the nuns tried to ram it down your ears in your adolescence.
edit on 27-5-2015 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 27 2015 @ 07:31 PM
link   

originally posted by: TheCretinHop
The motive of Christianity was pure.


but christianity wasn't created by Jesus. It was organized into a religion by the apostles (decades later).

so how can we say for sure what was the motive of it's creation?

How can we be sure that they didn't use the teachings and sacrifice of Jesus as their tool to give birth to a new revolutionary political religion inside Rome (bring down the system from within?)...

Wasn't that the time when apostles -and the Jews in general- waited for their messiah to come and save them from Romans?

and many people back then claimed to be the one....

What better time to sacrifice one of them and create a political movement covered with love and wise words copied by the soon to extinct works of famous philosophers of their time....

The first thing the apostles were propagating into Christianity was the despise of the pagan societies and their way of living, making them believe bad things (disaster, earthquakes, illnesses) happened to them because they worshiped statues instead of a tortured miserable man on a cross. (which still is a statue but anyway...)
And how evil and satanic the pagan festivals, tradition, science and philosophies were .
The apostles were the instigators, of the pagan ''holocaust'' that came ~300 year after, the destruction of art, architecture, science, philosophy and healthy values, and the rise of superstitious insanity that lead to the dark ages and millions of people tortured, killed and suffered in the name of their god.

How can anyone say their motive was pure?

''Love thy neighbor'' expect if he is a Pagan.

Of course he also says that he has come to destroy families by making family members hate each other. He has “come not to send peace, but a sword.” Matthew 10:34

Are you sure christianity is about Love, peace and understanding?

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
-Luke 19:27

Jesus condemns entire cities to dreadful deaths and to the eternal torment of hell because they didn’t care for his preaching. Matthew 11:20

Jesus, whose clothes are dipped in blood, has a sharp sword sticking out of his mouth. Thus attired, he treads the winepress of the wrath of God. (The winepress is the actual press that humans shall be put into so that we may be ground up.) Revelations 19:13-15

The beast and the false prophet are cast alive into a lake of fire. The rest of us the unchosen will be killed with the sword of Jesus. “An all the fowls were filled with their flesh.” Revelations 19:20-21

Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children according to Old Testament law. Mark 7:9

what about justice?
Jesus says that those who have been less fortunate in this life will have it even worse in the life to come. Mark 4:25


And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
-Luke 12:47

Some say that the OT god's laws and acts were evil and weird,but in the NT Jesus puts an end to that.. or that it was referring only to the Jews of the old times ....well


Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
-Matthew: 5:17-18





edit on WedWed, 27 May 2015 19:35:18 -05001PMkuWednesdaypm by Dr1Akula because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 27 2015 @ 07:32 PM
link   

originally posted by: cooperton
Christianity was created when the ideals of Christ were put into word in his lifetime. the "religion" (Catholicism) you refer to is the man-made response to his works (Christianity), and fail to reflect the actual teachings of Jesus. People used the belief system (Catholicism) to control folks, but Christanity itself is pure. The OP asked, 'what is the motive of Christianity', not Catholicism, nor any organized religion based off of Christianity.


Christianity is also a "Religion" aside from Catholicism. What do you mean that it's "pure"??? How is it "pure"??? It's an offshoot of Judaism making it impossible to be pure. Unless I'm not understanding the way in which you are using that word.


Because he subsequently rose from the dead. Which goes back to the two options proposed in the OP. Either this has been the greatest deception perpetuated by a conspiracy of trolls, or this actually did happen.


Jesus isn't the only Religious character who's ever been raised from the dead, been made immortal or anything else for that matter. Overcoming death is a pretty popular theme in many religious myths including Egyptian and Greek.

It's hardly the Greatest Deception ever. That doesn't even make sense to say that.



posted on May, 27 2015 @ 07:34 PM
link   
a reply to: cooperton

To teach its tenants IN A PEACEFUL MANOR(Epicly BLOWN centuries ago) in order to get ALL of humanity into heaven to save their souls from hell.
NOT force A DAMN thing,their sin is on THEM, we should still care for them and love them all ,just NOT be like them.



