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The anti austerity survival guide. Hints, tips, advice and help for a better future.

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posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:42 PM
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originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: flammadraco

I hear what you are saying, but I would rather that a tiny, and by that I mean close to statistically irrelevant number of persons got away with what amounts to some pretty minor scamming, than any one of the genuine, extremely hard working and put upon folk out there who are on benefits despite having made every effort to avoid it have to suffer one single unwelcome letter from DWP. For the government to consider jumbling the lives of the huge number of innocent people who are going to get caught up by over zealous and poorly aimed cost savings initiatives, rather than starting with the tens of billions that are flying out of the coffers as part of a deliberate, industrial corporate scam, is just appalling.





I agree with what you say but would ask if you think that these issues will ever actually be resolved in a way that benifits the average man on the street?

The poor have been so for quite a long time now due to the way the country has been run and I for one feel that a change in the system is not in the forseeable future.

The intent of the thread may sound somewhat defeatest but do you not think that we would be better off playing with the hand we have been dealt and making the best of it as opposed to complaining about the rules and demanding to be dealt a different set of cards knowing full well this will never happen?




posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:45 PM
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originally posted by: flammadraco
a reply to: Cobaltic1978

I agreed with all your comments apart from the "Tax Credits". I've staff who refuse to work more hours as they loose their tax credits. These staff would rather be paid by the goverment to sit on their arses after working just 16 hours a week and receive this tax credit.

I believe the tax credit system should be means tested and before handing the credit to anyone the employer should be contacted to see if the employee was offered more hoursand if they refused more hours offered then they loose their tax credits. Everyone thinks they are screwing the government but it's the tax payer that's being screwed!!

I understand what you're all saying but I work with this on a daily basis year in, year out and people will abuse the system designed to help folk and everyone will end up loosing out!

To add to your point that tax credits subsidise businesses, this is ludicrous! Tax credits are paid directly to your bank account, nothing to do with the employer.



It is a subsidy for business, mainly big business, but it is a subsidy. Employers can pay minimum wage and not a livable wage, with earnings being subsidised by my taxes.

I appreciate what you say about some people not working over their set hours, but it is a real ball ache if you work in excess of the hours initially agreed by the employer. Tax credits are re-assessed every year and the amount you are entitled to doesn't change until the following tax year, when assessment is undertaken using the wages earned in the previous tax year. Which in turn leads to an over or under payment. Of course. They can declare their earnings directly to HMRC and they will re-assess, but it automatically sends a notification to the local Housing Office and their Housing Benefit is suspended, until the recipient declares the changes to Housing Benefit.

So, I can see why they wouldn't want to work more than 16 hours, because if you were to offer them an extra 5 hours per week here and there, it would take an additional 5 hours visiting the various Government and Local Government offices.

How about give employers a direct tax reduction when they employ staff? This would include National Insurance as well. Then, we can do away with Tax Credits and the staff can then be freed up to chase the tax avoiders/evaders, but that will not happen, because full attention would be on them then. Chances are we would turn on them rather than on ourselves, so no, let's just keep on blaming each other for the countries ills.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 03:06 PM
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a reply to: Cobaltic1978

I agree with what you say, as someone that it seems the possibility of austerity will not affect as much as most do you have any advice or opinions that could help those that may need it?

Even the smallest thing that may seem obvious to yourself may give insight to others.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 03:10 PM
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a reply to: Cobaltic1978

Again I agree with your points but..... I'm not talking about offering hours here and there, I'm talking about taking staff on set hours over 30 hours a week and then a week into the job they ask to reduce their hours due to Tax Credits.

I've a lad that works for me on 30 hours a week but refuses a full time contract as he'd loose his Tax Credits. On more than the minimum wage And Lives at home with mum and dad and single. Receives 60 quid a week tax credits..... WTF! I've pensioners that work for me that are not entitled to that!!!!

It's being abused and should be means tested. I thought Tax Credits were for working family's, not bone idol gits living at home with mum and dad!


edit on 19.5.2015 by flammadraco because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 03:31 PM
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originally posted by: nonspecific
Yet the "how to you eat your steak" thread is storming up the most flagged on the live feed.

Maybe austerity is not as bad as it is made out to be?



