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Boy shoots through window, kills friend trying to wake him

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posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:07 PM
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a reply to: WarminIndy

I never said it was right or wrong. But it happens all the time.




posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:09 PM
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a reply to: WarminIndy

All of those things, naturally, being capital offenses.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:11 PM
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I am almost willing to bet his friends don't normally come over in the night to visit because in that case I would think he would suspect it is his friends and no be so scared.

If it turns out it has happened often in the past then that puts a twist into the whole affair.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:22 PM
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a reply to: spirit_horse

Wonderful!!! You Summed Up What I Summed Up.lol



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:32 PM
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originally posted by: Monger
a reply to: NavyDoc

I don't know that I'd classify you as a gun nut, using my personal definition. Just because one owns multiple guns, are a member of the NRA and really, really like said guns doesn't necessarily make one a gun nut in my book. There's a certain unhinged quality that comes with that distinction that I've never seen in your posts.

For the record, I noted and starred your posts as I was reading through the thread. I was really only referring to a few individuals, I'll admit that I could have been clearer. I am often guilty of making sweeping generalizations and aim to keep that tendency in check, but it gets the best of me from time to time.


Fair enough.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 02:34 PM
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originally posted by: WarminIndy
a reply to: NavyDoc

It's strange, on one hand there are people on this thread who are saying "boys will be boys", to defend the kids who were creeping in the middle of the night.

But on the other hand say "boys can't be boys" if they are doing what boys do.

If teenage boys are going to do stupid stuff, then the creeping up to the window was just plain stupid.

Responsible kids aren't creeping at 2:30 AM, and I am sure that if you are a parent of boys, you just wouldn't let them go out creeping at 2:30 AM.

Responsible parents raise responsible kids.

They could not have been up to doing charity work at 2:30 AM or delivering newspapers that early.



All of which is possible but still doesn't justify blindly shooting out a window.
edit on 19-5-2015 by NavyDoc because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 03:25 PM
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That info about firearms in vehicles is wrong for Texas.

edit:

In case someone is interested.


Sec. 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:

(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or

(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle or watercraft that is owned by the person or under the person's control.

(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun in a motor vehicle or watercraft that is owned by the person or under the person's control at any time in which:

(1) the handgun is in plain view; or

(2) the person is:

(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance regulating traffic or boating;

(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm; or

(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as defined by Section 71.01.



A handgun cannot be in plain view, that's all.
There is nothing about loaded/unloaded.
Long guns can be in plain view.
edit on 5/19/2015 by roadgravel because: (no reason given)

edit on 5/19/2015 by roadgravel because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 03:42 PM
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originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: WarminIndy
a reply to: NavyDoc

It's strange, on one hand there are people on this thread who are saying "boys will be boys", to defend the kids who were creeping in the middle of the night.

But on the other hand say "boys can't be boys" if they are doing what boys do.

If teenage boys are going to do stupid stuff, then the creeping up to the window was just plain stupid.

Responsible kids aren't creeping at 2:30 AM, and I am sure that if you are a parent of boys, you just wouldn't let them go out creeping at 2:30 AM.

Responsible parents raise responsible kids.

They could not have been up to doing charity work at 2:30 AM or delivering newspapers that early.



All of which is possible but still doesn't justify blindly shooting out a window.


It is a terrible tragedy, I agree.

But we don't know why he had a gun, we don't know how his home life was and we don't know what he was thinking. But coming out of sleep, he could have been prone to some kind of sleep disorder and couldn't think rationally.

If people can get up in their sleep and take their clothes off and walk naked without even knowing it, then who knows what can happen?

I have a sleep disorder myself, I can fully understand if that might be the case. But I am not going to assume he had a sleep disorder.

Let me tell you about my sleep disorder. When I am very tired or having a lucid dream, I can actually feel my body physically doing what I am dreaming about, and I have to convince myself in my sleep that I am dreaming and to lie back down.

I have tried to perform my job at time, in a dream, and was trying to put my shoes on, while I was asleep.

Acting out dreams when asleep


REM sleep behavior disorder (RBD) can be very dangerous to the people who have it as well as injure those who share a bed with them. When Patricia Becker noticed a man crouching in the corner while she was in a public restroom, she felt threatened and concerned. In an act of self-defense, she decided to jump on him. That's when she woke up – alone in her bedroom, bloody and bruised. Becker suffers from REM sleep behavior disorder (RBD), a condition that causes a person to unconsciously act out their dreams while still asleep. During her dream, she physically jumped out of bed and landed on a bedside table knocking out multiple teeth and sustaining numerous physical injuries. To help patients like Becker, Northwestern Medicine offers a specialized RBD clinic that integrates clinical care with research and education for medical professionals.


From what I read, the boy was asleep, most likely in REM, and being startled awake, disrupted the REM stage and seeing faces, probably did not distinguish them as his friends.

This isn't the first time an event like this has happened. The tragedy is that this kid shot his friends.

