Do Not Feed The Stray Cats!

this thread just screams for this tune.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: Iwinder

I didnt watch the vid, if someone beats someone over the actions of a cat then they are clearly inhumane. No need for me to see his crimes to know they were wrong.

A man beating a woman for any reason is a big no no where I live in the South. Plenty of men have taken a trip to the county hospital for this before going to jail.

Sick, if our firefighters are acting out like the police corruption plague then we're really screwed. Hope he gets reprimanded correctly, no excuses.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

It kind of does, doesn't it?

a reply to: stumason

Probably because their life span is only maybe 5 years outside.Kept indoors like vets recommend they live up to 18 years. I know,my mom was a crazy cat lady.

originally posted by: Dimithae
a reply to: stumason

Probably because their life span is only maybe 5 years outside.Kept indoors like vets recommend they live up to 18 years. I know,my mom was a crazy cat lady.

Sorry, that's just utter bollocks. As I said earlier, I've had (and know plenty of people who have had) cats that have lived well past 5 years old after being allowed outside. One of mine lived to 15 and that was after he had lost a leg aged 2.

All this "keep cats indoors so they can live longer/be healthier" sounds like the same kind of nonsense you hear from the pro-circumcision crowd - "it makes sex better", "it's cleaner" which is obvious crap too.

The cats need to be spayed or neutered or they will be completely out of control in numbers. It's very sad. Usually the shelters around here and in neighboring cities are filled to capacity. There are too many people who have a cat and then decide they don't want it and leave it to fend for itself. Many people are forced to leave their pets because maybe they are moving and the new place doesn't allow pets and shelters are filled and can't take them in, but for God's sake, get them fixed! I have rescued many cats in my life time but after so many years, you realize you just can't help them all. There are too many. Breaks my heart.

As for that poor woman being beaten, there is no excuse for that kind of behavior!

a reply to: stumason

When my mother first had cats,she let them run in and out. The one cat got run over by a car. Two of them got Feline Infectious Anemia,(it kills over 70% of cats that contract it). Not to mention the fact of all the times she had to take in cats that had been in fights and had wounds abscess(cats are known for doing that due to them healing really fast).The vets told her outright,that she needed to get them all fixed and keep them indoors so they weren't getting hurt so much. We had one cat that had a run in with a mole! She came out the loser in that one. Broke off two of her canines over it and had to be quarantined for 10 days with no medical care before they would see her. Our original tom we got,had been running the streets.He had feline leukemia and died 3 years later.

There are many dangers out there for our domesticated friends. In populated areas there are cars,other pets,diseases,and fighting with other cats.They can get hung up in a tree and die,(found one in my tree the first winter at my house,all the leaves fell off and I saw it,poor thing). In rural areas there are all those things PLUS other wild life that is looking for an easy meal.And our pets are it. I used to groom a Cardinals former pitcher's 2dogs.they didn't let them put in fences in that exclusive neighborhood because it would ruin the "beauty" of the yards. Yeah,so his and everyone elses dogs and cats ran the woods behind the houses all the time. Then the flood of '92 hit and brought out the coyotes from the forests to the urban areas.They found a bunch of easy meals there including people's pets. IT IS NOT SAFE TO LET YOUR PETS ROAM.

By the way,how did your cat lose his leg?

originally posted by: stumason

originally posted by: Dimithae
a reply to: stumason

Probably because their life span is only maybe 5 years outside.Kept indoors like vets recommend they live up to 18 years. I know,my mom was a crazy cat lady.

Sorry, that's just utter bollocks. As I said earlier, I've had (and know plenty of people who have had) cats that have lived well past 5 years old after being allowed outside. One of mine lived to 15 and that was after he had lost a leg aged 2.

All this "keep cats indoors so they can live longer/be healthier" sounds like the same kind of nonsense you hear from the pro-circumcision crowd - "it makes sex better", "it's cleaner" which is obvious crap too.

