Call it 'gender fluidity': Schools to teach kids there's no such thing as boys or girls

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Cuervo

Just as soon as you're ready to see a therapist, alienate yourself from most of the people you know, balance your hormones, buy a decent wardrobe, go through months of electrolysis or laser, flip your junk inside out, and then present yourself for the world to harass.

Totally worth getting a peek at a woman peeing, right?!

You are being very insensitive defining what I need to be like.

I admit, you had me choke on my coffee there.

Touche.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Can you see boys taking therapy for a while, dressing up like women, trying to change their bodies and risking ridicule just to take a peek in girl's bathroom which they won't see anything in the first place!

edit - aah from the post above me I saw what you did there. Never mind. Moving on lol.

originally posted by: ketsuko
No one has yet addressed this:I have also seen people, like myself, worried that in order to make one person feel better about themselves, we make everyone else uncomfortable. I'm not worried about the transgender girl being a predator so much as I'm upset that all the other adolescent girls who are already uncomfortable enough with their bodies will now be having to expose themselves to what looks like an adolescent boy, too. Doesn't matter what you tell them; it matters what they see.

So you make the majority feel as bad as the transgender did in accommodating the transgender.

Have private bathrooms...or have a sign that can be switched as to who is in the bathroom at the time. It seems the old gender models are antiquated so maybe the old "Boys" Girls" room is antiquated too. Or do like other not so stiff countries do and just save money with unisex bathrooms.

Now there is an idea

a reply to: khnum

By the same token do you really want your kids to go to school with Frankenfurter and Carmen Miranda lookalikes

My children went to school with wheelchair bound classmates or of different cultural or racial backgrounds. They turned out to fine individuals that could see through the "us and them" agenda. Perhaps you would like to clarify about Frankenfurter because I'm not getting your point? Thanks

This bathroom and locker thing reminds me of that classic movie "Just One of the Guys" www.imdb.com...

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Xtrozero

Can you see boys taking therapy for a while, dressing up like women, trying to change their bodies and risking ridicule just to take a peek in girl's bathroom which they won't see anything in the first place!

edit - aah from the post above me I saw what you did there. Never mind. Moving on lol.

I call that a steep learning curve...

a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

What I should of said is rather than concern very young children whether they are a male in a female body or vice versa or some percentage thereof wouldn't A to Z and 1 to 10 be something better to teach them?

a reply to: khnum
Right. Teach them nothing about sexuality because we all know that's the parent's job and they generally do an excellent job of it.


Again, to be clear: sarcasm.

But, it should be pointed out once again, that the article in the OP is made up.

originally posted by: honested3
Hi ATS,

I am a transwoman speaking on behalf of something that seems to confuse some of you. Nobody is 100% of any gender, it is a sliding scale. Don't believe me then just look around you. If gender was a binary (aka the gender binary) then all boys and girls would literally act the same, have you never seen or heard of a tomboy or a flamboyant man?

Gender is a social construct, gender isn't what is between your legs but what is between your ears. I think the "craziness" you are all seeing is you are confusing gender with genitalia. Yes the majority of people are assigned male or female genitalia at birth (we wont even dive into intersex people because your minds would explode) But if you think that is all that defines gender that you are ultimately wrong.

What they are teaching is wonderful, it shows that it is totally fine to be a tomboy who identifies as female, or a tomboy who identifies as male. It also says if you are a flamboyant but identify as male or female that is also totally fine. I know this concept is confusing and probably scary to many of you folks but it is only another part of Humanity. I for one know that I would have been spared a lot of pain and humilation if the schools I went to taught these things

A bit of science: Did you know all fetuses begin as female, it is when they receive or do not receive the Y chromosome that they continue on with their assigned sex. In some cases the brain may remain XX but the body becomes XY and vice versa, you are then transgender! Genderfluid takes it even further by saying you don't have to pick a certain gender and stay there, you can identify as male today or female tomorrow, and even androgynous later on. Most people laugh at this and make jokes about identifying as a dog or giraffe etc, but may I remind you these conditions are real.

Yesterday homoesexuality was considered insanity and unnatural, today it is the same with transgenderism. So please keep in mind Transgender people are in fact people and have feelings and thoughts just like you, hearing that we are insane or that we have some hidden agenda is both ignorant and bigoted.

What would you rather have? Children being taught that its not just a gender binary and overall being more welcoming of others and allowing them to express themselves without fear of being labeled as sub-human (like most transgender folks are) Or would you rather they be taught the binary that many of you think you fit into? Its open mindeness and tolerance versus bigotry and ignorance. How is this even up for debate?

No. I support your rights and needs 100%, but I feel like you are projecting your needs onto others. If kids come to question their gender fluidity naturally I won't stop them, I'm even fine with having groups available to support anyone who feels that way. I couldn't care less if someone identifies as transgender, but I'm grateful that my teachers didn't introduce this stuff into my head as a kid. I'm bisexual, but my gender is not something I ever felt conflicted about, it never burdened me, it just naturally fell into place.