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 12:26 AM
link   
Christianity 2000y after Christ is a failed religion, unless a big miracle occurs to prove it otherwise.



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 01:38 AM
link   

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: cooperton

To teach its tenants IN A PEACEFUL MANOR(Epicly BLOWN centuries ago) in order to get ALL of humanity into heaven to save their souls from hell.

What would make you so certain that everyone wants to live eternally or go to heaven?


NOT force A DAMN thing,their sin is on THEM, we should still care for them and love them all ,just NOT be like them.

Care for, love, yet not be like...whom? Your ignorant and unwashed brethren who don't share your particular delusion?


originally posted by: JackofBlades
What WAS the motive of Christianity?


According to Mark 12:30-31..
And you must love the LORD your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your mind, and all your strength.'
The second is equally important: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' No other commandment is greater than these."


Is it possible to love the primitive and insane anthropomorphic idiot god as portrayed in the bible? Surely the only people who could feel love for such a being, haven't read his book?

There are aspects to (all) religions which are both beautiful and intriguing. The emphasis on cultivation of love, virtue, tolerance, forgiveness, caring and so on seem like wonderful and very worthy ideals and a god who demonstrates such things would be worthy of admiration. Yet the extremely narcissistic and bigoted biblical version is the very antithesis of these things. Something must have been lost in translation because, if there is a god, it isn't this one. "Sic Semper Tyrannis" could have been written expressly for such a being, the ultimate tyrant. Surely if there is some ultimate force and if people want to explore the possibility, it's time to move on from this primitive nonsense.



edit on 28-5-2015 by Cogito, Ergo Sum because: for the heck of it



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 01:47 AM
link   
a reply to: Cogito, Ergo Sum

If I'm wrong I'm a fool ,been there done that,we all have, IF I'm RIGHT....



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 03:07 AM
link   
a reply to: Dr1Akula

I'm not sure you entirely understand the Gospel accounts if you do not think Christ established the example for true Christians to follow. And yes he does kill people, not now, the wicked, the ones who have no spirituality inside them to recognize the reality when it comes and want to conform to the the Creators standards. Humans standards have proven our inability to rule over ourselves. This goes all the way back to the Garden of Eden. It's an issue of sovereignty. In other words who, who has the best way to live the creator or the creation. The creation has been suffering worst conditions than were purposes in the beginning.
Also any Christian going to war, and slaughtering any man is blood guilty. Jesus said to put the sword in its sheathe. ,"What if I die because they kill me and I'm not fighting back?" So what. Is not dying for peace and giving your life for God's Righteous standards of value to you? Think big pictures. Bring your community peace, teach true doctrine, encourage non-Christians to be at peace too. Life is about tolerating each other and helping each other out.
edit on 28-5-2015 by TheCretinHop because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-5-2015 by TheCretinHop because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 06:28 AM
link   

originally posted by: TheCretinHop
I'm not sure you entirely understand the Gospel accounts if you do not think Christ established the example for true Christians to follow.


Why then not address those verses and explain them?


originally posted by: TheCretinHop
And yes he does kill people, not now, the wicked, the ones who have no spirituality inside them to recognize the reality when it comes and want to conform to the the Creators standards.


O boy, he is not peaceful guy you all try to show him to be?! What creator's standards??? How do you know his standards and if bible is example of them, I really hope you are not holding to them. Those are some wicked standards.




originally posted by: TheCretinHop
Humans standards have proven our inability to rule over ourselves.

O boy... seriously?

Let's look at one example of those 'high' standards your religion is teaching you, and I really hope you are not holding to them... Exodus 21:7 NIV version:


"If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as male servants do."


Let me explain to you - not well developed people who wrote this DID NOT KNOW better. It was OK for them and custom... and thankfully just delusional people still look into this "R" rated book for 'standards and instructions' how to live, breed etc...




originally posted by: TheCretinHop
This goes all the way back to the Garden of Eden. It's an issue of sovereignty. In other words who, who has the best way to live the creator or the creation. The creation has been suffering worst conditions than were purposes in the beginning.