Something that has puzzled me for some time .... *austerity* and people

not having enough money for basic food. Yet the West is facing a huge

crisis of obesity?


And then there's the third world where people really don't have enough

food as their ribs are sticking out and there is no surplus flesh on them?



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 04:11 PM
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originally posted by: nonspecific
a reply to: Cobaltic1978

I agree with what you say, as someone that it seems the possibility of austerity will not affect as much as most do you have any advice or opinions that could help those that may need it?

Even the smallest thing that may seem obvious to yourself may give insight to others.


As with everything in life, live within your means.

However, that's not even a choice for some people and I mean people who are actually working. They work to live and live beyond their means just to survive. I guess the only advice I would or could give is to address any debt issues and get it written off where you can. The top businesses do, as did most of the banks in the late noughties.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 04:28 PM
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I don't work because I choose not to.

I don't get benefits because I choose not to.

My protest is to not participate in the system as best I can.

I work for my family.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 05:18 PM
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originally posted by: corvuscorrax
I don't work because I choose not to.

I don't get benefits because I choose not to.

My protest is to not participate in the system as best I can.

I work for my family.


Could you explain how this relates to the OP please?



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 06:56 PM
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a reply to: nonspecific

We already have people going to food banks nonspecific. Some are trying to make out that no one really needs them, but the people saying this are generally incapable of seeing beyond the nose on their face. Given that we find ourselves in this sorry state of affairs, in what is actually the sixth largest economy in the world, I say that we damned well SHOULD hold out for a better hand.

It is wise to be cautious when one considers biting the hand that feeds, but when the hand starves instead, one should never hesitate to cut it off.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 11:58 PM
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a reply to: flammadraco how do you know the ones who are genuinely sick and those to idol to work. This right here is when you start making genuine sick people jump through hoops and go to arbitrary Examinations performed by unqualified "experts" just to appease your hatred and despising. I don't know anyone who wants to be sick with a disease or illness, yet many have been led to believe people are putting these sicknesses on just to get a few extra quid. Many sick people need the extra money to help alter their homes so they can have showers and use the bathroom. To get up and down the stairs. Many use the money to pay for careers to help them clothe themselves and help around the house. Very few go on sickness just to get money for fags and booze. Being sick with a disease is no fun, it's made worse by having to justify yourself to a public who have been told by corporate media people on the sick have it easy. Being ill is not easy and I wouldn't wish it on anyone.why anyone would want a life threatening disease just so they don't have to go to work, doesn't make any sense to me. No one wants to be ill with a disease that stops them working or living a normal life



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 03:40 AM
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a reply to: woodwardjnr

I'm not talking about folk off work due to sickness, I have made my point clear throughout this thread that I am talking about bone idol gits who refuse to work and are happy pouncing of the tax payer. As said before but obviously ignored, those who are sick, disabled or elderly should receive more help from the state and this could be paid for by making those able to work go to work.

These bone idol gits are the ones giving a bad name to those on benefits, don't blame hard working tax payers for getting angry when we have to work and know that we are funding "SOME" folk to sit on their arses all day watching Jeremy Kyle when they are fit and able to work.

But you completely misconstrued what I have been debating in this thread and whilst your response was good, it had diddlysquat to do with "Anything" i have said in this thread, unless of course your response was to someone else???

Edit - My mother is registered as disabled and is in receipt of benefits and she to had to go for the medicals you mentioned in your post. So what, if you are genuinely ill then you have nothing to worry about. But lets put this into perspective, a third of those who had to go through this procedure were found to be fit for work, a third which equates to over a million people who have now returned to work and are contributing to society. If you have an issue with that, then so be it. I for one think its great that we stopped payments to folk who were abusing the system.

Again, it is not the Governments money being paid to these people, its my tax money, your tax money and every other tax payers money being mispaid to these individuals that obviously were capable of working but refused to do so. You see it in the media all the time with those on disability benefit saying they cannot walk and yet are caught jumping out of planes, playing a round of golf, are fitness trainers. The list is never ending.