I'm grateful for that. I don't like the idea of kids doing back flips through hoops to figure out what gender they are. In my opinion you'd be sentencing them to experience the same feelings of confusion you may have experienced in your youth. You may have good intentions, but the struggle you went through isn't the same for everyone. Your relation to gender is nowhere near universal.

You say that gender is a social construct, as if to dismiss it, while also believing it's ok to make kids consider far more convoluted genders that are much more deeply constructed. Two spirited, Non-binary, multi-dimensional genders are ok to identify as personally, but you can't expect anyone to know you are a Two spirited- Non-binary-Multidimensional gender, and treat you accordingly.

What is the goal of it? if it's helping people accept themselves, I'm not sure this is the best way. I see much more unnecessary confusion in the future if this approach sticks.

a reply to: Unity_99

So, asking for understanding & education, including but not limited to a ridiculed class of people is now sick?
Ok, two can play at that game. Assuming you're a woman, man up already. Stop being so 1950's pearl-clutchy, honey, or just get back to the kitchen where you belong. After all, no one needs to have an adequate understanding of people different than them, no matter their gender, so why should you be treated fairly as a lowly stock female anyway? Who cares, no one should have to understand you're not just a sandwich-making baby machine ready to hop straight in bed with the Man of The House at 5:30. Am I right here? If you can justify subjugating a minority class because of who they are, I & everyone else can subjugate you, too.

a reply to: DYepes

Yet another person that has the belief that this wrong founded in religion but wants science to prove that it isn't "perverted'.
What science and facts shows that it doesn't happen?

a reply to: Xtrozero

One would think this would be the answer - a bathroom and shower facility for a single use since it's unlikely you are going to have more than one transgender at a time needing to use it.

But, the simple commonsense approach doesn't achieve the social engineering they want.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: DYepes

Yet another person that has the belief that this wrong founded in religion but wants science to prove that it isn't "perverted'.
What science and facts shows that it doesn't happen?

Yes. Trivializing suicide is so very Christian of him, isn't it? Makes me want to hear even more of the "good news".

a reply to: DYepes

Wow, I'm from Tampa, too. Where are these "trannies" you claim are overrunning the area? I never saw them in large numbers by any means in all the years I lived there. Stop blowing the population out of proportion to make a point, it's disingenuous.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Xtrozero

One would think this would be the answer - a bathroom and shower facility for a single use since it's unlikely you are going to have more than one transgender at a time needing to use it.

But, the simple commonsense approach doesn't achieve the social engineering they want.

I think we need to separate the bathroom and shower issues as they can't be treated the same. For restrooms, I reluctantly support people using the restroom they need to use (reticent only because there's no perfect answer to fit everybody at every stage of transition) but showers are different.

I'm against penises flopping around in the women's locker room. It's not even a transgender issue in my opinion; it's a genitalia issue. Many women have been sexually assaulted or abused as children and the sight of a phallus can be quite triggering. It's not important enough to fight for. If a pre-op transwoman needs to shower, she can wait until she gets home (I don't shower at the gym, either).

If I'm uncomfortable looking at what's between my legs, I'm not about to go flash it to a bunch of ladies who may react the same way. Why the hell would I do that?

That's one fight I just don't think is worth the trouble nor the damage it would cause. A lot of folks in the transgender community vehemently disagree with me on this but many feel the same way I do.

originally posted by: Unity_99
a reply to: honested3

You are a woman if you were born with xx genetics. There are a few exceptions such as children who were gender switched due to birth defects, but even that is hard to pull off with the children in the program I watched, it was clearly the wrong approach. Pretty messe dup kid that ended up committing suicide. Some individuals are homosexual or bisexual. But they're still the xx or xy at birth.

But what establishes your desires as a boy or girl? It is a lot more complex than just to suggest XX XY. My parents akso didn't teach me to be a boy or to like girls, or that the physical act of two men together is rather repulsive to me. Every person I know gay or straight experienced gender association long before they hit puberty. Now social norms may drive these people down a path that is not their true nature, but sooner or later their true nature comes out, or they typically develop other mental health side-effects.

People who think that there is something like gender fluidity I find as a rather ignorant thought though. I say there are two genders but with many mental and physical combinations...

a reply to: DYepes

Civilian-lead tyranny is best described as how you act here: "I hate you for what you are, you deserve nothing, die already!" THAT is much more harmful to a society than you having to buck up & explain to your kid that people are different. People like you have perverted the hell out of common decency & respect to the point where it's almost unrecognizable anymore. Congratulations on wrecking the country in the long run because you don't like a minority class that has no impact on your own existence on this rock.