Then all mighty creator decided that he messed up, hit 'delete' button and made biggest known massacre known to humanity according to bible... thankfully bible is a joke of history book... and those stories that used to scare kids apparently still work on some grown ups... makes you wonder... also it shows how 'he loves you', no matter how wicked we are...




originally posted by: TheCretinHop
Also any Christian going to war, and slaughtering any man is blood guilty. Jesus said to put the sword in its sheathe. ,"What if I die because they kill me and I'm not fighting back?" So what. Is not dying for peace and giving your life for God's Righteous standards of value to you? Think big pictures. Bring your community peace, teach true doctrine, encourage non-Christians to be at peace too. Life is about tolerating each other and helping each other out.


Not according to above verses, but let me help you - only reason they all contradict each other is because Bible is written by people who did not know better, as I already stated above. Those folklore tales that you believe have words of 'creator' were nothing new when they were written, most of them many decades after 'supposed' miracles, and they show all elements of gossip, rumors and are not different then gossip magazines of today.

In past few weeks I am reading about Instructions of Ani, well documented Book of Dead, and many similar to biblical wisdoms were actually well established around 18th Dynasty in Egypt. Here is C/P from wiki... look yourself...



"Truth is sent by God." (p. 21)
"Even if he were an important person, a man whose nature is evil does not know how to remain upright." (p. 31)
"Celebrate the feast of your God and begin it at the correct time. God is unhappy if He is neglected." (p. 44)
"Be careful to avoid the mistake of lying: it will prevent you from fighting the evil inside yourself." (p. 79)
"...choose what is good to say and keep evil words prisoner in your body." (p. 79)
"Keep a loving heart whose words stay hidden. He [God] will provide for your needs. He will listen to what you say, your offering will be acceptable to Him." (p. 80)
"Everyone can master their own nature if the wisdom which he has been taught has made that nature stable." (p. 85)
"A lazy man never gets around to doing anything. He who knows how to make plans is worthy of consideration." (p. 90)
"Do not join a crowd that you meet when it has gathered to fight. Keep away from rebels." (p. 104)
"Give back in abundance the bread your mother gave you. Support her as she supported you." (p. 106)
"Pour out the water of libation for your father and mother who rest in the valley of death. The Gods will bear witness to this just act." (p. 106)
"Scorn the woman who has a bad reputation in your town, do not look at her as she passes. Do not try to sleep with her." (p. 108)
"Marry a woman when you are young, and let her have children while you are young." (p. 112)
"All will go well for the man whose household is numerous." (p. 112)
"Distance yourself from the rebel, do not make a friend of him. Make friends with the just and righteous man whose actions you have observed." (p. 113)
"Build your own home for yourself and do not assume that your parents house will come to you by right." (p. 113)
"Do not eat bread without giving some to those near you who do not have anything to eat, since the bread is eternal while man does not last." (p. 123)
"Do not sit down when there is a person standing who is older than you or whose rank is higher than yours." (p. 123)
"You will know happiness if your life is lived within the limits set by the will of God." (p. 124)
"Do not fill your heart with desire for the goods of others, but rather concern yourself with what you have built up yourself." (p. 132)
"When death comes, it embraces the old like a child in the arms of its mother." (p. 152)
"Do not lose yourself in the exterior world to the extent that you neglect the place of your eternal rest." (p. 153)


So to answer your original question - yes, humans always knew how to organize themselves and how to create laws, all our current laws are FAR BETTER then supposed 'creators instructions', and we see that many mistakes made by religious books are actually fixed today, such as inequality between sexes, people of different colors, ... Harsh punishments of past are not practiced anymore... and bible is just step away to be on fictional bookshelf and with rest of mythology...



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 08:30 AM
link   

originally posted by: Dr1Akula

Of course he also says that he has come to destroy families by making family members hate each other. He has “come not to send peace, but a sword.” Matthew 10:34


This was to demonstrate that you will have to go against what your parents raise you to be. Our parents, and their parents, and their parents etc, told us that the only truth in this life is death and taxes. If we were to listen to them we could not uphold the promise of eternal life and liberty, thus households will be torn apart if there is a constituent of it that is truly Christian.