Violent behaviors in sleep



Violent behaviors during sleep (VBS) refer to a broad range of behaviors ranging from simple dream enactment to complex behaviors that may have serious or even lethal consequences. The behaviors can be directed to oneself, other individuals or to objects. The common denominator is that the violent sleeper is unaware of his/her actions and has complete amnesia of the episode upon awakening. From 1900 to 2000, nearly 140 cases of VBS with forensic implications (homicides, non-fatal assaults and sexual misconducts) were described in the scientific literature


Just because he got the gun does not mean he was fully awake, it could have been a reaction to being startled in his sleep. Which apparently is what happened. He was startled out of REM and while his mind was still in that state, his body reacted because he didn't perceive the faces as his friends.

Until they find out why, let's not just assume he did it with intent or forethought.

I have never acted out in a violent manner in my sleep, but I have actually thought I was awake while I was dreaming and acted out my job.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 04:18 PM
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originally posted by: johnwick

originally posted by: Dr1Akula

originally posted by: johnwick

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: bobbypurify
a reply to: PhoenixOD

Accidents do happen. Sounds to be one. I doubt he meant to shoot his friend in the head.

"Home defense at its finest"

What's this supposed to mean? Some snide remark at citizenry being able to keep guns at the home?

Why can't accidents happen and everyone just leave it at that? Why does it incite everyone's opinion and blame? People die, we can't cure that. Accidents happen too.

Wake me up when guns start going off by themselves and killing people.


So I guess you fully agree with handing 15 year olds loaded weapons to keep in their rooms? As long as nobody tries to take your guns right??



Yes, why not?

Do you cut you 15 year olds steak for them?

You mean you would hand a 15 year old a knife that could kill someone???

Oh my god, are you crazy!!!?

Sarcasm off.


I guess having to deal with a driven-crazy 15 year old with a knife is much easier than a firearm pistol with 19rounds

and in this case a knife wouldn't have shot dead his friend from that distance!

Your logic and the people who share it, are the instigates that allow gun ''accidents'' to happen.


Yes of course, this is my fault now.....


We get you are scared of inanimate objects.

I'm sure this phobia is treatable, most phobias are.

Stop jump to conclusions and rushing to assign blame.

Anti gunners always do this as soon as the words guns and accident are placed together.

You refuse to reserve judgement until you have the facts.

Instead the only facts you care about are"gun".

This makes you an automatic expert witness, and demand we allow you ta pass judgement immediately.

Its pretty idiotic honestly.

a reply to: johnwick

I respect your opinion but this is mine;

I am not really an anti-gunner since I was in the army, I go hunting and I love my guns,

I've learned to respect weapons, that's why I think giving a firearm to a minor -
(I don't care how mature the underage or his father think he is)-
is a crime.

I believe guns should only be used for home defense and hunting by adults with a license, nothing else...

edit on TueTue, 19 May 2015 16:22:26 -05001PMkuTuesdaypm by Dr1Akula because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 04:28 PM
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Here is a simple example...from adults...who get spooked...

link

There are too many variables here. Now, going off on a tangent, the only 'teens' I knew growing up who had guns parents may not know about were dealing. I would like to know what was found during a search of his room/house. If I woke up and someone was at my window, not inside, I would be addressing them or calling for help...before firing.

The key factor here is FEAR and why this kid was so afraid. If they had crawled in his room or broke in, tough sh@t, but this to me is odd. Maybe the kid shot was the target? Has anyone thought about that? A 'friend' who gets a kid to sleep over, goes to someone else's house and HE gets shot? You had 2 12y/o girls who stabeed another based on Slenderman so don't give me the kids are innocent argument.

My gut tells me set up or drugs...



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 05:34 PM
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originally posted by: matafuchs
Here is a simple example...from adults...who get spooked...

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There are too many variables here. Now, going off on a tangent, the only 'teens' I knew growing up who had guns parents may not know about were dealing. I would like to know what was found during a search of his room/house. If I woke up and someone was at my window, not inside, I would be addressing them or calling for help...before firing.

The key factor here is FEAR and why this kid was so afraid. If they had crawled in his room or broke in, tough sh@t, but this to me is odd. Maybe the kid shot was the target? Has anyone thought about that? A 'friend' who gets a kid to sleep over, goes to someone else's house and HE gets shot? You had 2 12y/o girls who stabeed another based on Slenderman so don't give me the kids are innocent argument.

My gut tells me set up or drugs...


According to the article about MacKeon Schulte, he was like any other average kid. He liked Call of Duty and to make him even more childlike and innocent, the article states he also likes M&Ms.

The other friend so far hasn't said why they were out at 2:30 AM.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 05:44 PM
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Call of Duty


I figured that was going to pop up before it was over. Wonder if he played it before bed.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 05:59 PM
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originally posted by: roadgravel

Call of Duty


I figured that was going to pop up before it was over. Wonder if he played it before bed.


I don't know much about the game.

I just put it there because it seems to be something kids his age do.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 08:00 PM
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originally posted by: bobbypurify
a reply to: PhoenixOD

Accidents do happen. Sounds to be one. I doubt he meant to shoot his friend in the head.

"Home defense at its finest"

What's this supposed to mean? Some snide remark at citizenry being able to keep guns at the home?