Want to be angry with someone? Be angry at those abusing the system, be angry at those who take money from those really in need.


edit on 20.5.2015 by flammadraco because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 03:59 AM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

Again I agree with your points TrueBrit, however when you watch shows on TV and see these abled body folk that are capable of working refusing to do so. Lets be honest, if you have to use a Food Bank then surely you would also not have enough money for booze, alcohol or drugs and yet some (not all) folk that use these food banks or plead poverty always have a can of cider, smoke or are on drugs. They have enough money to feed their vices and yet not enough money to feed themselves or family. Perhaps they should learn how to prioritise their spending.

However I do understand that for some folk food banks are a saving grace and through no fault of their own they have to use such facilities and in this day and age its shocking to see this in a first world country such as ours and we should be embarrassed. But i feel more for those that are working and have to use food banks to sustain themselves. Those on benefits that use food banks are normally those who have had their benefits stopped due to not turning up to job interviews or even not signing on at the correct time.

Again I speak from experience where I have customers who use food banks but have enough money to come and spend at my business. You would be shocked if you saw first hand what I see on a daily basis, i have customers off work registered as disabled using an electric chair, and then you see them go into the car park, get out of their chair and then fold it up and heave it into the back of the car. The number of walking sticks that are left in my reception areas is astonishing, its like a miracle, they walk into my establishments disabled and then can walk unaided throughout the premises, ( i swear i could make a mint selling my CCTV footage to the DHS or insurance companies).

Unless anyone in this thread see's the number of folk I deal with on a weekly basis and deal with the demographics of society that I deal with daily, then no one can really state my observations are incorrect. I deal with in just one establishment over 7000 customers a week and have people from all walks of live. It annoys the hell out of working glass people knowing that we have benefits cheats as it gives everyone a bad name.

The whole system is unfair to both those who do need benefits through no fault of their own and for those of us paying taxes month in month out, year in, year out to pay towards those bone idol gits who always seem to have the latest designer clothing, trainers, 53" TVs and the list goes on.

If no one can see the wood through the trees and keeps on stating that this is not an issue on an industrial scale then you are contributing to the problem and need to remove the blinkers as your enabling folk to abuse the system.
edit on 20.5.2015 by flammadraco because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 04:49 AM
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a reply to: flammadraco I understand what your saying, but how do you tell those who are sick from those just being home idol? I don't look sick. So to some I could just look like a lazy bum, but to be quite frank. I'm not really bothered anymore. I'm sick of justifying myself on this site to people who have clearly been led to believe people on disability are all out there sky diving and playing golf. I'm sure it happens but it's the exception not the rule. As true Brit stated the amount of benefit fraud is minimal compared to other areas you choose to ignore as its not reported in the press. I'll always be able to live at home. I'm not going to justify myself anymore. I've enough on my plate right now.



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 04:51 AM
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a reply to: flammadraco

I do not think anyone would agree that the best thing to do about genuine benefit cheating, is nothing. I just think the government should clean up its own, far more costly act, remove the badly (read very deliberately) crafted contracts from their account sheets, have members of parliament who have helped hide or obfuscate their failure to deal with those over the years removed from public life by shaming, and install systems to deal with the private sector which rigidly prevent abuse at the top. By doing so this country will save a massive amount of money, far more than could ever be saved by going after benefit cheats.

At the end of the day, its about the bottom line, and to improve the bottom line for the taxpayer to the greatest possible degree, the work has to start and finish at the top, before it begins at the bottom. If an accountant were able to go over the entire books for the government, and look at what really costs the big money, the big money that need not be spent, the largest, most glaring, and most obvious waste, would not be the benefits system, and therefore any attempt to prioritise benefits cheating correction, over the prevention of abuse of taxpayer funds by private sector suppliers, has to be ideologically driven, rather than logically driven.

Don't get me wrong, I believe in fairness, I believe that people should behave with dignity and honour, and only take what they need, when they really need it. But I also believe in applying measures to the biggest problems first, and dealing with the small ones when the framework for a just, fair system has already been laid down. Until that big government corruption problem no longer exists, the goverment have no leg to stand on, to complain about the spare change at the bottom.



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 05:05 AM
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a reply to: woodwardjnr

Im not dissing you Woodward, if you are genuinely unwell, either physically or mentally then so be it, who am i or anyone else to judge. However that does not deviate from the fact that we have folk abusing the system. I did not even start talking about those on disability or incapacity benefit, my main concern are those on Jobseekers allowance who cant be bothered to get of their arse to find a job.