But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
-Luke 19:27


This is part of a parable, Jesus is not saying this as a command. Jesus is using this story to demonstrate that when you are imbued with the spirit that you should use it rather than let it lay dormant.



Jesus condemns entire cities to dreadful deaths and to the eternal torment of hell because they didn’t care for his preaching. Matthew 11:20


Where in hell did you find that translation? NIV states:

"Then Jesus began to denounce the towns in which most of his miracles had been performed, because they did not repent."

Wouldn't you be annoyed if you performed miracles and people didn't believe you? to "denounce", or "upbraid" (KJV), or "reproach" (YLT) is way different than condemning to dreadful death. I have no idea where you found that translation.



Jesus, whose clothes are dipped in blood, has a sharp sword sticking out of his mouth. Thus attired, he treads the winepress of the wrath of God. (The winepress is the actual press that humans shall be put into so that we may be ground up.) Revelations 19:13-15


You added those parenthesis, that is not said in the book. Young's Literal Translation allows us to see what this passage is actually referring to:

"and he is arrayed with a garment covered with blood, and his name is called, The Word of God." (Rev 19:13)

This is saying that the Word of God is under scrutiny and being attacked. You and the others arguing against it is case and point for this passage.



Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children according to Old Testament law. Mark 7:9


You mean Mark 7:10? He is quoting the old Law and rebuking it by saying they are man-made laws (Mark 7:7) not God's law.



what about justice?
Jesus says that those who have been less fortunate in this life will have it even worse in the life to come. Mark 4:25


Read the passage in context, this is similar to the passage you took out of context in Luke 19:27.



And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
-Luke 12:47


Blatantly taken out of context. Read Luke 12:41-48.




Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
-Matthew: 5:17-18


He is saying that he is going to fulfill prophecy, which if you google prophecies fulfilled in the gospel you can see all the word in the OT that was eluding to his coming. We know this because Jesus did correct some incorrect teachings in the OT:

"“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also." (Mthw 5:38-39)

^^^As pacifist as you can possibly get.
edit on 28-5-2015 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 09:38 AM
link   

originally posted by: cooperton
Christianity was created when the ideals of Christ were put into word in his lifetime. the "religion" (Catholicism) you refer to is the man-made response to his works (Christianity), and fail to reflect the actual teachings of Jesus. People used the belief system (Catholicism) to control folks, but Christanity itself is pure. The OP asked, 'what is the motive of Christianity', not Catholicism, nor any organized religion based off of Christianity.


So you are claiming that Christianity is now a secular term that only applies to followers of the gospels? Sorry but it is still a religion. Catholicism was the first major brand of Christianity and Catholics are Christians. Christianity as it stands today would not exist without Catholicism, so I'm not sure why you are separating them when they are the same thing. Plus, 99% of Christians follow the entire new testament, not just the gospels.


Because he subsequently rose from the dead. Which goes back to the two options proposed in the OP. Either this has been the greatest deception perpetuated by a conspiracy of trolls, or this actually did happen.


As others mentioned, this isn't unique to Christianity. The concept goes all the way back to ancient Egypt and is prevalent in almost every big religion. Also, martyrs exist for every religion, which was the point I was making in my post. You used martyrdom as an argument to suggest it is true, but it applies to almost every religion.

Plus, those aren't the only 2 options. What about the possibility that Jesus was just a regular man with great wisdom, and taught his personal philosophy of peace and empathy to others? After he was killed for blasphemy, his stories were greatly exaggerated and then subsequently used to control folks. It doesn't have to be 100% valid or 100% deception.

The teachings themselves are priceless, but where did they really originate from? All of the gospels were written decades after Jesus died by folks that didn't witness the events first hand (not to mention they conflict), so it sounds to me like someone took Jesus' ball and ran with it to make a religion out of it. I'm fairly certain that Jesus would have never wanted his example to turn into a religion, he just wanted to see a more peaceful world. The religion part of it is more St Paul. I don't think Jesus literally wanted people eating his flesh and drinking his blood. That was manipulated, IMO, he really wanted folks to follow his example of good deeds and empathy, not to go to some cult like weekly ritual where people eat him (or pretend to). "Do this in memory of me". It should really be, "Honor my memory by doing as I have done in my life". I think this part was intentionally changed to create the religion.