IME, you either get a cat who makes it outdoors or they don't. For every cat that has a long lifespan outdoors, how many are there that die way too young?

Average them out and you get that 5 year lifespan.

My parents are out in the country and have a small colony of farm cats. Out of every litter of four or five, only maybe one or two survives their first year. Now rethink that thing about the 5 year lifespan being utter bollocks. Those aren't good odds. And they have regular food, water, and shelter.

Heck, we brought in a kitten from the complex ferals and raised it enough to get it adopted by a family in the town where my husband works. The cat remained true to feral type and become an indoor/outdoor roamer. Within his first four years, he had contracted FIV and died.

And don't get me wrong, I am not knocking people who let their cats roam. Cats can and do survive inside and out just fine and live their lives.

I do think that large feral pops can be a big problem and cause problems for people who have indoor cats.

And no one should attack someone for being the crazy cat lady. There are other ways to address that problem.

originally posted by: ketsuko
I do think that large feral pops can be a big problem and cause problems for people who have indoor cats.

How so?
If you keep your cat a prisoner indoors then how on earth does a feral population outside affect your cat?
Oh, and I'm curious, would you refuse to let your cats out if they showed an interest like meowing at the door?

...as I said previously, I'll never keep my cat prisoner, she comes and goes as a free creature. Anything else is cruel in my opinion. Who am I to be the prison guard?

*Edit*
And for general information, here in the UK cats are exempt from the Animals Act 1971:

Cats enjoy a unique position as the Animals Act 1971 does not apply to them. A cat cannot, therefore, in law trespass. As a cat cannot trespass its owner cannot be legally responsible for what their cat does outside of their property.

www.inbrief.co.uk...
There are other statutory laws which deal with 'public nuisance' but you'd need a silly amount of cats causing problems before authorities can get involved.

I support our laws which don't try to make house arrest prisoners out of natural roamers.

a reply to: grainofsand

Cats are territorial critters.

They need to feel ownership of their space in order to feel comfortable and confident. When you have indoor cat, your home is his or her space and the cat needs to feel ownership of that space. When you have a large population of feral cats that move in, a cat can start to feel insecure when those cats range right up to your door spraying and marking turf. Your indoor cat feels threatened in his or her own claim and can start an aggressive program of marking to try to assert ownership over the space.

It has nothing to do with the cat wanting to go outside.

a reply to: ketsuko

So, I'll ask again, if your cats showed an interest in going outside, such as meowing at the door, would you refuse?
Hypothetical obviously as you are bound to reply that your cats never show an interest in going outside, but IF they did, would you refuse?
That would sound like prison to me, I'll never imprison my cat if she doesn't want to be locked in.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: ketsuko

So, I'll ask again, if your cats showed an interest in going outside, such as meowing at the door, would you refuse?
Hypothetical obviously as you are bound to reply that your cats never show an interest in going outside, but IF they did, would you refuse?
That would sound like prison to me, I'll never imprison my cat if she doesn't want to be locked in.

I have one who wants to go. He's the male Ragdoll. He's an idiot and does all kinds of stupid things inside and gets himself into all kinds of trouble. He's also on his third home and the first people who had him declawed him on all four. He can come outside on our patio when we're out there working on it and can keep an eye on him, same as our former feral, but otherwise, it would be suicide to let him out.

Would you let him out without his natural weapons?

And I think you were also the person who asked me if I would keep my dogs in. I have to ask, do you just let them run wherever they want whenever or do you keep them under your eyeballs when they go out?

originally posted by: ketsuko
I have one who wants to go. He's the male Ragdoll. He's an idiot and does all kinds of stupid things inside and gets himself into all kinds of trouble. He's also on his third home and the first people who had him declawed him on all four. He can come outside on our patio when we're out there working on it and can keep an eye on him, same as our former feral, but otherwise, it would be suicide to let him out.

Would you let him out without his natural weapons?

Declawed?!! WTF?! I assumed that was in as low percentages as FGM.
Barbaric.