I'm sure it happens but it's the exception not the rule. As true Brit stated the amount of benefit fraud is minimal compared


I do not understand this logic, so because the amount of benefit fraud is minimal then we should not have to worry about it? We have £1.2 billion per annum lost in benefit fraud and yes I agree over £20 billion per annum on tax avoidance. However the main discussion here was benefits and austerity. What it seems you are saying is as the rich tax dodgers cost the country over £20 billion in tax avoidance, then its ok for folk to cheat the benefits system?

All these figures prove to me is as a tax payer, im being fuc56d over by benefits cheats at one end of the spectrum and fuc654d over by the rich at the other end of the spectrum and again its the working tax payer that has to subsidise both sides. How is this fair?

To finalise, i do not think £1.2 Billion a year is minimal one iota thats 1200 million pound per annum which costs £20 each year per person living in the UK.



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 05:14 AM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

Again I agree with your points, and yes we do need to start from the top down. I agree that our government waste a huge amount of money, our biggest issue is we are paying over £46 Billion per year on interest payments alone against our debt, and that's not even having any payment towards the capital loan.

We spend over £50 Billion a year in Foreign Aid, we give Money to the likes of India which can afford to fly to space but has starving people in its country. We send Aid to Nigeria despite it being an Oil Rich Nation. Yes I agree we have lots of issues with our government spending but that does not make it ok for those of us to cheat the system.

As I have said before, this is not the Governments Money (they have none) this is mine and yours Tax money being used.



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 05:29 AM
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a reply to: nonspecific

You can save a lot of money being time rich and money poor. learn to grow vegatable, learn to forage theres a lt of food available. For example i collect seaweed and put it in my bread.

Keep an eye on shop bins a lot of food is thrown away, it can be used if its in abundance preserve it or ferment it.
Buy food in bulk. If you dont have a lot of money do this over time even simple things like sale, pepper and herbs.
You can live cheaply on dried lentils and pulses. You dont even need to boil lots of them. Sprout them instead. Very nice in things like humous etc.

Buy things you need instead of want. Things that will help you save money in the future. I can make nice wine for under 20 pence a bottle. 25 pints of beer cost me a total of about £2.

Theres a lot around its relearning how to use it..

purp..



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 05:32 AM
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a reply to: flammadraco

no the system is not being abused in the ways you are saying. There is a conceted effort to villify the poor for the state of the economy. Thats rubbish where has the money gone its not in the hands of the poor. The rich have doulbed there weath in the UK in the last 10 years. Bankers and banks get massive government hand outs and the poor go without.

We live in one of the strongest economies in the world we need to look after our own..

purp..



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 05:46 AM
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originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: flammadraco

no the system is not being abused in the ways you are saying.



£1.2 Billion a year in benefits fraud is not abuse of the system!!


There is a conceted effort to villify the poor for the state of the economy.


Ive not seen a "Vilified" effort to do this. I see that folk are pissed off dealing with both ends of the spectrum screwing over the working tax payer.


The rich have doulbed there weath in the UK in the last 10 years.


So what, some of these folk are hard workers and provide jobs for our country. I know lots of millionaires who pay their fair share in tax and provide jobs for people. What would you like instead, a Communist Country?


We live in one of the strongest economies in the world we need to look after our own..


Totally agree, but it also means that those in need get help but those cheating the system either with Benefit Fraud or Tax Avoidance have the full force of the law used against them.

All i've seen on this thread is attack the rich support the poor, what about treating everyone with the same standards and those abusing the system are dealt with????

As a Tax Payer i'm really angry about the "Whole World Owes Me" mentality.

If you can work, then work end off!




edit on 20.5.2015 by flammadraco because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2015 @ 06:25 AM
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a reply to: flammadraco your not dissing me. I just have a bad habit of taking these types of threads personally. So I apologise to the op too. I should just avoid them. I know the thread was well intentioned, and I let my sensitivity get the better of me. I should just go and meditate instead. A much more valuable use of my time. So accept my apologies I'm a little stressed at the moment




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