Tell me about it. My parents, who raised me Catholic (Followed by me becoming atheist, then agnostic, then returning to Christian ideals), are devastated that I want to follow the life of Christ (fulfilling Matthew 10:35-37). Once you read the gospels after you establish a basic understanding of Spiritual concepts it makes a whole lot more sense as opposed to when the nuns tried to ram it down your ears in your adolescence.


Funny thing. I was also raised Catholic, then became agnostic leaning to creator, and eventually settled at agnostic leaning to no creator. My family doesn't like this because my parents as well as aunts, uncles and cousins are all devout Catholics. Luckily myself and some of the cousins have broken away from those archaic traditions, but still understand the concept of empathy and the golden rule. I think that's a great thing to teach the kids, but the religion itself shouldn't be forced on them.



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 10:14 AM
link   
Christianity was developing before Jesus of Nazareth was a twinkle in his father's eye. In fact, Christianity never even needed Jesus of Nazareth to perpetuate it's philosophy.

The main messages that are crammed into the mouth of the "savior" in the New Testament Gospels, all can be found in the Old Testament. The rest are found in the Dead Sea Scrolls, which introduce us to the Essene Community and one "Teacher of Righteousness". James the Just was , no doubt, was the Essene representative, currently holding the title of "The Just", awaiting "HIS" return.

John the Baptist, as well as the apostle Paul, were tapping into the Greek Eleusinian Mystery cults. Therapeutics and Hellenized Jews of the time, such as Philo of Alexandria and Hillel the Elder, were refining Platonic and Pythagorean logic and philosophy while theorizing and adopting the "LOGOS' philosophy into Judaism, through the Old Testament reference to the Angel of the Lord.

The Christianity that we know today is nothing like the original teachings. It's barely recognizable.



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 01:49 PM
link   

originally posted by: TheCretinHop
a reply to: Dr1Akula

I'm not sure you entirely understand the Gospel accounts if you do not think Christ established the example for true Christians to follow.


I understand that this is the first step into christianity to accept the gospels -beside all the contradictions- are real accounts and words of Jesus, and not just what the apostles had in mind...

but how about the gospels that didn't make it to the bible?
the apostles were the ones who coordinate the christian movement across Rome, Greece, Egypt etc.
the gospels were just ''letters'' ( epistles) send to the Corinthians, for example to give them the political and social ''line''
these groups should follow for the organization to get strong and proselytize more people specifically at the societies of their time.

Having said that is very obvious that the beast of reveletions is Nero, the demons that haunted Jesus, where the logic and reasons and way of life of the pagans, and other political propaganda's.

we already see many contradictions in NT, but how about the gospels that didn't make it to the holy book?
The bible was written in today's form, hundreds of years after the apostles. Where the church chose between the available gospels!!!

The word's and accounts of Jesus the church didn't think were appropriate for His religion;

Apocalypse of Peter

The Epistle of Barnabas

Infancy Gospel of James

The Didache

Lost Epistle to the Corinthians

Shepherd of Hermas

1st Clement (one of two letters (yet again to the church in Corinth) attributed to Pope Clement of Rome. )

Gospel of Thomas

Third Letter to the Corinthians (so much obssession, to save the poor pagan souls of the Corinth!)


And Yet somehow christians believe the NT is the exact and only word of Jesus ignoring all the above!
As for ''Jesus establishing the example for true Christians to follow'' that's what the apostles tell us.
but who were those men?
How can we know they are credible?

Jesus appeared before them right after his resurrection, why they waited 3 decades to start spreading the words of their savior? smells fishy doesn't it?

Also they did no other works of literature for us to judge their writing character...
Unlike with famous ancient historians like Herodotus, Halicarnassus,Thucydides, Berossus, Xenophon, Ptolemy and so many others....