If I ever had a poor cat who had that done then I would keep them safe at home obviously.
What kind of example is that, rather extreme don't you think, or is that some US thing where it is casually normal to remove the claws of cats?
Wow.

And I think you were also the person who asked me if I would keep my dogs in.

Nope, wasn't me.

I have to ask, do you just let them run wherever they want whenever or do you keep them under your eyeballs when they go out?

Again, wasn't me, I have no dogs, never have.
If I ever did have a dog though I wouldn't let it run free like Molly my cat.
Again, for rather obvious reasons.

*Edit*
So IF a cat you own with claws on all four paws was meowing at the door, clearly showing a wish to go out, would you refuse?

a reply to: grainofsand

Not had that problem aside from the Ragdoll, and he only wants it because he's allergic to closed doors. He shows the same behavior at any door in the house that is closed whether it leads to the outside or not.

With the cat how got upset by the ferals horning in, he would get upset when we left him at home, and he simply started marking turf. No attempts to bust outside. Once we moved away from the complex and all those cats, he relaxed. We also let him sit on the patio when we were out until he passed away. He was fairly old.

I wouldn't try to make a cat who was used to be indoor/outdoor into an indoor only unless that cat wanted to be. Our current reformed feral is a good example. She occasionally wants to poke her head out, but she comes right back in as soon as she noticed we're not going to be out. It wouldn't be good for her to go roaming anymore these days anyhow. She's older and now has hyperthyroid and needs medicine twice a day or she'll starve to death.

a reply to: ketsuko

It appears you and your cats are a good match then.

We also let him sit on the patio when we were out until he passed away. He was fairly old.

I let my cat go wherever she wants, she is free cat.

Oh, and who is talking about "I wouldn't try to make a cat who was used to be indoor/outdoor into an indoor only unless that cat wanted to be.", not me.
I'm asking if you shared a friendship, or owned, (whatever we call it) a fit and healthy cat who has claws on all four paws, and that cat was meowing at the door showing a clear wish to go outside, would you refuse to open the door?

Is that simple question so bad?

a reply to: grainofsand

I'm not sure why it would happen.

If I were going to get a cat, I'd be looking for a cat who was used to being indoors when I went for one or one who was a kitten and would grow up used to being indoors.

It's about understanding their behavior and knowing what you're getting. My folks are having the same territory issues with their cats right now. They have two indoor and the farm cats outdoors. Of the two indoor cats, one refuses to use the little box properly because of territory issues thanks to the outdoor colony. It's the one that NEVER shows any desire to try to go outdoors. It's basically a timid animal with little confidence in its own territory, so it marks.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: grainofsand

I'm not sure why it would happen.

Just pretend for the purposes of respectful and honest discussion.
So, if you owned a fit and healthy cat with claws on all 4 paws, and that cat showed a clear wish to go outside, would you refuse to open the door generally?
I have asked the same question 3 or 4 times now.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: grainofsand

I'm not sure why it would happen.

Just pretend for the purposes of respectful and honest discussion.
So, if you owned a fit and healthy cat with claws on all 4 paws, and that cat showed a clear wish to go outside, would you refuse to open the door generally?
I have asked the same question 3 or 4 times now.

It would greatly depend on the circumstances.

If the cat had experience being outside before, perhaps depending on where we were at.

Say, had we just moved from a home it had grown up around, no. A cat has a strong homing instinct, and if I let it go before it bonded to its new turf, it might return to (or attempt) its old stomping grounds.

If I lived in Australia, no. Cats that end up feral there are a huge problem.

I'm not trying to be difficult. But the only cat I've ever had do what you're describing is the one I grew up with who was indoor/outdoor. Of course, she went out. But none of my indoor cats do it to the outdoor doors. They know the patio door leads out, and they will sit there and wait occasionally but no frantic bursts of acting trapped.

Now, when it comes time to close the windows in the spring and fall ... Look out!