Why can't accidents happen and everyone just leave it at that? Why does it incite everyone's opinion and blame? People die, we can't cure that. Accidents happen too.

Wake me up when guns start going off by themselves and killing people.

Someone was throwing rocks at his window, the kid doesn't know who it is, he consciously grabs his gun, aims, and kills one of the people outside of his window. He meant to shoot and he intended to kill. if he didn't have such easy access to a gun, maybe he wouldn't have reacted in such an idiotic way?

What's the sole purpose of a gun? To kill. There is no other purpose for guns in society. We don't use guns in the kitchen, people don't leave to work, come back home and say "oops forgot my glock for work!"

the only intent of guns is to harm, plain and simple. And whether this was an "accident" or not, this young guy's life was taken in brutal fashion.

You can't just ignore the blatant use of irresponsibility with a gun (which seems to happen A LOT btw) because you have an undying affinity for firearms.
edit on 19-5-2015 by alienmma because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 08:29 PM
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a reply to: alienmma

100% agree

Also minors should not have access to firearms, under no circumstances... it is illegal and there is a good reason for it

Responsible parents should never even demonstrate their guns to children.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 08:51 PM
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originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: bobbypurify
a reply to: PhoenixOD

Accidents do happen. Sounds to be one. I doubt he meant to shoot his friend in the head.

"Home defense at its finest"

What's this supposed to mean? Some snide remark at citizenry being able to keep guns at the home?

Why can't accidents happen and everyone just leave it at that? Why does it incite everyone's opinion and blame? People die, we can't cure that. Accidents happen too.

Wake me up when guns start going off by themselves and killing people.


I generally agree with your points, however, a 15 year old with a firearm that shoots through a window at a noise isn't an accident, it's a "negligent."

Negligent on the part of the parents that obviously didn't teach him correctly and permitted access to a firearm without said proper teaching.

Negligent on the part of the boy who shot at an unknown target just because he heard a noise. I knew better at 15 and I knew the proper rules of gun handling.




Who the hell are you to judge how a parent raises their own kids? Why is this such an alien #ing concept to Libs and Anti-Gunners? Leave other people's kids ALONE. You don't see me trying to teach your kid how to quick draw a pistol and double tap, why are you trying to teach my kid that guns are bad? IT IS MY CHOICE AS A PARENT TO DECIDE WHAT I WANT MY CHILD TO LEARN AND HOW TO LEARN IT!!

This wasn't an accidental discharge of a firearm where a kid playing around with a gun accidentally killed his friend. This kid more than likely knows more about guns than you or any other Anti-Gunner on here and how to respect and operate them. By the sounds of it, he thought someone was attempting to break in and used LEGAL FORCE to protect himself.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 08:58 PM
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a reply to: bobbypurify

Only in America do we get countless cases of either citizens shooting other citizens or cops shooting citizens.

Give a bunch of dumb people the means to kill each other and they will.

And if the poster did want to have a dig at gun ownership he has the right to. Just like you people (who shouldnt have guns because you are all too irresponsible - 28th in the education rankings worldwide) have the right to have guns.....for the moment...until that day comes where the UN and the police massacre all those who wont give them up.

You all give up EVERY one of your other rights without a fuss...but want your gun rights yet are too afraid to use them for the purpose stated in the constitution....too damn afraid to fight back against oppressors who have guns too. Easier to kill your fellow citizen.

But what do I know....I currently enjoy having my guns while I can.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 08:58 PM
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originally posted by: Dr1Akula
a reply to: alienmma

100% agree

Also minors should not have access to firearms, under no circumstances... it is illegal and there is a good reason for it

Responsible parents should never even demonstrate their guns to children.



To bad it's not illegal in the state of Montana huh?

How about I tell you how to raise your kids?

All responsible parents should physically discipline their kids.

You see how ridiculous it sounds for me to tell you how to raise your kids?

That is exactly what you sound like.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 08:59 PM
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Montana


45-3-103. Use of force in defense of occupied structure. (1) A person is justified in the use of force or threat to use force against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that the use of force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person's unlawful entry into or attack upon an occupied structure.
(2) A person justified in the use of force pursuant to subsection (1) is justified in the use of force likely to cause death or serious bodily harm only if:
(a) the entry is made or attempted and the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent an assault upon the person or another then in the occupied structure;
or
(b) the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent the commission of a forcible felony in the occupied structure.


I suppose it depends if looking in a window is attempted entry.



posted on May, 19 2015 @ 09:08 PM
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originally posted by: roadgravel
Montana


45-3-103. Use of force in defense of occupied structure. (1) A person is justified in the use of force or threat to use force against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that the use of force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person's unlawful entry into or attack upon an occupied structure.
(2) A person justified in the use of force pursuant to subsection (1) is justified in the use of force likely to cause death or serious bodily harm only if:
(a) the entry is made or attempted and the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent an assault upon the person or another then in the occupied structure;
or
(b) the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent the commission of a forcible felony in the occupied structure.


I suppose it depends if looking in a window is attempted entry.



Knocking on a window might possibly be construed. As in, knocking on a window to see if you hear anything. Don't hear anything? Let's kick it in!



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