How can we know the motives of some mysterious people we never heard before, who are making outrageous claims that defy logic, reason and science?
Would you trust someone like them today?..... I wouldn't



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 01:50 PM
link   
a reply to: windword


Christianity was developing before Jesus of Nazareth was a twinkle in his father's eye. In fact, Christianity never even needed Jesus of Nazareth to perpetuate it's philosophy.

I certainly agree. But there were variations beyond mystery schools. Read up on Psalms of Solomon. That was where "Son of David" language comes in. The new king to come to Jerusalem, and rule the world from there. That sort of, but not quite completely, was discarded after Jerusalem unexpectedly got destroyed.



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 01:56 PM
link   
a reply to: Dr1Akula



the demons that haunted Jesus, where the logic and reasons and way of life of the pagans, and other political propaganda's.

At least one of the demons was the post-exile prophet writings and Psalms of Solomon notion of Worldwide Theocracy based in Jerusalem with Son of David Messiah as the Earthly Regent.



posted on May, 28 2015 @ 02:31 PM
link   

originally posted by: cooperton
This was to demonstrate that you will have to go against what your parents raise you to be. Our parents, and their parents, and their parents etc, told us that the only truth in this life is death and taxes. If we were to listen to them we could not uphold the promise of eternal life and liberty, thus households will be torn apart if there is a constituent of it that is truly Christian.


it's also on -Luke 14:26

''If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.''

But in general, the life style of Jesus contradicts the concept of modern christian "family values." According to the Bible as well as Christian apologists, Jesus never raised a family, and never married or fathered children. Clearly, Jesus had no personal experience of a family. Furthermore, the words of Jesus expressed variance against family members





This is part of a parable, Jesus is not saying this as a command. Jesus is using this story to demonstrate that when you are imbued with the spirit that you should use it rather than let it lay dormant.


The parable of the ten pounds aims to teach a lesson about disobeying your "Nobleman" (no doubt the author of Luke meant to put Jesus as the nobleman). Believers can replace "servants" with themselves or someone else, but what could they possibly replace for the conclusion of the lesson: "slay them before me"?

Slay means to kill by violent means. IF that taken as parable, it becomes far more morally atrocious because instead of Jesus we can then put any "Nobleman" in this context.



Where in hell did you find that translation? NIV states:

"Then Jesus began to denounce the towns in which most of his miracles had been performed, because they did not repent."

Wouldn't you be annoyed if you performed miracles and people didn't believe you? to "denounce", or "upbraid" (KJV), or "reproach" (YLT) is way different than condemning to dreadful death. I have no idea where you found that translation.


Isn't that an evil way the writer used to make you afraid of disbelieving?




You added those parenthesis, that is not said in the book. Young's Literal Translation allows us to see what this passage is actually referring to:

"and he is arrayed with a garment covered with blood, and his name is called, The Word of God." (Rev 19:13)

This is saying that the Word of God is under scrutiny and being attacked. You and the others arguing against it is case and point for this passage.


and beside that, it is all about love and understanding...




Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children according to Old Testament law. Mark 7:9
You mean Mark 7:10? He is quoting the old Law and rebuking it by saying they are man-made laws (Mark 7:7) not God's law.

''Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.''




Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
-Matthew: 5:17-18


He is saying that he is going to fulfill prophecy, which if you google prophecies fulfilled in the gospel you can see all the word in the OT that was eluding to his coming. We know this because Jesus did correct some incorrect teachings in the OT:


You only picked n choose one phrase ''fulfill prophecy'' , what about the rest?

''Think not that I am come to destroy the law... Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.''



"“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also." (Mthw 5:38-39)

^^^As pacifist as you can possibly get.


Just proves my point, so many contradictions, that it's obvious those who wrote it just copied various existing philosophies
and put them together in the worst way possible.

Imagine today someone makes a religion using quotes from Islam, Buddhism, Scientology and Mormonism randomly together to push some political propaganda...
Imo christianity was created in a very similar way...

It didn't started Holy and then started to decline.
It actually started way worse than it is today...
edit on ThuThu, 28 May 2015 15:09:54 -05001PMk000000Thursdaypm by Dr1Akula because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
18
<< 5  6  7    9  10  11 >>

log in

join